JiminSTL

Of course, the "fixed star" is no longer personal freedom (even of conscience), or legal impartiality, or even the "national good". The fixed star has become "liberal" orthodoxy and theology and conformity. One need only look at the genuflection before the altar of "diversity", or the various (Democrat) moves to literally outlaw and prosecute anyone who questions "climate change", or the attempts over decades to remove faith (well, Christian or Jewish faith) from the public sector, or the corruption of the IRS and DOJ to suppress "conservative" NFP groups and others. And on and on ad nauseum. . . . The "fixed star" is a secular and governmental Alpha and Omega.

^ That is exactly correct. Which is why the morphing of the judicial and popular interpretation of "freedom of religion" into "freedom from religion" in the public sector is so dangerous to our political health. It removes the very tenants of our republican construction (the source of our "unalienable rights") from the original and rightful position. Our rights exist prior to and independent of any governmental grant of them. The pre-existing rights (as God-given, not government or man-given) are the sine qua non of enduring liberty. Eliminate that sole pillar, and we have the types of legal absurdities and monstrosities being foisted off on us every day.

dwi, you must be a very unhappy man. As full of opprobrium as incorrect "understanding". It is clear that you are not a man to be reasoned with. So, let's simply part ways, shall we? Edit: Oh, and God makes clear that He does not "hate" people, nor nations. He gave all of Himself in order to deliver us from our desserts (perhaps you prefer the original "deserts"). He does, however, hate sin.

Dr. L., thank you for your kind words.

Interesting, isn’t it? How merely the stating of facts can produce such—alternately—different responses. To wit, some may be incited and enflamed; some choose to be informed, and others are inspired by them. Same facts, however because of a different chosen response, a different result. So, without emphasis on any person(alities) whose comments precede this one of mine, may I offer some (inconvenient?) truths on this glorious day celebrating the declaring of our independence, as a people and a place and a history-making principle, from the British crown. People often start from a confused beginning, interchanging “religion” and “faith”. Religion involves the garments and ornaments with which Man dresses his worship. Christian faith, in this instance, is a man’s (person’s) acceptance of the Gospel, belief in it, and acting upon it. The good news of forgiveness of our sins, and the call to live according to the principles of God, and enjoy eternal communion and joy with Him. Those believing that this country was originally settled by people “looking for religious freedom” have misread the facts. It happens that settlers from the time of the Mayflower (Compact) and forward for generations were seeking the right to worship their Christianity. Pilgrims came here largely because they believed that the English had become immoral and irreligious (Paul Johnson, A History of the American People). To quote further: “In the meantime, what of the real priesthood, the real religion of the people? . . . the part played by the churches, or by Christianity, as such, in the constitution-making. As we have seen, America had been founded primarily for religious purposes, and the Great Awakening had been the original dynamic of the continental movement for independence. The Americans were overwhelmingly church-going, much more so than the English . . . . The Pilgrim Fathers had come to America precisely because England had become immoral and irreligious. They had built the ‘City on the Hill.’ . . . they felt their subjugation was itself immoral and irreligious and opposed to the Providential Plan. There is no question that the Declaration of Independence was, to those who signed it, a religious as well as a secular act (italics mine), and that the Revolutionary War had the approbation of divine providence. They had won it with God’s blessing and, afterwards, they drew up their framework of government with God’s blessing, just as in the 17th century the colonists had drawn up their Compacts and Charters and Orders and Instruments, with God peering over their shoulders.” That is not to say that our understanding/interpretation of the issue of “religious freedom” has not changed over time. Clearly, it has. Some very accurate historically-evident instances of our start in this process are provided below. There are many others: 1. Virginia Official Religion: Anglican/Church of England Original Charter Date: Apr. 10,1606 Full text of The First Charter of Virginia (PDF) 15.5K Ended Support: 1830 "Every Person should go to church, Sundays and Holidays, or lye Neck and Heels that Night, and be a Slave to the Colony the following Week; for the second Offence, he should be a Slave for a Month; and for the third, a Year and a Day." Governor Argall's Decree 1617 2. "That religion, or the duty which we owe to our Creator and the manner of discharging it, can be directed by reason and conviction, not by force or violence; and therefore, all men are equally entitled to the free exercise of religion, according to the dictates of conscience; and that it is the mutual duty of all to practice Christian forbearance, love, and charity towards each other." Virginia Declaration of Rights,1776 3. "THAT Noe person or persons which professe ffaith in God by Jesus Christ Shall at any time be any wayes molested punished disquieted or called in Question for any Difference in opinion or Matter of Religious Concernment" New York Charter of Liberties and Privileges, 1683 4. "Article II. It is the right as well as the duty of all men in society, publicly and at stated seasons, to worship the Supreme Being, the great Creator and Preserver of the universe. And no subject shall be hurt, molested, or restrained, in his person, liberty, or estate, for worshipping God in the manner and season most agreeable to the dictates of his own conscience, or for his religious profession or sentiments. provided he doth not disturb the public peace or obstruct others in their religious worship. Article III. And every denomination of Christians, demeaning themselves peaceably and as good subjects of the commonwealth, shall be equally under the protection of the law; and no subordination of any one sect or denomination to another shall ever be established by law. Chapter VI. Article I. Any person chosen governor, lieutenant-governor, councillor, senator, or representative, and accepting the trust, shall, before he proceed to execute the duties of his place or office, make and subscribe the following declaration, viz: 'I _______, do declare that I believe the Christian religion...'" Massachusetts Constitution, 1780 5. Maryland Official Religion: Anglican/Church of England Original Charter Date: June 20, 1632 Full text of The Charter of Maryland (PDF) 22.6K Ended Support: 1867 And so on. The point? Only relevant to those who attempt to do justice to the facts. Useless to those who are intent upon their preferred opinion, irrespective of the facts. Now, can we not enjoy the remainder of this day, history making and changing day, in the unity which inspired it? May we in this country bless God, and be blessed by Him in return!

