jbsl
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Posts posted by jbsl
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I have the RSW 12 and La Scalas but use the 12 mainly when watching movies in HT system. The main reason I do this is for my neighbors and to keep the peace. When I have used them together I turn the bass down on the side of the 12 and turn on the music using just the LS and slowly turn up the 12 bass volume until the 12 starts to go lower than the LS's and that is about as far as I use the 12 with the LS. I usually don't go very much lower than the LS's bass with the sub because most of the music I listen to does not have bass that requires me to. I listen mainly to rock, jazz, and am just now starting to get into classical but I can tell that I will never buy a lot of it. So I don't need the 12 with my LS that often because to me the bass gets to boomy and it should be fast and tight and hit you in the chest. Now if you listen to a lot of classical then it should help with the low bass
I have the Denon 2900 which plays both SACDs and DVD audio. Since it is a dvd player I think the SACD decoder is not a very good one. Every SACD I have bought sounds terrible to me and if I hooked up a true SACD player they would sound better. On regular DVD audio discs a few sound better but not by much. On DVD audio discs that at the top say "dts international music experience"(the Les Brown and his band of renown, session #55 is very good) for me have had the best sound between SACDs and DVD audio and in this case using the 12 with the LS sound fantastic. My cd player is a NAD C542 which has HDCD decoder and on 90% of HDCDs I have bought they sound better than DVD audio discs or SACDs. HDCDs will probably not be around in 5 years so I am trying to find as many as I can now. Well sorry got off on another subject.
Xman
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Two months ago I purchased a Cayin TA 30 and ran it with a pair of SB3's with a NAD C540 cd player in my bedroom and I have never heard my SB3's sound so good! I had a friend who heard my KLF 20's and went to Best Buy to buy Klipsch and did not like the sound of the Synergy series. I did not like the sound either because they were using $300 A/V receivers. My advice to anyone with Synergy Series speakers get tube preamps, amps or integrated amps!!!
Which brings me to my current ongoing problem this bug I was infected with in Nov 2003, THE UPGRADE BUG!!!. When I hooked the Cayin TA 30 up to my 2004 La Scalas they sounded better than the solid state stuff but the LS still did not sound as good as I have heard them before. So I used my Denon 4800 A/V receiver as a preamp with TA 30 as the amp and bought a NAD C542 CD player and the sound quality went up another notch. I was suprised that the Denon would improve the sound that much but when I was using the Denon with the SM 70 pros monoblock amps it also had a great sound with my KLF 20s. Even though the Denon is SS it has a very good sound with Klipsch speakers IMHO. The better quality speakers used with the TA 30 the harder the preamp in the TA 30 has to work and with LS it does a okay job but does not bring out the best from the LS. Also the LS have not had a good chance to brake in yet since I got them begining of April. With the SB3s they sounded fantastic with the TA 30!! I'm now using a 1983 Luxman C300 preamp with a Monarchy Audio SM 70 pro 35 watt stereo amp and a NAD C540 cd player with the SB3s and they sound fantastic in this set up also. For all those people who bad mouth the Synergy series listen to them with very good componets and they may not sound like Heritage or Refernce but I was shocked at how good they sound now.
So now of course I'm looking for a really good tube preamp to go with the TA 30 to take the LS to the next level and then the bug will bite again and I will upgrade to a tube amp.
So my question for Erik is for a extreme beginer, never used a sautering iron or any other tools used to make a preamp how hard would it be for me to build the Transcendent Sound preamp and amp you and dubai2000 Freak are talking about? Also do you think the 24 step attenuator with or without the pc board would also be worth installing in the amp?
Xman
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I have had my Cayin TA 30 for almost 2 months now and it is my first tube integrated amp. Before I used 2 Monarchy Audio SM 70 pros that sounded very good but the TA 30 has a fuller, smoother sound to it and the bass is better also. With the SM 70 pros you could hear more details but the midrange and bass was a bit more subdued. With my KLF 20s the SM 70 pros sounded better than on my La Scalas but the TA 30 sounds better on both types of speakers.
