Leaderboard

I blame it on time spent with relatives over the holiday season, plus crappy weather ='s grumpy people. More noticeable over on AK of late than here. I would recommend to increase the use of emoticons when joking or using sarcasm, as it is hard to hear the tenor of one's voice on the internet.

I'm noticing a trend in posts lately. Lots of snark, very little humor, and people seem tightly wound. Are people spending too much time on other forums such as AK, Audiogon, etc? I expect to see such behavior on such places, but around here I've always felt that wit, sarcasm, and a healthy thread jacking were characteristics that made this place special.

I first replaced my AAs because they were old. Then I tried BEC's A4500 on a whim. It was an improvement to my ears. Time #1, cause they needed to be replaced. Time #2, because I could.

id look for used on craigslist. The only speakers i have bought new was my ICON W setup and that was all like half off from newegg. All the other speaker gear in my signature has been bought used. The good thing is that if you buy right, you can dump them at break-even or profit if you don't like them or your needs change. We are a good sounding board for pricing if you need suggestions. Def tech makes good speakers! I have never been a fan of "the sock" over the speakers but they make some pretty bang up hardware!

thewillienelson, You still haven't stated a budget you want to spend on speakers yet... Have you considered buying used so that you can get better speakers for the money you have to spend, AND, are you open to starting with just two speakers (depending on your budget) if it will get you a lot better sound than the surround setups you are looking at??? Roger About $800 just for speakers and sub. Without wiring or anything else. Assume that I get 50% off to make that amount seem reasonable. Thanks, Nelson Hi Nelson! It is just my opinion, but I think you would be a lot happier with the sound if you got some heresyes used about $400, or some Forte IIs about $600 used, or some RF-5s used about $500. These are all speakers that were never offered at any of the big chain stores that will give you a lot better sound for your money that you can build a home theatre system that will be killer around. I highly suggest that if you are willing, you look these speakers up to see what you might like, then ask here on the forum for assistance in listening to what these models are capable of. As long as you don't mind driving, there are many on this forum that will allow you into there homes so you can listen for yourself, then you can truly make an informed decision on what is best for you. We really do want to try to help you make the best descission for yourself!! Good luck.... Roger

x

thewillienelson, You still haven't stated a budget you want to spend on speakers yet... Have you considered buying used so that you can get better speakers for the money you have to spend, AND, are you open to starting with just two speakers (depending on your budget) if it will get you a lot better sound than the surround setups you are looking at??? Roger

When you get the Roadshow versions, send me your B2s. If you cover the shipping, I will upgrade them for free. Great post BTW. You didn't bust my chops and I totally understand where you're coming from.

I like the suggestions of starting with less speakers. Most apartments are not large enough to benefit from an 9.x setup. The used market may allow you to get a Reference set near the same price as the Icon's. I still have my front ported VF 35's and like the sound. I had a 9.x Icon system which was great with movies but, not with music compared to the Reference system

Great idea to me! Started doing just that in April 2013; now I have 5 Heresy, a pair of La Scala, & various other Klipsch speakers for 2 systems. To the Original Poster: if you haven't, start checking your local Craig's List. Are you referring to my post? The Heresy is a good speaker and can be had for around $400 a pair used(depending on your location)... This would allow the TS to start with a nice pair of speakers for a little cash and then buy more as his funding allowed.

Are you referring to my post? The Heresy is a good speaker and can be had for around $400 a pair used(depending on your location)... This would allow the TS to start with a nice pair of speakers for a little cash and then buy more as his funding allowed.

You guys are all dumb. (you can't say I don't contribute)

Denial is the first stage.

Looks like you have Youthman disease.

Why not buy used Heresy speakers? Then you can buy more as you see a deal on them.

The interpretation of the physics does change over time though.... There are several reasons why a speaker far away from boundaries can offer much better imaging: and it has everything to do with understanding the relationship of direct and indirect sound, and maximizing the density of the semi-reverberant sound field. The crew at Syn Aud Con have explored this quite a bit - I had their papers at one point, but can't seem to find them again. And then there's RPG Inc who has all sorts of great research on the subject available for free: http://www.rpginc.com/Technology.cfm I would recommend this one in particular as it hits on a lot of the variables at play (none of which I've ever seen PWK discuss): http://www.rpginc.com/docs%5CTechnology%5CWhite%20Papers%5CMinimizing%20Acoustical%20Distortion%20in%20Project%20Studios.pdf This is another good one: Page 50 starts what I believe is the most cutting edge for acoustic treatment: http://www.rpginc.com/docs%5CTechnology%5CPresentations%5CMedia%20Room%20Design.pdf A good summary of the history starts on page 35.

I don't think I ever heard true imaging before I spread my La Scala out and toed them in like KHorns, with one of them in a corner. I get the same imaging with speakers disappearing from the room with KHorns. So for me they image better than a quality speaker positioned out in the room.

Wow!!! I have to put this speech right up there with two of the classic speeches of all time...... The Otter defense when the Deltas were on trial http://youtu.be/ROxvT8KKdFw Bluto's motivational speech to his Delta house brothers after the conviction of the Deltas http://youtu.be/ep-xgd_eETE Myself, I may see myself selling off less important items to fund new and intriguing items; however, in general I don't expect to downgrade, but I do figure at some point, while some of the gear may interest relatives and friends, I expect that an estate picker will end up stumbling upon my gear after I'm gone and recycle it for the next generation....

Oh, c'mon Dean, don't let the bastards get you down (or into your head). There are always going to be naysayers and the socially inept; it comes with the territory. Likely envy, petty jealousy, etc. Dude, ya got a LOT of fans out here, many of whom are polite and therefore silent. You have contributed alot to this forum and you are one of the posters i always look forward to reading, even though most of the technical stuff goes over my head. Shake it off. The sun came up today, and it will tomorrow too, and the next day . . . . . . .

You have 4x the radiating area with a 2" driver so you're going to have 6dB less IMD for the same bandwidth. Now if you reduce the bandwidth for the 1" driver by an octave, then I think you're looking at the same IMD? The first breakup modes for the 2" driver are going to be an octave lower than the 1" unless you make the diaphragm thicker - thicker diaphragm, larger voice coil, more moving mass - it basically offsets the efficiency gains you would expect from the larger diaphragm and now you've got more inductance...or you keep the efficiency up and let it ring a bit more. The advantage of the 1" is that you'll have less inductance and less mass so you need less CD EQ up top. Power handling and thermal linearities usually aren't issues in the home environment (or at least shouldn't be), so it all really comes down to the doppler effect on the diaphragm motion - or the intended bandwidth. I personally prefer the sound of IMD over the sound of metallic ringing, but it's definitely an intentional tradeoff. I'm sure as my hearing declines with time that I'll probably start swinging back the other way - but right now breakup modes in the 10-15kHz region make cymbals sound unrealistic to me. I would argue though that it makes more sense to have an unfolded horn that covers the 80Hz to 1kHz bandwidth and then add a subwoofer, rather than try to cover 40Hz to 500Hz with a folded horn and run no subwoofer...but then you're not looking at a Jub LF anymore, and then a higher xover frequency makes the 2" less interesting than a 1" in my opinion. Maybe one of these days I'll actually get around to building one and then we can have some blind shootouts [H]