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Heresys on $20,000 tube rig?


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Methinks the hot air generated between listening selections by the audiophools in the listening room would be more likely to cause speaker discrepancies than hot air generated by something baking way out in the kitchen, but I could be mistaken since this is based solely upon my experience at Klipschhead gatherings.Wink

In which case we must have some means of ensuring that the "output" in the listening room is "cooled" off !!! To that end...

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I've had a ton of systems and can pretty much afford what ever my wife won't directly find out about [6] and for me it's not really about the money you spend but how well you spend the money....Spending $300 or $3000 on interconnects "can" be absolute bull$shit .....as a matter of fact spending $20K on an amp "can be absolute crap as well if your whole system isn't up to snuff...

Spending money does not get you one ounce of a better system: 1.) if your listening space is not properly treated 2.) if your front end is not high quality 3.) if you don't have excellent sources 4.) most important ...the expensive components actually work as they are supposed to and are not just overpriced marketing hype.....

I have taken the covers of some 10K monos that weight 150#'s only to find 120 #'s of cover and the cheapest components ....it looked pretty .....

There are a ton of mid priced components when properly combined can out preform a lot of the big boys out there.....

I love heresies, and have 2 pairs my self but if you've got 20K in an amp/pre????...What kind of front end are you running?...GIGO

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Spending $300 or $3000 on interconnects "can" be absolute bull$*** .....as a matter of fact spending $20K on an amp "can be absolute crap as well if your whole system isn't up to snuff...

[Y] Agreed. I like to compare building a hi-fi system to building a race car. You wouldn't place a $40k engine in a stock car with stock suspension, tires and brakes. On the other hand, you wouldn't place racing slicks on a stock Hyundai. It's all about synergy and balance. There is a place for $20k cables, just not in any system I'll ever afford. However, I believe most $20k hi-fi systems will greatly benefit from $2k speaker cables. Just my experience and opinion. [:)]
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Somehow... I just knew that this thread would eventually head to the "interconnect cable, speaker wire and probably "tweaks" arena. And we all know what could happen... and where it could even go after that... Is this the makings a "Noble Klipsch Tournament of the Titans" thread.

We've got it all covered in the title and the first post. It was like a knight errant arriving on a vast field, riding to the center and throwing down the gauntlet. Here's the story as it unfolds.

On the Field of Battle known as the Forum, provided by the late King Paul of the Empire of Klipsch begins the story. From all over the empire, from the minor kingdoms, petty fiefdoms, and other lands of fealty and noble estates come Knights of Tube Amp Audiophiles, Knights of the Solid State Stereophiles, Knights of the Klipschorn, and all other noble orders. Each knight may issue a challenge, and all noble born servants with appropriate Heritage in the Empire may accept. Those without Heritage may accept, but must be of a guild such as The Guild of Audio Engineers or the Guild of Lesser Artifacts of the Empire to be taken as more than a passing distraction from the battles bewteen the true Knights.

The contestants arrive, present their provenances, then pitch their tents, quarter their horses and servants. After privately sending their due respects to Princess Amy as the custom requires in the Empire, they begin to gird for the contest.

As is customary, the challenger sat alone on his magnificent war horse of the Twenty Two Kay breed in the middle of the Field, directly opposite the Two Channel stands where the crowds have begun to gather. His armor is covered by a dark cape, and a black cloth covers the shield. There is more to this than meets the eye. His placard of challenge has been posted by his squire above the gate to the Two Channel stands for all to see.

Heresy's on a $20,000 tube rig?

A simple challenge it would seem. But nothing could be further from the truth. As the story will tell, it was something totally different; something almost sublime; a subtle and well shielded ruse; and serving only to entice the the unprepared, unqualified and unwitting to enter the field of contest.

Heresy's? While it was an obvious challenge, it was not the true intention of the tournament. The call for Heresy's was instantly met with cries of "Cornwalls or Die", etc. Some noble defenders of the Heresy order rose up... but other than some obligatory posturing, generally called for Sir H-III, the master of that minor order to come forth, offered no challenge of substance. Sir H-III did ride forth and met with the knight. There was was proper salutation made, and some gentle conversation, but the battle was declined. Sir H-III was strangely silent upon his return. He conferred briefly with the heralds at the gate, who quickly announced that this was not a Crusade to confront the Knights of the Order of the Heresy (sometimes called heretics and often attacked by other knightly orders such as those followers of the Duke of Cornwall and sometimes those of the Queen of LaScala).