Hmmmm. Won't speculate on the reason(s) for what sounds to be disdainful of and hostile to my comments. Nor will I reply in kind. Perhaps you will come to a different understanding as your lives unfold. And perhaps not . . . .

May I say this, and then go to bed? It is only SUFFICIENTLY SHARED VALUES among a sufficient number of people that make a nation. Diminish the values, diminish the number, and diminish the shared community of people, and you reduce/remove the essence of nationhood. Our founding fathers had it so right: only an educated and moral people would be able to sustain our representative form of government. In fact, they were the only "worthy" ones. It pains me so greatly that even the LAST BASTIONS of our sense of honor and integrity and faith and duty--our military armed forces--have been so politicized that their calling is promotion within politicized ranks and system, that "American" conveys so little of what it used to mean. I say that with a father who was a 1938 graduate of the USNA (fought 2 wars), I was a 5-year Naval officer, and my son a 4-year Marine Corps officer. My advice about country and duty and honor is very different today with the "leaders" and system we now have.

Small point perhaps, today, with the selective "justice" which is/is not enforced, but, is it not also against the law to represent the American flag on articles of clothing, and other items . . . ?

I know that most of the people on this forum understand . . . history, our national character, our source and our strength. It is ourselves only to the extent of our obedience and our faith in, and our love of God. The deliberate pollution of the facts is our "great" undoing. "Education", or "right emotions", nor ignorance will ever deliver us from ourselves, if we do not understand the Source of our nationhood. It is not Fate, or some happy coincidence or convergence. It happened to be Godly people 2.5 centuries ago who were so much smarter than we today, evidently. We say "God bless", or we ask God to bless our nation, or we ask God to be on our side. We have it BACKWARD. We must be a people who bless God, as individuals. He will bless the people and nation who bless Him. NOT THE OTHER WAY AROUND. I hope this is not overstepping the posting rules or boundaries. but, the Truth is the Truth, and must be said.

Hey, Matt, my friend, Am happy for you! Spreading the Klipsch word, and spreading audio joy . . . .

^ Grace, graciousness, kindliness . . . often under-practiced, and never over-valued.

Agree, Mookie, I think Matt needs to go cold turkey, surrender them to me, for my "appropriate" disposal.

^ Bravo Zulu! You "did the right thing".