In a year or two I will be ready to buy a tube preamp and amps which will take me to the next level in quality tube sound. I cannot comment on the vintage amp but if anyone lives near Austin, TX and wants to do a comparison between a vintage and new integrated amp then send me a email. There is one amp, Dh200 Hafler with 100 watts that my friend used with La Scalas that sounded very good to me. The sound was very good not as warm as a tube amp but close I see them on Ebay so I may have to buy one just to try it. One thing I will admit is I don't think I will be going back to SS amps anytime soon. Also I have been using the TA 30 running the LS in my home theater system and it has sounded great!
Xman
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This is the same post I put under the title of amps.
I own 1 Monarachy Audio SM 70 running my center channel at 70 watts and 2 SM 70 Pros each 80 watts that were running my KLF 20s and it was a very good match! For home theater I used a Denon 4800 and the Monarchy amps blew away the internal Denon amps these are very good amps for home theater. For 2 channel I use a Luxman C300 preamp and and a NAD C540 CD player it also is a very good match. I paid $1400 for both SM 70 Pros bought directly from Monarchy Audio. For the price and performance you get from these amps it is a very good deal and I highly recommend these amps.
As of mid March I purchased a Cayin TA 30 integrated amp 35 watts push pull or you can pull out 2 tubes and run it SE at 4 watts. I just ran it with 2 tubes for the first time and I think I like it with 4 tubes better the bass is tighter and more defined and the midrange sounds fuller to me. I also finaly got my 2004 La Scalas at the beginging of April and I'm using the TA 30 to burn in the La Scalas. Since I live close to my neighbors I can not very often really crank it up so it will take some time for the LS to burn in. Once they have burned in I will do a comparision between the Cayin TA 30 and the 2 Monarchy Audio SM 70 pros 80 watts each. From the quality sound I had with the 2 SM 70 Pros with the KLF 20s they should match very good with the La Scalas.
The KLF 20s in a living room my size, 16X16X8, sound just as good as the La Scalas do. There are some factors behind that. First the La Scalas have not burned in yet and the 20s had to do the same thing back in 2001. The KLF 20s midrange and tweeter horns are at ear level and the LS mid and high horns are right below my chin and I did notice a difference in the soundstage, not a huge difference but a very slight one. I'm thinking about making some wooden lifts for the LS and then do the sand bag tweak that Colin recommended .
In a larger room say 20X25X10 the LS would have more room to work their magic but in small living room they can overpower very easy. Another thing about having La Scalas in a small living room is the midrange horn is very strong and in your face but by the time I turn the volume up to that point it is louder than I listen at!! That is one big difference between the KLF 20s and the LS. The midrange on the LS can be over powering on some songs when turning up the volume but on the 20s it sounded just right in my living room. Once the LS have burned in I'll do the comparision between the tube amp and the SS amp and which ever one is second will go to my bedroom set up. I'll make a post once the speakers burn in.
Xman
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I own 1 Monarachy Audio SM 70 running my center channel at 70 watts and 2 SM 70 Pros each 80 watts that were running my KLF 20s and it was a very good match! For home theater I used a Denon 4800 and the Monarchy amps blew away the internal Denon amps these are very good amps for home theater. For 2 channel I use a Luxman C300 preamp and and a NAD C540 CD player it also is a very good match. I paid $1400 for both my SM 70 Pros bought directly from Monarchy Audio. For the price and performance you get from these amps it is a very good deal and I highly recommend these amps.
As of mid March I purchased a Cayin TA 30 integrated amp 35 watts push pull or you can pull out 2 tubes and run it SE at 4 watts. I just ran it with 2 tubes for the first time and I think I like it with 4 tubes better the bass is tighter and more defined and the midrange sounds fuller to me. I also finaly got my 2004 La Scalas at the beginging of April and I'm using the TA 30 to burn in the La Scalas. Since I live close to my neighbors I can not very often really crank it up so it will take some time for the LS to burn in. Once they have burned in I will do a comparision between the Cayin TA 30 and the 2 Monarchy Audio SM 70 pros 80 watts each. From the quality sound I had with the 2 SM 70 Pros with the KLF 20s they should match very good with the La Scalas.
