jhawk92

As some might know, I sent my crossovers, K-77Ms, and K-55Vs for refurb to BEC. Since I had pulled the top of the HF cabinet off to help get at the K-77Ms, I figured this would be a good time to try a little A/B comparison between the stock K-400 horns that came with my '68 K-horns to the new K-401 composite horns. I had bought a set last year, but with our move, I never got a chance to install them. At any rate, after pulling the K-400 off, I was ready to start work. I had actually also removed the front mounting board off one of the K-horns so it would be easier to mount the horns. So, I had laid out the mounting board on the floor, and proceeded to attempt to attach the K-401. I say attempt, because I found out that the mounting screws on the board were in a slightly different location for the K-400 than they were on the K-401. The top and bottom screws (two each) were pretty close, but the screws on the sides were about 3/8" towards the center of the speaker, so the horn wasn't able to be mounted. I called tech support earlier today (Wed) and Steve^2 said it wouldn't be a problem to redrill these holes in the composite horn. So, tonight, I fired up the drill and went to work. It took a bit of time, making sure the two new holes would align properly. But I finally got it done, and screwed down the nuts and prepared to remount the horn to the cabinet and the "tail" bracket. But wouldn't you know it, the K-401 horn's throat mounting flange was in a different location than the one for the K-400. This first pic shows the K-401 horn mounted to the front board, but you can see the difference between where the vertical support is and where the hole in the flange is.

And here is another pic, with a little closer view. With 9 screws into the wall, it's pretty sturdy, and I enjoy the added bass punch it gives me.

Ok, in the "better REALLY late than never category," here are a couple shots of my false wall for my Khorn. As I stated earlier, I had to compromise on the size since it sticks out into the hallway. I cut it to 40" tall dimension and 36" extension from the wall. I would have preferred to go with 42" which is the standard false corner dimension, but again, I was hampered by the hall. This plywood is then attached to the wall using 3 angle irons with drywall anchors and is pretty snug. Then I pushed the speaker into this "half false" corner. It sounds good, and while I know this is not optimum, it suits me well and keeps the WAF high, as I painted the plywood (painter's grade) with the same color as the wall. Maybe someday I'll get to build false corners, but for now, I'm happy and have a good 85-90% solution. Hope this helps folks understand a bit.

Picky- In a similar vein, the guy (forget his name) who does the "Let's get ready to RUUMMBLE!!!" at boxing matches has that trademarked. IIRC, you can't say it the same way he does, or it's a violation. He gets lotsa royalties this way, and travels a lot so people can use that phrase.

As I posted over in 2-ch, I appreciate Bob's info and candor on these mods. He is a great forum asset. I actually sent him my K-77s for re-diaphragm-ing as well as my stock Type A crossovers to check the caps. We both came to the conclusion that these speakers must have been babied by their original owner. For '68s to look as good as they do, as well has have components that weren't too far out of spec, they must have led a charmed life. Bob did replace the K-77 diaphragms and the caps in the x-over were only about 5-10% out of spec, but he did replace those. Looking foward to getting everything back home and reassembled. I will also have a K-401 horn mounted in one of the K-horns to do a bit of A/B comparison. The K-400 horn sure rings once it's out on its own.

Congrats Gary. Enjoy them as I do mine. It's nice that you got them as fast as you did, and even have acceptable WAF. I, too, would leave them alone for a while. IIRC, they are '76, so may still have the cast K-400 horn? I couldn't hear any ringing from my K-400s, but since my speakers are disassembled for Bob's x-over refurb and diaphragm replacement, I will be mounting a K-401 composite horn on one to compare. Once it was off the mount, the 400 sure does ring when tapped. I'll be interested to see if I can hear a difference. Lynnm- I take it you have the metal horns as well? I am looking foward to the A/B comparison between the metal and composite horns.

A call to Klipsch Tech Support yielded good results. Steve^2 said elongating or drilling new holes shouldn't cause any problems, so I'll be working on that tonight. They had a good recommendation to put some masking tape on both sides of the flange so as to prevent any extra damage as the drill goes through. I was going to drill into a piece of wood, but will do both now. They gave me the part number for the gasket too; called a Driver Gasket, P/N 157041. They are $0.19 each, so I got 8, to have some on hand. Minimum shipping is $5, but they should be here early next week. For now, I'll get the 401 mounted with the old gasket and then replace when the new ones arrive.