Some back and forth on that issue amongst the ever growing crowd of knights, but it quickly became evident that the true challenge was yet to be revealed. The Heresy followers, knowing that this was not to be their moment; and being generally pragmatic in their choice of contest, unsaddled their horses, shed their armor, swords and shields, and had the squires break out the mead horns. After all, a tournament is entertainment.

The most evident and daunting challenge to any was of course, the $20,000 tube rig war horse bearing the knight. There's race horses, war horses, and the ubiquitious work horses; all of which stand their masters in good stead, and many decided to enter the field and approach the Knight with faith in the steed that carried them.

In accord with standards for consideration set by the tournament's title, the knight sat upon that mighty $20k war horse awaiting challengers. As challengers approached, he refused battle with any challenger either bearing a sword with the marks of "Vintage Receiver", or carrying a shield with the "Lamp Cord" device.

There were also those inumerable unfortunate souls skirting the field on their AVR donkey's looking for a battlefield stereo nirvana secret moment to be revealed like Don Quixote waited for the windmill to surrender it's secrets. There were, however... no such revelations; no epiphanies, and no heavenly voices with firm guidance; thus those souls merely abandoned their hopes for HT adventure, and took their places in the stands to watch the saga unfold.

The bearers of the swords of vintage 70's receivers were among the first to fail in their quest for battle with the knight. They were confronted by the knight. The knight demanded to see the sword, and all swords must be bright and sharp and free of the telltale marks of vintage. Alas, before eben riding forth, many of those would be challengers with noble, revered vintage blades of the stereo wars examined their tool of war, and found that many had lost their sheen, and the blades had become dull as were the riders who had become long in the tooth. They returned to their tents, many secretly admitting to their squires that now was the time to pass the swords (via Ye Olde Garage Sale....) to the next generation of those aspiring to be knights - the pages & henchmen - who would need these vintage weapons to hone their skills before engaging in true battle.

Now, as each contender who passed the sword test approached closer, the knight, with a customary, but disdainful dip of the lance, pointed to the gauntlet for each to examine.

It was the lamp cord device scribed on the gauntlet, in sinister pose atop crossed thigh bones to signify mortality to those bearing such a shield that brought forth the challenge that the knight sought. Truly a "bait" that could not be resisted it was. The word spread throughout the tents and on the skirtings of the field. Those of the order of Lamp Cord knew in their hearts and souls that such a challenge demanded a reply, and as each knight bearing the "lamp cord" devices upon their escutcheon rode forth, they rallied in force..... And thus presented the errant one with the grand moment he sought.

Although surely impressed with this show of force, the knight did not appear to be swayed or in the least intimidated. Now ready for the clash, he threw back his cape to expose his mantling, and dropped the black cloth from his shield to reveal the true colors and his allegiance to the noble order he served.

The colors and devices of the Knights of the Audio Templar were emblazoned upon the escutcheon. Yes!! Two riders signifying tube monoblocs, upon a magnificent white tube war horse signifying purity of all sound, with each figure of the customary two riders carrying a war lance signifying esoteric speaker wire that would deliver the sound of truth to all enemies. His white mantling across the breast plate was simple; it carried only the familiar hummet cross device to signify the measure by which all who would challenge must abide. While the mantling cross itself served notice to all of his noble service in the Great Klipsch Crusades, it was not that which evoked the reverence and awe on that field.

The crowds stood silent; the challengers reigned in their steeds and opened their visors. The knight slowly, and with great care, removed his helmet. He reached inside and withdrew a small cloth parcel. He gently unfolded it; it was clearly a banner; he attached it to his lance and awaited as the breeze caused it to unfurl.

And at that moment, it was clear. As if a visiting star had appeared in the heavens illuminating the field and shining a holy beam of light upon the knight. Some immediately dropped to their knees in reverence, others merely stood in awe, while others headed to their tents to console themselves with their mead cups and damsels (another tale to be told, I'm sure..).