The KLF 20s in a living room my size, 16X16X8, sound just as good as the La Scalas do. There are some factors behind that. First the La Scalas have not burned in yet and the 20s had to do the same thing. The KLF 20s midrange and tweeter horns are at ear level and the LS mid and high horns are right below my chin and I did notice a difference in the soundstage, not a huge difference but a very slight one. I'm thinking about making some wooden lifts for the LS and then do the sand bag tweak that Colin recommended .
In a larger room say 20X25X10 the LS would have more room to work their magic but in small living room they can overpower very easy. Another thing about having La Scalas in a small living room is the midrange horn is very strong and in your face!! That is one big difference between the KLF 20s and the LS. The midrange on the LS can be over powering on some songs when turning up the volume but on the 20s it sounded just right in my living room. Once the LS have burned in I'll do the comparision between the tube amp and the SS amp and which everone is second will go to my bedroom set up. I'll make a post once the speakers burn in.
Xman
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Back in the 80s my best friend used a Hafler DH 200 with a Luxman preamp and a pair of La Scalas to DJ at parties and also used the same set up as his stereo system and it sounded very good. I think he also used a EQ with the set up. But that was 16 years ago and you don't know what kind of condition this amp is in. I have the same Luxman preamp and have thought about buying a Hafler DH 200 myself. My friend put that amp through hell and it kept on working so they are built very good.
From my experiences with this amp I would give a new one a very high review but since these amps were made from around 80-85 the age factor is something to consider. What kind of preamp and speakers do you have? It is hard to say how the amp will match with your preamp but it sounded great with my friends Luxman preamp and La Scalas! The preamp my friend used in combo with this amp and La Scalas sounded great to me but the earlier post did not like it with La Scalas but he probably had a different preamp. I see this amp for sell on Ebay all the time so they seem to sell good so you could resell it on Ebay if you don't like the amp. The only reason I did not buy one is I bought a Cayin TA 30 integrated tube amp for my La Scalas. I have never owned a tube amp so I thought I would try one. I probably will buy a DH 200 in the future just to try it.
Xman
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I own a SM 70 and 2 SM 70 Pros that I have used with my Denon 4800 home theater receiver that was a very good match and also ran the pros with a 1983 Luxman preamp that was a good match. They match very well with Klipsch, with my KLF 20s they sounded very good! I have never used it but the Monarchy model 22c preamp( I think it is the C model they are on now) is suppose to sound very good. They also work very good as home theater amps. They blew away the internal amps in my Denon!
Xman
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NAD has the C542 out now that has gotten very good reviews. I have had the C540 for 3 years and it has sounded great. The NAD players play HDCDs and the Chris Isack HDCD Baja Sessions sounds better than any DVD A or SACD I own. The only other HDCD I own sounds terrible. Later this year I may get the C542.
Xman
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Marvel I agree totaly on the India issue! I think too many American companies are sending jobs overseas and I worry about it myself!
Well it's funny how things turn out! On the day I go off and start moaning about Klipsch taking toooooo long to finish my speakers the La Scalas are delivered to the store I bought them from. So Sat morning I'll do a 2 hour road trip to College Station to pick them up.
However I still feel they could have informed me about the problem with the finish instead of saying there is a cabinet problem. That is like a mechanic saying he found a problem with your engine but not telling you what the problem is and then saying it should be finished with another 3 days of work. I found out there was a cabinet problem 3 weeks ago and only today did I find out it was not the actula cabinets but the finish that goes on them.
Okay enough about that issue life is good now!! I'll try to do short review on Sunday and later after they have had a chance to burn in do a more in depth review. I am not good at expressing how systems sounds or how speakers sound so if Texas42 is reading this come up to Austin in late March early April and help me do a review.
Xman
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Hoggy I'm sorry to hear that! I guess every company has their horror stories! Your problem with Dell makes me realize that. How long ago was that? 2 or 3 years ago Dell moved the manufacturing plant for home computers out of Austin and to Tennesse. If you ordered it right in the middle of the move then it might have got messed up in the move. NOT that it is an excuse! I don't know the details on the part of Dell but it sounds like we screwed up and I apolagize! When I got my Dell computer it had a problem with the CDRW, tech support sent a tech to my house and changed it out for a new one and it has been working fine since. I don't blame you for just making your own. I hate to hear stories like yours because I have worked at Dell for almost 6 years and where I work safety and quality are the 2 most important things.