Dee- I'll be sure to let the forum know. I do have a slight problem. I pulled off on of the K-400 tonight. Boy, what a pain that was. The two nuts on the bottom were hard to reach, so after pulled off the K-400, I also unscrewed the entire front mounting board (four screws, two on each side) which includes the cane grill cloth. Then I flipped the board on its face and tried to mount the K-401, but the two screw holes on the sides (horn laying horizontal) are about 3/8" too far out in comparison to the existing mounting screws. The other holes will match up ok, but these two on the sides will require drilling new holes. I figure just a regular drill bit should do the trick, but if anyone has any warnings before drilling in the composite, I'd be happy to hear them. I was going to try drilling tonight, but I want to do it when I am not as tired, so I'll do it tomorrow right after work. And yes, once the K-400 is no longer attached, it certainly does ring like a bell. Bob- Thanks for your efforts on these. Even though everything hasn't arrived back here yet (should be tomorrow), I have been very pleased with Bob's service and support. As he mentioned, I sent the K-55V drivers out to him, figuring they would need re-diaphragm-ing like the K-77Ms. While the K-77s needed work, I was pleased to find out the K-55s did not. Bob called me after this testing to ask what I wanted to do, but before he did anything else. I'm glad he was straight with me and said that he didn't think replacing the diaphragms would make any difference, so I opted not to do the work. It was nice to have that choice! I'm looking forward to getting things back reassembled, especially the one without a HF cabinet! I've got K-horn parts spread all over the family room, so I'm glad SWMBO is out of town and I have room to spread out.

Dflip- I am talking about the one between the horn and the driver. I don't know if there is (?) one between the horn and the front of the cabinet. I'll probably find out tonight as I plan on mounting one of the K-401s in preparation for later events. There wasn't one when I pulled the K-77s off, so I don't think there will be on the mid-range horn.

I'll throw my votes in for a good potato salad, corn, and beer. In terms of corn, grilling it up is quite fine. And Gary, I'll put some of Colorado's Olathe Sweet Corn up against your MD stuff any day of the week.

Brendan- I can put a couple pics together of a set of OO KG 1.2 and a black Academy. I used to have a KV-4, so I might still have a couple pics of that. My digital camera is on the other side of the country right now with my wife and daughter, but I'll get them taken over the weekend. It's a 4 MP camera, so I think that will be enough for you. Rob

Jerry- I'll agree with what was said above. Forte II is an excellent speaker, but the Chorus II is a definite upgrade with its better mid/high sound. Yes, you lose a bit of the bass response, 32Hz for Forte II vs 39Hz for Chorus II, but in a HT application, with a good sub, you'll never miss the missing bass. And you'll have a better top end. When I upgraded my HT, I seriously thought about another set of Forte IIs for the rears, but folks here convinced me to think about the Chorus II. After a couple of auditions with fellow forum members who had the Chorus II, it was a no-brainer. So now the Chorus IIs occupy L/R main and Fortes are in the surrounds, which is great for multi-channel music!

Shoot an email over to forum member Bob Crites (BEC) as he is doing new crossovers for both the Klipschorn (A and AA) as well as the Heresy, which match up with factory specs. Folks speak highly of him and his work, and I'll get to see his work first hand later in the week as he has refurbed my Type A crossovers for my Klipschorns. DeanG/AK-4 is doing upgraded crossovers for a number of the different speakers, so he may have a Heresy project in the works.

Frz- I was speaking with one of the Denon reps earlier this year, and they will be bringing out an "affordable" line of separates, most likely some time next year. I'm really looking forward to those, especially the pre/pro, as it will supposedly have all the bells and whistles that the 480x/5805 receivers have; PL IIx, full bass management, adjustable x-overs, connections galore, etc. I agree though, $6k for this receiver seems a bit pricey, espcially with the available wattage. The 5803 was 170W x 7, and now it's 140W x 7? Hmm, seems like we're going backwards here.