As this ballad be humbly recounted, that banner was neither Silver & White as would signify the peace and sincerity of the Knights of the Kingdoms of Zinfandel, Rhineland or even the Duchy of Champagne; nor was it that Blue & Gold signifying generosity and elevation of the mind often seen on the shield of those who fight for the cause of King Samuel Adams of Boston; nor was it the Black & Tenne Orange signifying worthy ambition of those brave and honorable servants of King Daniels, Baron Beam, or Count Chivas,or even those others who battle on behalf of the dukes and barons of the lands of Malts and Blends.

Nay. It was pure red, the color Gules, that blood red color signifying the heady red wine the Knights of the Audio Templars carry to Klipsch Tournaments to signify their status of true warriors.

Thus, it was neither the Knights of the Heresy's that he challenged, nor really the Warrior Knights of the Sword of Vintage Receivers, nay not even those who were astride the war horses of the Five, Ten or Twenty Kay breeds. And to be sure, and when all was clear, it was not even those humble and worthy knights who bore the Shield of the Lamp Cord that he wished to challenge; they were merely pawns in the game he had set forth. It was only those fortunate by birth, or choice, who had tasted and placed loyalty to the wine of the Templars that would be considered worthy.

Some rode forward with banners and pennants emblazoned with the red of the Irish Rose (a rebellious lot who have the reputation of fighting without any noble cause); some bearing the red device of the Kingdom of Boone (a poor provincial state often accused of having delusions of grandeur); and some with the reddish burgundy of Prince Gallo (a roguish lot who often call upon the names of their "godfathers" when engaged in battle).

In vain it was. The knight bested them all. Broken lances, shattered shields and lame horses littered the field. He stood triumphant. But was the contest over? So all thought. As the crowd began to disperse, the squires and pages running about gathering the debris and helping their masters off the field, a strange noise was heard coming from the Dark Forest of Tweaks.

From the edge of the woods came a single file of those strange wizards and magicians from the esoteric realm where all manner of things strange, simple, complex, and some of dubious utility are made and sold.

The first magician approached the knight and said, "Behold this esteemed knight!!! The Quantum Crystal!!!". The knight recoiled in fear, having never faced the Quantum Crystal. "I can defeat you at will, I can make your war horse go crazy, and cause your lances of speaker wire to coil and gain uncontrollable impedance", the wizard exclaimed. "And with me are the Magicians of Interconnects and the Witches of Turntable Slabs". The knight was silent, but all could see that the magician and his band was having a strange effect upon the knight. "What say you? Will you accept our superiority?, said the magician.

The knight slowly dismounted and called for his squire and his purse. He approached the magician, and the two stood close together and conversed for a few minutes. The magician reached into a sack around his neck and handed the knight something, and in return the knight handed the magician several gold coins.

What had happened? Will the Empire be safe? When will the truth be known?

The end of Chapter 1.....[:|]

Happy New Year!!!!!! [:D]

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Someone sat up all New Years Night and played way to much Dungeons and Dragons..... ConfusedBig Smile

We wuz in bed at 10:00 PM and fast asleep by 10:15... It came to me in a dream. Had alot damsels in the dream version... [6] Alot..... I was the one in distress (too many choices there...) but just when it was gonna' to get interesting[H].... I was awakened with a slap across the head...[:-*]

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Ok.... for Chapter 2... Fender!!! You're up!!! (Try to stay away from the damsel thing, that's actually in Chapter 8 when I go over the whole How We Defeated Wicked Witch of the WAF part of the saga). Colter will be in there as well playing the part of the Wizard of Industrial Oz at some point....

Jake! you know I can't type for beans....took me three min. just to peck out this one line......

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Good one Groom. But I need some CliffsNotes or something. Maybe when the chapters are complete, you can publish a "Hi Fi for Dummies" edition for me so I can better read past the, although interesting, longwinded Celtic prose. I'm still having terrible flashbacks to English Lit. 101 (A concentration on 16th century English literature and history). [:^)]

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The Knight, now in possession of the Amulet from the Wizards neck, started to feel strangely euphoric.