Xman
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Well I called the manufacturing number and talked to a women in tech support and she said they were shipped on Tuesday of this week. The sales rep said it was not the cabinet but the finish so in the end I had to dig around myself but got my answers. I think the amount of time people wait for the new Heritage speakers depends on the number of orders already ordered before you order a pair. Mine would have shipped right around 2 months if not for the problem with the finish. I had no problem with a longer wait but not knowing what kind of cabinet issue was the issue for me.
I know some people on the forum think spending this much money and waiting this long is crazy but it is my dads fault. My dad never bought anything used always new! 20 years later he would still have it and it would still be working. The only things he ever bought used were guns, he loves his guns like we love our Klipsch! He bought a Chevy Suburban in 1976 and did not replace it until 1996 with a Ford F150 which he will have until the day he dies. I'm 38 and have had 2 cars, a Honda CRX 220,000 miles and my Ford Ranger 110,000 miles and counting. Also I like the idea that I'm the first owner of my pair of La Scalas, don't have to worry about how the last owner took care of or did not take care of a used pair. Don't have to worry about upgrading the crossovers, they have a warranty!
I think the main reason I like this forum so much is you can come on here with your Kllipsch problems and even other issues in your life and have a support group that gives you many different opions to solving a problem. Thank You to everyone who has ever replied to any of my post or sent me emails with answers to questions on amps and speakers!!
Hopefully by next Friday I will have the La Scalas and the Cayin TA 30 up and running! Thanks again everyone!
Xman
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I don't mind waiting for the speakers to be finished it is not being able to find out what the cabinet issue is! I sent a email to customer service and they forwarded my email to the local klipsch sales rep for this region. He told me that there is a cabinet issue but he could not get me any details at the moment.
The very first email I sent to customer service about how long the average wait was for new LS and their reply was around 2 months. I did not mean to make such a long post. I was going to simply make a post asking any Klipsch employees on the forum if they new what the cabinet problem was but like I said not being able to get an answer on the cabinet issue is starting to get frustrating.
I agree that Klipsch would not have spent all the money on developing the new Heritage line just to stop making them. I think since Klipsch did spend the money to upgrade them they also should come up with a better marketing strategy. I am going to contact the area sale rep again and politely demand a better answer on the cabinet issue.
Xman
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read second post I messed up first one.
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I work at Dell Inc at one of the manufacturing plants. A lot of our customers would cancel their orders if it took 2 weeks to a month past the shipping date before we shipped their orders. I ordered a new pair of La Scalas back in mid Nov of 2003 and I'm still waiting.
I decided to buy new La Scalas for a number of reasons
1) I like the idea that no one else has owned them before me and these will probably be the last pair of speakers I will ever buy( I said probably maybe Khorns in 20 years).
2) Klipsch is the only speakers I have ever owned and I wanted to support the company.
3) I wanted to try the new crossovers.
When I paid for them at the store they said it would take around 6-8 weeks maybe longer. When they said longer I did not realize they meant 2 to 3 times longer.
I was told there is a problem with the cabinets with all La Scalas orders, there are 2 orders ahead of mine they have not been completed yet. I am glad that Klipsch realized there was a problem with the cabinets and are trying to fix the problem. I am glad that quality is taken very serious and they did not ship my order with a quality issue.
By the way does any Klipsch employees on the forum know any more details about the problem and how much longer before they even start my order? I apolagize for sounding a little frustrated but I am a getting a little frustrated. I guess I am starting to get frustrated because all I have been told is there is a cabinet problem. That is all I have heard.
Here is are some customer service tips for Klipsch,
First when manufacturing realizes there is a major problem with a order then customer service should be contacted. Manufacturing should give all the details about the problem or problems and what is being done to fix them. Then once customer service has all the details they contact the customer, in my case that would be the store I purchased them from, and give them all the details about the problem. For example a couple of years back there was a earthquake in a country where we get flat panel displays and other product we use in our computers. This was causing a delay in all our orders but we contacted the customers and told them about it and let any new customers that their orders would take longer than normal. At what point did Klipsch know about the problem? If they knew about it 2 orders before mine then why was I told the shipping date was Jan 16 and then Feb 6 and then around Feb 12 I was finaly told about a problem not a explanation of the problem.