Ed- Congrats on the Chorus IIs. They are a great speaker. Yes, an Academy is the best match for a "small" center channel. I say "small" because another Chorus II (or its smaller brothers, Forte II or Quartet) would be ideal, but those are pretty large speakers. In terms of pricing, figure on about $500 or so, with shipping extra. If you can find one for less, buy it in a heartbeat, as you'll not be disappointed. For rear surrounds, I really like the Forte II, but any of the Chorus II/Forte II/Quartet line would be great. If space is limited, look at the KG 1.2/1.5 or 2.2/2.5 series. I had two sets of the KG 1.2 with my Forte IIs in a 7-ch HT system before I got the Chorus II, and still have a pair for back center. They match up pretty well with the big Chorus IIs, and if you are looking at just a HT system, not multi-channel audio, they will do quite nicely.

Frz- A part number would be great, as I think I'd like to have some spare gaskets available for future use. I figured it would make sense to change mine out, as it looks like these are original, so 36yo gaskets are probably on their last legs. Any idea how often they should be changed? I would assume it is years, so maybe this is like a 10yr/100,000 mile check item? Wrench- Interesting observations. I'll have to check under the hood this evening and see what I can find.

I'll be pinging the good folks at Klipsch for an answer as well, but thought folks here on the boards might be able to supply an answer before dawn. I had pulled the K-55V drivers (as well as the K-77 drivers and crossovers) and sent them to BEC for his rework. They are on their way back to me, so I thought this would be a good time to do a bit of A/B comparison between the K-400 and K-401 horn. The K-401 horns did not ship with the rubber gasket, and I am able to pull the gaskets from the original K-400 horns in my speakers. However, since these seem to be the original gaskets, are these still good to use? I don't know if a new gasket is more pliable, but these are a bit stiff. Since I've done a number of rework items, is it worth getting a new set of gaskets, or will the original ones still work for a while? Thanks much.

JjR- Congrats on the 400. It's a great unit. It is basically a simpler design on the Fisher 500C/800C. And as Craig likes to say, "Simple is good." I demo'ed one here on my K-horns before taking it over to my parents. It sounds really good; plenty of bass, nice crisp highs. My parents are running it on a set of Chorus IIs and it sounds good there as well. One drawback on it is availablity/cost of the 7868 output tubes. NOS is about the only way to go, though I did see that EH is going to be making a new 7868 tube. Check out http://www.turnstyle.com/nsc/search.asp They seem to be a bit pricey; you can get NOS tubes for that amount, but glad to see a new source for these tubes is out there. Enjoy.

dubai- Do you have any more info on the ASL single KT-88 amps? I have been trying to find more about them, but no luck. I have an audition set on a pair of Radii MMS-KT88 this weekend. Craig and I have discussed them at length, but interested in what you might know about the ASL amps, since the Radii seller says they are made in the same location as ASL and some of the tubes on his amps are labeled ASL. Thanks.

Gary- Congrats on your new freebies! Pretty amazing story here for sure. Welcome to the big time! Can't wait to see the pics and hear the tales. Bass656- Incredible offer you made here. Your special place in heaven has been reserved.

Phil- The auction you listed had Heresys from 1968, "G" in the serial number, same year as my K-horns. If I had seen that auction, I might have bid on it, as that would be pretty cool to have all the same year of manufacture.

I would agree with radiob-I have both Forte II and Chorus II. I started with the Forte II in my HT, and lived with them for nearly 8 years. Then I heard a pair of Chorus IIs and knew I had to get them. As much as I like the Forte IIs, great upper end and fabulous bass, the Chorus IIs have an even smoother upper end, even though you give up a bit of bass. I compensate for that with my sub, but I still have the Forte IIs; they are my surrounds. You can't go wrong with either set. Chorus II is about 3-4" bigger in all dimensions than the Forte II, and has a 15" woofer and passive, whereas the Forte II has a 12" woofer with the 15" passive. It would be a tough choice...for HT, if you had a sub, I would not hesitate to go Chorus II. If it were HT w/o a sub, I think I'd lean towards the Forte II. If it were 2-ch...tough choice. Slightly better highs with the Chorus II, but slightly better bass with the Forte II. See if you can audition one or either pair first and then make a decision on your tastes.

jt- You've got mail! Rob

Yeah, amazing price for Chorus IIs. I was watching just for fun, and if I needed a pair, I certainly would have been tempted.

Yikes, thanks for the heads-up John. So, do they have something similar over in Belgium? Maybe some sort of hardware store that has paint supplies? I would think a sand finish paint is available over there.