^ Kind words. Many thanks for them, and your help!

You guys are fantastic! This is exactly the understanding and explanations I needed. Gosh, my friend will think I actually know something now. I will be sure to credit the very helpful Forum members!

Thought of another question: how does one select to use the Zone 2 outputs, or instead receive the signals in Zone 2 through AVR#2? Meaning, instead of pressing the Zone 2 button to send the signals to the speakers in Zone 2, what must be done to select the line out as the output source to, say the "VCR IN" jacks, so that the AVR#2 sends the signal to the speakers connected to it?

^ Excellent! I think your answer shows how for my friend to do exactly what he wants. Very much appreciate the precise answers, mustang and coytee. Imprecise answers only serve to either confuse me, or to create more questions.

mustang, thank you for your help! The AVR#1 is TBD, as he is going through the decision-making process. Likely to be an Onkyo 737, 747, or 838. Could be something like a Yamaha RX-A850, too. And, if he is happy w/ just stereo in Zone 2, then the speaker outputs on AVR#1 would suffice. However, if he wanted a center, in addition to the L/R, could he/should he use the AVR#2 (the Yamaha HTR-5750), feeding it from the Zone 2 line out? And then connect the L/R/C speakers? Thank you.

Am trying to understand the terms "pre-out" and/or "line-out". Esp as they apply to getting a sound source/signal from one AVR to another. Specifically, if AVR #1 has a Zone 1 and Zone 2/3 capability (L/R posts for Zone 2), AND has Zone 2/3 "Line Out" red and white RCA jacks: Zone 2 would be given its input via the 2 Zone 2 posts? If Zone 2 listening is accomplished via #1 above, then, what is the purpose of the Zone 2 line out jacks? To connect another AVR in Zone 2? If #2 above is yes, does the Zone 2 line out usage eliminate the Zone 2 speaker usage in Zone 2 wiring connection? Does using Zone 2 line out jacks for another AVR enable more than 2 speakers in Zone 2 if using the line outs? Does any line out jacks carry only the L/R signal? Is that automatically a "stereo" format? If using Zone 2 posts (speaker wire going to speakers in Zone 2), then what is possible using the Zone 3 line outs? Same as Zone 2 answers? Is it possible to have more than L/R speakers hooked up to a 2nd AVR which receives its input from line outs (am asking the question again/differently?) Must the AVR#2 receiving the line out signal have defined inputs to receive the line out signal from AVR#1? What would those inputs be labeled? I ask all this because I am attempting to understand the principles, and to help a friend with an old Yamaha HTR 5750, to see if he might be able to use it as AVR#2. The rear panel on this 5750 has the following: digital input jacks multi-channel input jacks video component jacks AC outlet digital output jack audio component jacks subwoofer output jack impedence selector Thanks to all who take the time and interest to actually get through this, and respond in ways that I actually understand!

Pardon my asking, but what does Medicare eligibility have to do with anything? I know extremely wealthy, and extremely poor, people who are on Medicare. Maynard fanatic, I agree. No disrespect intended to the OP, but Medicare really has nothing to do with things. Unless we are assuming that his hearing may be impaired/gone, his zest for beauty in life vanished, etc. Of course, as a Medicare-enrolled person for 5 years now (age 70), I don't know what all the fuss is about. I still lift my KLF-30s (when I sold them a little while back), and I thoroughly enjoy all the wonderful speakers I have, including my Outlaw sub that rattles things if I turn the volume up to 4 (not in Scrappy's league, but still impressive). The good thing to remember in all this, I suppose, is that there are nice people willing to help we "old people" . . . .

Apparently, is an inherited trait . . . ?

Scrappy, zoning permits? I mean, what with the obvious commercial intent, what's next--a parking lot and ticket sales?

Lars, thanks for your reminder. I don't take it as a lecture; I hear a tinge of sadness and regret somewhere that you are trying gently to forewarn others about.

Dunno, Dave & Oldtimer. Haven't reached it. Or may have passed it by. Don't know. But, AM enjoying the life and the energy and the abilities the good Lord continues to provide!

Yes, I have tended in the too much, too fast, and too hard direction in my 70 years of life, too.