Dkfan9

This is a great deal. I paid $1500 for mine gently used back in 2016. They sound great. Playing back horns in particular. A special midrange.

Very interesting thread. Ive got some thoughts but no time to get them all out currently. I do have a couple questions: you have FDW enabled on these graphs, how many cycles? And how different do your phase graphs look unsmoothed? Just pondering about the effect of room interactions.

Well I did this sort of just for my own interest but others might find it interesting as well. Attached picture shows simulated R28F based solely on crossover parts (in black) overlaid with actual speaker impedance measured the other day (in yellow). Crossover parts list taken from here. VirtuixCAD2 used to create the overlay and sim the crossover, using 2 generic, flat 8 ohm drivers on LF and 1 generic, flat 8 ohm driver for HF.

That's an interesting idea. Seems like an easy DIY experiment for some owner here... But after thinking about it my initial response bit more, I wonder what that crossover region looks like closer to 8' out (JA is measuring at ~4'). Possibly this is a case of the speakers being voiced to be flat at 8' or so out (seems like a typical enough listening distance for HT and stereo). If so, I would expect the crossover region to be flatter and the treble to shelve down a bit, though I'm not knowledgeable enough to say that's the case for sure and if so, how much the distance increase would affect FR. But I guess what I'm saying is that without a more comprehensive set of measurements, I might have been jumping the gun a little too quickly, especially at the crossover region.

Very nice dispersion and decay plots. Biggest problem with the FR looks to be at the crossover, especially if the grille is left on, as JA notes that the grille takes about 1db off the elevated tweeter output from 3-8k, and increased on axis treble above 13k will be compensated by off axis rolloff. Looking at measurements for the two other Klipsch speakers Stereophile has reviewed, these look a lot more like Palladiums than RB-15s.

Currently I'm using an Academy as center with P17B mains. When seated exactly in the sweet spot, i would take the P17Bs easily, although there is a slight loss of center vs stereo imaging but the fidelity increase is easily worth it. When moving slightly off axis to within 20 degress off axis, I prefer the system with the Academy due to the center image precision. However, i also have a chair near the edge of my room, which ends up at almost exactly 30 degrees off axis. This is the spot where the center imaging precision and center vs stereo separation factors should be greatest, but im not at all happy with the Academy's performance from this seat. Vocal clarity is significantly reduced. I think this is mostly due to the large woofers in a horizontal MTM configuration causing lobing at this spot in the critical above 1000 hz range. Im not sure if the horns tight horizontal dispersion plays any role here, but since it's such a small horn im not sure how tight its directivity control is around the crossover into where it takes over. Overall, if your seating stays within 20 degrees off axis, i think you will do fine with the Academy. If it goes to a wider angle, look into another option, but know that phantom center will trade the frequency response issues for imaging issues. Either way, your best bet would be to get a third Heresy as silversport and Ljk suggested--it will avoid the clarity compromises of horizontal MTMs, the imaging compromises of a phantom center, and 3 matched speakers across the front is 99% of the time the best option for sound quality. Now if only i had the money to pony up for a P27C or another P17B...

It sounds like a wireless interference issue. The last time the wireless adapter worked without crackling issues, was it in the same room?

I have the Rocketfish posted above. It worked very well for me. I'm not currently using it but I plan to use it the next time I need a living room surround setup.

Do you have room for rear surrounds?

Or movies

My 55EG9100 would fit perfectly on top of one of these, and I've been looking for a center for my Palladiums that fits my room...

I was more wondering driver size, since that's specifically called out as larger. I can't seem to find that detail in spec sheets or reviews for FI/FII. EDIT: Found it. 1.75" based on other K-53 mids.

Since the midrange is larger on the Forte III... What is the midrange size on the original Forte/Forte II?

Oh I'd certainly proceed with caution too.

I assume somehow it's cheaper to make it non removable. And maybe they don't finish the baffle to save costs? I'm sure you could remove it... Just might not be so easy to put back on...

The room is only a little bit less of a mess now...

Make sure the center is pulled out to or preferably an inch over the edge of the cubby it's in. Angle it up as well. But try at least temporarily to turn off the center and see how it sounds. It will probably not sound ideal off axis (pulled to whichever side you're seated on), but it will probably sound more ideal than the current setup in the center position by pulling the tweeter up to ear level.

The Restore function is technically meant for low quality to medium quality steamed or compressed music (eg mp3). Low boosts the bass only I think, medium boosts more and also provides treble boost, and high boosts the highs more and possibly the bass more too. It can act essentially as a loudness control with a little more gradation than old school one button loudness controls.

I was looking at this as a convenient center/tv stand between my P17Bs... I knew I couldn't get down there until after Christmas so I held off. My Academy is fine (though I haven't tried the combo in this room yet--phantom center currently) but with my room setup wider than long and not wanting to get the TV up too high, it's going to be a bit in the way when I get a stand for it. Plus I'm always interested in trying a Heritage, especially an all horn unit. Well, if it doesn't work out for you, I might be an interested party in the future.

Reference Premiere is more than just different branding from Ref II... Different horn and different voicing. I don't think timbre matching is as important as many do. I had an Academy center paired with R28F LR for over a year and was very happy with it. I could pick it out if I turned it off vs on or compared music in PLII vs stereo, but that was as much about soundstage as timbre. There were timbre differences, but they did not detract from the experience. If you want something to build around and want new in years to come, get Ref Premiere. I doubt the RF II will be around too much longer. On the other hand, some here have recommended Ref II centers with RP towers, so you could still go the upgrade route into RP down the line even with the Ref II center.

Ok, that makes sense. That FR graph is pretty interesting, with off axis having a large bump between 5500 and 10k relative to the on axis and surrounding frequencies. The drop above 10k isn't so surprising, but below 5.5k is interesting.

My post was slightly tongue in cheek. I guess the broader point is most people don't care about musical fidelity very much and don't want to turn the volume up and down or deal with huge dynamic swings, so compression as a trend entirely makes sense.

So you're expressing an implied preference for compression

The 10 degree off axis is vertical (the others are horizontal off axis), so that's showing the lobing (and the on axis might be showing a bit of lobing as well with the slight dip above 500), but why the need for phase plugs?

I'm not sure this soundbar outputs signal for wireless surrounds.