Okay sorry if I have been ranting! I have been waiting 20 years for some La Scalas and I can wait some more just let me know why I am waiting longer.
Xman
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If you are considering new be ready to wait! I found out there is a quality issue with the La Scalas and there are two orders ahead of me that still have to be made. This is a good news bad news kind of news. It is very good news that KLipsch is making sure their qualiy is excellent
! The bad news is I will have to wait longer to get them. I have waited 38 years to get them so I can wait some more. If any forum members who work for Klipsch have more info on this I would be greatfull! Xman
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We finaly ended up in Silver City, New Mexico this is the land around the bear mountain lodge where we stayed.
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That is the Pecos river just Northwest of Del Rio, Texas, it is very beautiful country. We continued on to Fort Davis, Texas (pic). If I remember correctlyl Big Bend national park is southwest of Fort Davis I think.
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In Nov I payed $3572 for new La Scalas with the grills, I went with black but in 2 or 3 years I want to try a walnut look. They do not offer many choices on the finish just the 3 listed above. If you do buy new be ready for a wait. I payed the store in mid Nov and they still have not been shipped. I contacted Klipsch and they are checking on the delay.
I know a lot of forum members suggest buying used Heritage speakers but if nobody buys new Heritage then they will stop making them. I'm single with no kids so I'm able to afford it, kind of afford it I will be paying for the LS over the next few years. Also I want to hear the new crossovers and this also was a excuse to buy my first tube integrated amp, Cayin TA 30.
Xman
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Texas42 can you please give us a review of your Cayin TA 30 compared to your Scott 299b? Mobile Homeless brings up some good points about vintage tube and new tube gear and since you own vintage and new it will be interesting to find out what are the pros and cons sound wise of each amp.
For me I have to admit I am know very little about tube gear! I had not bought any tube gear before now because they sounded like a lot of work when I am use to solid state, plug everything in and your good to go. Rolling tubes, who knows how many different types of tubes, having to replace tubes, the cost of replacing tubes, biasing the tubes, waiting at least an hour before listening to music, and whatever else I can not think of can make a non tubie very hesitient about getting into tubes.
However after reading post by the very experienced tube people on this forum I realized that these are things that are not done every day or weekly but every once in a while. The main reason I decided to try tubes was buying La Scalas. I've known about Heritage speakers for 20 years but until I came on this forum almost 2 years ago I did not know there was still tube stereo gear available. Also since the majority of Heritage owners on the forum use tube gear and swear by the sound I had to give it a try!
The reasons I did not go vintage are a few. A habit I get from my dad is that he would never buy used stuff. But the new stuff he did buy would never be sold or thrown out until it could not be used or repaired any more. I'm 38 and have owned 2 vehicles, my Honda Crx made it to 222,000 and my Ford Ranger is at 110,000 so buy new and keep it forever was my dad's motto and like father like son! However I broke the cycle and bought a 1983 very good Luxman C300 preamp that sounds very good for used.
Also with vintage you have to find the vintage gear then probably have to bid against other people and you may get what you want or you may have to wait till the next time one shows up on ebay or audiogon. Then I would want to hear how it sounds before I would do any upgrades. So I would have it shipped to my home and listen to it for at least 2 weeks to a month to really learn how it sounds. Then ship it again to someone to do the upgrades and then wait for the upgrades to be finished and then mailed back. When you add in all the shipping cost plus the upgrade cost plus the initial cost of the amp price wise there probably is not much of a difference. Does the sound of such a vintage integrated amp sound better than a new one? Depending on which vintage amp and how much you put into upgrades it yes they do probably sound better. But for someone wanting to get into tube gear that will have a good sound, I have talked with 3-4 forum members who own the Cayin and give it very good reviews, new tube int amps can be a good first tube int amp. Will I buy a vintage tube preamp
and amp in the future? Probably but first I'm just going to enjoy getting into a unexplored area of stereo equipment to play with!
