Kilroy

Interesting thoughts Chris... I will definitely read through your K-402 thread... The first few pages were intriguing. I've kind of been thinking the same way about the tuning. Yes, the bass bin is the first priority because I can just set the horns on top for a while as I figure it out. But I understand that there's a lot more to tune. Just playing with the dsp settings on the shop receiver changed the mid and high character so dramatically it told me there might be a lot to be had going active, if not tri, and least Bi-amped... But if the K-33e in the belle bass cab isn't ideal, I have the flexibility now to go a different rout. My Sub isn't probably an ideal match to the Belles but it's probably good enough to get them right before building a more ideal Sub.

Honestly, I'm not sure what the issue was with the Belles... Basically they sounded clear and precise but sort of lifeless. They didn't disappear at all and you could listen to the sound just fine but you weren't immersed in it. That said, my dad put them in these open back enclosures... And at first when I started listening to them, they sounded about like you'd expect... Pretty bad... But I had them on a surround receiver and they kind of came alive when I started messing with the EQ settings. So I think I can see the potential... The bass in this setup was more than plenty BTW. It got me thinking about getting them in something appropriate and seeing where I can get with some tuning. I actually could hide a t18 behind a couch pretty easy in this room.

Thanks for replying, Zobsky... I have thought about the Cornscala. Maybe it seems a little too easy if that makes any sense? I may default to it in the end. Thank you for sharing your porting impressions as well. I have a nice JBL active sub... I don't have a lot of room for a big bass horn sub in this room but I could run the JBL, and hide it. I also have a Nakamichi PA-5 and 2 Pass f-5 amps I can run if needed, so I was thinking about maybe building a stock belle and either bi or tri-amping it to see if messing around with the active crossover helps out more. I'm still 'bench racing' at this point... But I'm looking to get something underway around the new year hopefully, so I appreciate the real world impressions. Still intrigued by the Dean as well.

Maybe there was something wrong with them, I lived with them for about 10 years and would take a cd from my collection and listen to it on my system... Denon Receiver, B&W Bookshelves, bottom tier Sharp CD player... Nice imaging and good full sound. Take it to my dads system... Way higher SPL... for sure, slightly more even sounding, but no sound stage to speak of and almost hollow sounding... That said, today I'm running my Wharfedales on the exact same Nakamichi Stasis system he had for the Belles, and it's transformed those speakers. Better in every way. So I don't think it was the system. Add to that, in the simple backless cabs he built for the Belle Drivers, the sound is really good compared to what I remembered from the belles, and I'm excited about getting them back into proper cabs and living with them a while. He had them professionally installed, but I wonder if they had something wired wrong or something. I'm really wavering between recreating the Belle's and going with the Deans... I think the wife would like the vintage look of the Dean with nice grills, but I think the Belles might have higher resale value if done right and they have a smaller footprint. Hope that's not too much of a hijack of Karlson's thread.

Strongly leaning toward building some University cabs for my Belle drivers. Couple questions about the Dean/Classic: Does the Dean still perform better in a corner? If no corners, is the Classic a better choice? Do they need to be resting directly on the floor for best performance or could I elevate them a bit? Does the K33e seem like a good match? Karlson3 shared the graphs, thanks for that, but I was wondering if anyone has done it and has impressions. It sounds like a sub may still be in the mix no matter which of the domesticated 15" horn designs you choose... Is this true of the Universities and/or the California? (I'm currently running some Wharfedale w70s without a sub and couldn't imagine needing one, if that adds perspective.) I'm a novice at interpreting the graphs, but that's what I'm getting from what's been posted so far. Just making sure the real world performance isn't drastically different. So the Classic/Dean beat the LaScala/Belle designs in extension, from what I'm seeing... Do the PWK designs excel at anything over the University designs? I remember the Belles as being extremely clear and lively, but with no real punch... Even compared to my B&W bookshelves.

Yes, I read through the Zobsky build... He didn't seem overly impressed with the mod. But it didn't sound like he was done tweaking either. I have 1 usable corner in this room, so I was hoping the 'Cornerless' part of the Dean was legit. If not, maybe the Belles are the best overall bet. In reading through the threads, there seems to be mixed opinions with the Deans... Especially with the k-33e. That said... It's audio... There's always mixed opinions. I'm just not hearing a clear consensus.

Yes, I read through your build thread. Are you going to do the ported mod? Do you know if anyone has ported a bell into the top hat with the hat sealed for just increased woofer chamber volume? I read about that in one of the laScala threads, but I didn't see any results or listening impressions. Very nice build by the way. My main concern about recreating the Belles is that I'm afraid my wife might not like the style... Was trying to brainstorm ways of changing the style a bit without changing the sound. My dad's were oiled Oak with cane grill cloth... I really liked that look as a kid. But I like the veneer you're doing also.

First post New guy from the DiyAudio forums. I find myself with a full set of drivers (K-77, k-55M, and K-33-e) and crossovers out of a pair of Belles and am looking for enclosure advice. I asked this question on DIYAudio and they suggested I try here. So I've spent the last several day searching and reading older posts about the K-33E and what enclosures it's best suited for. I'm leaning toward University Dean, but in reading those threads, reviews seem mixed. There's a lot to say for the original Belle enclosure from a WAF standpoint with the exception of the height of the top-hats... But I grew up with Belles and the sound never really impressed me. I have a nice JBL studio sub I can throw into the system now though. I'm not as Bass needy as I used to be either. I listen at low volumes most of the time anyway. As a reference, my dad built some simple open back cabs for the drivers and I spent a day listening to them in those cabs and ended up removing the sub because I didn't feel I needed it. So I apologize in advance if this is has been done before, but I wasn't sure how the site felt about bumping old threads and I was getting a little lost with all the information in the various threads. So what would you build if you found yourself with Belle drivers and no Belle Cabs? Thanks, Phil