Time and all of it's essence had started to collapse in upon itself, but only for the knight, no one else was effected. Past, present and future, were now meaningless for the knight...it was this fact alone that allowed him to realize how back in the day's of yore...Centuries before electricity had even been discovered, that they could indeed have amplified music!!!

heck all there should have been was lyre's and lute's and such....but indeed there were monoblocks, preamps, power conditioners....and the knight had come to the only conclusion possible......Somebody had interfered with the fabric of space time, causing a tear in temporal causality, and creating an alternate reality, one in which all knights of the realm were about to do battle!

The Knight needed to think, was was the last thing that the Wizard had mumbled just before abruptly disappearing? Something about, "need to get back to the twins" The twins? twin what? what could this riddle mean?

then it struck the knight.....and he closely examined the Amulet, finding an inscription printed on the back "Empire 398"

What did this mean? the 398th Empire? imperial empire? (nahhh thats another story)......The knight now new he was on a quest....

Abruptly, the knight ripped the amulet from his neck, threw it to the ground, unsheathed his sword, and cleft the amulet in twain........

The stars started to fall from the sky and appeared to be swallowed by the amulet, the knight edging closer to the event horizon, was sucked into the newly formed vortex.......

All at once the knight appeared in Cern right in the control room of the Hadron Collider, where a cloaked figure was inserting an object to be bombarded by proton bursts......the object looked familiar it was the Idler wheel from an Empire 398 ! The amulet!

"what are you doing???" asked the knight

"I am attempting to create a contained singularity inside of my turntable part" "this will enable me to control time and space, letting me write long diatribes when ever I feel like it...." answered the cloaked figure.

the knight thought the cloaked figure sounded remarkably like the wizard and decided to remove his cloak........."Thebes!!!!!!!!"

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Conquistador your stallion stands
in need of company
and like some angel's haloed brow
you reek of purity
I see your armour-plated breast
has long since lost its sheen
and in your death mask face
there are no signs which can be seen

And though I hoped for something to find
I could see no maze to unwind

Conquistador a vulture sits
upon your silver shield
and in your rusty scabbard now
the sand has taken seed
and though your jewel-encrusted blade
has not been plundered still
the sea has washed across your face
and taken of its fill

And though I hoped for something to find
I could see no maze to unwind

Conquistador there is no time
I must pay my respect
and though I came to jeer at you
I leave now with regret
and as the gloom begins to fall
I see there is no, only all
and though you came with sword held high
you did not conquer, only die

And though I hoped for something to find
I could see no maze to unwind

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 I recently saw an article "50 scientific things we didn't know a year ago." It was a fascinating little list. That caused me to wonder, how many things didn't we know in 1978? What actually makes science science, is that it is built on the idea of constantly disproving what we think we already know. 

Every amplifier brochure I read in 1978 assured me this design was the "ultimate" and the "final reference" and that sonic perfection had been achieved and embodied right there in that product. In all things scientific, certitude precedes a fall.

Thank you for summing up so well the very point I've tried to make to the many nay-sayers who believe (from an engineering standpoint) that there are no differences between two types of speaker cables, or interconnects, or even isolation devices. I completely agree that science is ever evolving and how could we be so naive to think that all that is needed to know about audio has already been discovered? The last fifty years have seen many improvements in sound reproduction. Are we to think the next fifty will not bring as many... or more? Tubes and vinyl continue to improve long after their discovery and supposed golden age. Solid state amplifier design is the very best it's ever been and continuing to improve. Cables are a young technology and relatively unexplored compared with amplifier design or even CD playback. The last fifteen years have seen major advancements in cable design and sound, and I have no reason to believe it's not just the tip of the iceberg. Paul Klipsch and Roger Russell were amazing engineers in their day and we've much to thank them for, however I believe their expertise predated modern cable technology. To use them as a reason to not explore cables, is akin to believing Julian Hirsch when he told his readers that all amplifiers (if of similar spec) should sound the same. If it looks the same on paper then it should sound the same. [:P] Thankfully, this is not true.
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I recently saw an article "50 scientific things we didn't know a year ago." It was a fascinating little list. That caused me to wonder, how many things didn't we know in 1978? What actually makes science science, is that it is built on the idea of constantly disproving what we think we already know.

Every amplifier brochure I read in 1978 assured me this design was the "ultimate" and the "final reference" and that sonic perfection had been achieved and embodied right there in that product. In all things scientific, certitude precedes a fall.

Well said.

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