Deang Posted February 7, 2002 Share Posted February 7, 2002 ...speaking generally can at times be very misleading. Let's take the following statement: "Tubes sound better than SS" Yesterday I found out that this isn't always true. Being perfectly happy with what I had, I decided to 'upgrade'. Since I'm doing almost as much time with the DVD player (movies) as I am with CD's - I decided I wanted to get a little more slam and transient attack back into my system. I purchased both a Bryston 3B-ST amp and BP-20 preamp off of AudiogoN. The original plan was to roll the tubes in my Anthem Pre1L and mate it with the 3B-ST. When the BP-20 showed up on AudiogoN I more or less bought it out of curiosity, and figured it would be easy enough to sell off if I didn't like it. The Bryston preamp showed up today, and I spent my lunch break swapping out the Anthem with the Bryston. I fired everything up and let the Amp1 warm up for about 20 minutes or so before I started a CD. So what we have at this point is a SS preamp mated to a middle of the road tube amp running stock Russian EL34's, a pair of Sieman 12au7's, and a stock Chinese 12ax7. Now the way folk talk in general, (and I am actually exluding the likes of Mobile, Colin, and many others on this board who I am sure know better) - you would think that even a middle of the road tubed preamp would sound better than any or most SS units. However, that's not what I found. In a way, I wanted the Bryston to sound bright and grainy so I could justify going to the next level - what I found was a smooth, effortless, open, and natural sounding treble. The bass was obviously tighter and there was less 'glare' at the higher SPL's. The unit is obviously a better sounding unit than the Anthem Pre1L. It probably doesn't sound better than the superior tubed offerings - but it certainly sounds better than the Anthem. I guess I can't be sure a retube wouldn't have pushed the Anthem over the top - but the Bryston does very, very good with the Amp1. The 3B-ST should be showing up within the next week and I really have no idea what to expect. I have heard there is a special synergy between the BP-20 and 3B-ST and that is what I am hoping for. Whatever the outcome - I'll be back either to whine or shout praise. later, Dean This message has been edited by deang on 02-07-2002 at 04:18 PM Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mobile homeless Posted February 7, 2002 Share Posted February 7, 2002 You are right. I have heard tube preamps that I didnt particularly like; in fact, I have never been too fond of the Anthem gear I have heard. I even think I mentioned this in the past in one of our exchanges. You could certainly do a lot better in the tube department. Some of your very complaints were things I noticed about the units as well. I alway found them a bit grainy and the amp just didnt have that much magic to me. It seemed a bit harsh and forward, which was surprising considering I was listening to it on a pair of older ProAc speakers, which are pretty smooth. And I am quite familiar with the Bryston gear. It is generally one of the few brands of solid state gear I like. Although I have never heard their preamp outside a hi-fi hut, I think their amps are very nice with tremedous bass and excellent slam and articulation, almost to a fault (it borders on Hi-Fi sound to me..not quite..but close). Still, I have always detected solid state sound in Bryston, although the ST series of amplifiers are far better in this regard. It is not horrifying by any means...but it is there, in my experience. Yet, I am sitting here as I type, believe it or not, listening to a stereo, Class A, zero feedback (global), Monarchy Audio SM-70. I have had it on for a few hours... What do I think? heh.... kh This message has been edited by mobile homeless on 02-07-2002 at 04:37 PM Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deang Posted February 7, 2002 Author Share Posted February 7, 2002 That Monarchy is still on my very short list. I will ultimately have to decide between it and that DIY kit we just talked about - I can't have them both. I will probably keep the Bryston and buy the kit. I think it's time I actually learned something ------------------ deanG Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