Xman
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What is your budget for a CD or SACD player? I have owned a NAD C540 CD player since 2000 and it has been a great CD player! I also own a Dennon DVD2900 which plays CDs, SACDs, and DVD As. The NAD C540 with regular CDs sounds much betterthan the Dennon 2900. But with SACDs and DVD Audio the Dennon does sound better. SACD does give a better sound and you can listen in SACD stereo so you do not have to worry about having a 5.1 system. I am thinking about replacing the C540 with the C542. The C542 is the latest version and you should be able to find it for $500 or less. If you do not want to have to replace your cd collection with SACDs I suggest going to the NAD website and find a dealer and go listen. The dealer I bought mine from let me take the demo home and try it. If you do plan to start buying SACDs then I would go with the suggestions already mentioned.
Xman
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For anyone who is thinking about buying a Cayin TA 30 here is a pro review for the TA 30. I should have my TA 30 next week some time and will post a review on how it sounds out of the box.
http://www.goodsound.com/equipment.shtml
Also the 30 used in the review did not have the upgrades that Paul at www.2baudio.com does. He upgrades the coupling caps to Auricaps, sub-woofer output, external bias with extended range, jac conversions, and focus control. So if the reviewer had used a upgraded one then he probably would have liked it even more.
Xman
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Congrats on the La Scalas!! I have been waiting on Klipsch to finish my 2004 La Scalas. Hearing your reaction is making me wish I had mine! On Friday I mailed off a money order to Paul at 2baudio for a Cayin TA 30 integrated tube amp. I have never owned any tube gear so I am looking forward to it. The upgrade bug bit me in late Nov and I have bought the La Scalas and now the Cayin TA 30, also a pair of Monarchy Audio SM 70 pros but I think I am going to sell one SM 70. I guess the next thing to get is a CD player. The question is do I go with a tube cd player or no tubes. If I go with a tube one I am thinking the Jolida JD 100a maybe the mod 1 version from Underwood hifi. I think it was Neo33 who gave the Jolida JD 100a a very good review. Does anyone else own the JD 100a?
The great thing about upgrading speakers is now you can go through your whole cd and record collection and listen to them sounding even better! Post a review once you have had a chance to listen for a while. If you are ever coming through Austin and want to stop by let me know.
Xman
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What is it about your current speakers that is missing? I own KLF 20s and the matching C7 center and they are very good speakers but they are not as good as what you have. My best friend use to have La Scalas and I can not get their Heritage sound out of my mind. That is why I am getting 2004 La Scalas.
I have not heard the center you are talking about but if you want come up to Austin and listen to mine and you will know if the sound is right. I should have the Cayin TA 30 by the first week of March so I would have the same amp and I have a NAD C540 Cd player. Weekends are better for me just send me an email.
Xman
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I have talked to Paul at 2baudio and a basic Cayin TA 30 on EBay, I believe that is how he sellsthem over the internet, is $599 plus $25 shipping. With upgrades and shipping $875. I am about ready to take the tube leap and buy the upgraded one on Monday. IF I do I will post a reveiw.
Xman
! The bad news is I will have to wait longer to get them
. I have waited 38 years to get them so I can wait some more. If any forum members who work for Klipsch have more info on this I would be greatfull! 
MOSFIT SOLID STATE VS. PUSH PULL TUBES
in 2-Channel Home Audio
Posted
As always opions vary such as the statement AK-4 made
"You lose most, if not all of the "tube sound" when when you run them through a solid state front end. I really don't know why that is -- it just is."
I bought the Cayin TA 30 to go with my La Scalas and did not like the sound mainly because of the preamp section of the TA 30. I own a Denon 4800 A/V reciever that I run the TA 30 thru and it sounds much smoother and musical sounding than when just using the TA 30. The Denon cost me almost $ 2000 so it's preamp section is very good. Before the Cayin I was using 2 Monarchy Audio SM 70 pros 80 watts each which sounded very good with my KLF 20s but with the La Scalas the combo did not sound very good but the Denon and Cayin combo sounds much better!
Now if I bought a tube preamp it would take it to another level but from my experience you can use a solid state preamp as long as it's not a $300 one you buy from Walmart. I've spent way to much money over the last 9 months so I have to pay off some debt before I can get a tube preamp or get a couple of better tube amps. Also I have to admit it is nice to be able to use the remote control on the denon for volume control since I rarely leave the volume at the same level for very long.
Xman