edster00 Posted February 7, 2002 Share Posted February 7, 2002 mh- quote: What do I think? heh.... So you are going to leave us hanging like that??? Actually, maybe you should at least let them settle in overnight or so... ------------------ Ed W This message has been edited by edster00 on 02-07-2002 at 05:43 PM Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deang Posted February 7, 2002 Author Share Posted February 7, 2002 he likes it but not as much as his Moondogs I bet ------------------ deanG Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colin Posted February 7, 2002 Share Posted February 7, 2002 I know little or nothing about tube pre-amps, stopped looking when I got the Dynaco tube pre-amp years ago, I liked it with my SS amp, like it with my 2A3 amps better, have not heard my 2A3 amps with a SS pre-amp, will hear that soon though ... ------------------ Colin's Music System Cornwall 1s & Klipsch subs; lights out & tubes glowing! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mobile homeless Posted February 7, 2002 Share Posted February 7, 2002 A tube preamp with solid state is a great compromise if you have to make one... I did it for 10 years before going all tube. To be honest, I have never liked solid state preamps with tube amps, no mater how good the preamp. Funny how it works that way. I dont mind a good passive with a tube amp, but a solid state preamp just seems to add a certain mechanical texture...a tactile nature that just does not mix with tube amps, no mater what kind. I have felt a passive and active tube preamp to both have their merits, ultimately preferring a good tube preamp if I had to make a choice. Still. Solid State has come a long, long way.... kh ------------------ Phono Linn LP-12 Vahalla / Linn Basic Plus / Sumiko Blue Point CD Player Rega Planet Preamp Cary Audio SLP-70 w/Phono Modified Amplifier Welborne Labs 2A3 Moondog Monoblocks Cable DIYCable Superlative / Twisted Cross Connect Speaker 1977 Klipsch Cornwall I w/Alnico & Type B Crossover system one online / alternate components / Asylum Listing f>s> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deang Posted February 7, 2002 Author Share Posted February 7, 2002 It really comes down to listening tastes. I was actually listening tonight and thinking how well that Bryston preamp matched to the Amp1. ------------------ deanG Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mobile homeless Posted February 7, 2002 Share Posted February 7, 2002 Possibly because of the quality of the Athem pre or possibly the Amp1. If you have a good tube amp, it seems as if a solid state preamp sort of compromises it in a way. I tell you one thing, a tube preamp with a good solid state amp is the better of the two compromises. I would be interested in your opinion how a top notch tube pre partnered with your 3B-ST. kh Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
edster00 Posted February 8, 2002 Share Posted February 8, 2002 deang: quote: he likes it but not as much as his Moondogs I bet heh... Tha't what I think of the SM-70! and he is leaving hints... ------------------ Ed W Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maxg Posted February 8, 2002 Share Posted February 8, 2002 "I have never liked solid state preamps with tube amps, no mater how good the preamp. " Oh great - my set up exactly - another thing to add to the budget - one tube pre-amp. Any advice on what would be a good match for my KT88's? So that's One tube pre-amp. Replace the monoblocks I have now with a 2A3 single ended blah blah. Revisit the vinyl issue. Just when I thought I liked my sound.... ------------------ 2 * Heresy 2 (mains) 2 * Homemade horn speakers (rears) 1 * REL Strata 3 sub Accuphase E211 amp. Tube monoblocks with separate pre-amp (solid state). Marantz CD6000 player Sony NS900 SACD/DVD player Stax Headphones Humax 5400 digital satellite receiver Sharp Video 32" Sony flat screen 16:9 TV Mogami interconnects Silver Synergistic speaker cable Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deang Posted February 8, 2002 Author Share Posted February 8, 2002 Be careful Max What someone else likes may not be what you like This whole thing is very subjective ------------------ deanG Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
edster00 Posted February 8, 2002 Share Posted February 8, 2002 Yea, if it's not broke don't "fix" it! Strange for me to say since I have been fixing for awhile now when I was already quite happy... ------------------ Ed W Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soundog Posted February 8, 2002 Share Posted February 8, 2002 I really like the combination of a Dynaco PAS4 tube preamp with the ss amp in my Outlaw receiver and my Klipschorns. I get the tube sound but also a real solid bass punch. I am looking forward to comparing this with an old EICO HF81 I recently purchased off ebay but have not yet found the time to hook-up and will probably need to upgrade. ------------------ Soundog's HT Systems Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deang Posted February 8, 2002 Author Share Posted February 8, 2002 It is true though that the system sounds more 'tubie' with a tube preamp/SS amp combo than with a SS preamp/tube amp combo. I find that odd. ------------------ deanG Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.