Barista Posted February 11, 2002 Share Posted February 11, 2002 First post, and it's a big one. I've done a lot of reading around here, and spent a good part of my life drooling over the Klipsch.com site. First off, who am I, and what is the validity of my comments? Ive been a long time HiFi/HT enthusiast. I dont call my self an audiophile, as I have a lot to learn. The moniker audiophile, IMHO, should reflect someone with a very distinguished ear, a clear understanding of audio theory, as well as a vast vocabulary of auditioned speakers. I wouldnt say I am green to HiFi, as Ive been listening to music all of my life (All of 25 years) and Ive spent a majority of my money, spare time, and effort seeking Audio Nirvana. So I would say, Im an Audio Enthusiast, seeking sonic enlightenment. Until, just recently, I had spent my life listening to Mass Market Speakers (Sony, Bose, Polk, Kenwood, Zenith, etc). Other than short trips to the local HiFi shop, Ive never listened to what many of you would consider a REAL speaker. Im sure you will agree though, there is no way to fully appreciate a speaker in the busy hustle of a HiFi shop. There is simply no replacement for bringing a speaker to your house, and spending some quality time alone with them, in your own environment, with your own music. Enter Klipsch. Ive been eyeing Klipsch for all of my life. The town I grew up in was little more than an hour from where it all started, Hope Ar. Around those parts, anyone who was serious about audio had Klipsch. I can remember 15 years ago when I saw my first set of Klipsch speakers. One of my school mates father had a set of Heresys. Even at that age, I knew what they were, the Klipsch reputation, and the almost cult following that ensued. I have told myself ever since I would one day own a pair when money permits. Enter RF-5s. I am truly a lucky man. A few days ago, I was able to acquire a pair of slightly used RF-5s. They replaced my Sony MF-515 Towers (Twtr, Mid, & 2x6.5 Woofers), and hooked up to my Sony STR-333ES Receiver. I started by placing the RF-5s next to the Sonys for some A/B comparisons. Not that I am skeptical, just that I am a realist. If I can place two speakers together, I can use my past as a reference for the future, and if in contrast there is no perceivable difference, Ill be the first one to call BS and move on to the next stop. So how does an audiophile grade speaker stand against the best mass-market Sony speaker you can throw at it? No comparison, hands down the RF-5s were so superior, in every way. Imagine that? CD after CD, the Klipsch had a resolution, and clarity I had never heard before in any loudspeaker. Such amazing sensitivity, turning my volume to 9:00 (0 being at 7:00) the 5s chug along at a cool 90db. The RF-5s seemed to reproduce every nuance without effort. Low frequencies seem to flow smooth, deep, and with more than adequate punch without any speaker straining or blaring. At 90db in a rather large living room, the 5s seemed no more stressed than I was sinking into my favorite chair. The high-end, and clarity seemed to tickle my ears in a way Ive never experienced. I am truly blown away. Call it a musical rebirth. Here is where the jaw hits the ground. Ive been reading lots of theory lately, and figured What the hell, the wife is out so Ill rearrange the living room based off the theoretical optimum positioning of the speakers and listening position. Ive often heard people preach the importance of optimum speaker placement, and let me tell you this. If you can take any one thing from what I say, take this. Try arranging your living room around your speakers, and not your speakers around your living room. Other than the RF-5s themselves, I have to say this has had the single biggest impact on my system. Period. It opened up so much depth, body, and pin point imaging that I was left speechless in my bliss. It was like hearing music for the very first time. There is an amazing 3d sound stage that I have never heard before. Sure, Ive heard soundstages before. Drummer on the left, sax in the left middle, bass flowing from the right, bla bla bla, whatever. It all pales to this. I literally have vocals that, according to my brain, are standing 10 feet in front of me, 5 off the floor, two foot left of center, and coming from a space in thin air. I can literally stair at a place on my wall, and its singing to me. If I closed my eyes and threw the remote, the singer would have to duck. Its that real, and personally its one of the biggest sonic miracles Ive experienced in the 25 years of my life. Again, my jaw was on the floor and I am in total disbelief in the sound before me. I simply could not believe it. It is amazing. Welcome to the next level I suppose. Klipsch, thank you for creating such an amazing speaker, and at a price the average citizen can afford. Now I just have to figure out where I can scrape up the money to get a matching center, sub, and surrounds (Eeek). There is such a tonal difference between the rest of my Sony speakers that watching Tv and Movies has somewhat edged towards an act of confusion. The tonal difference has all but destroyed any 5-channel imaging that was once there, even when levels are calibrated using a 75db reference test tone. Hmmm, maybe its time for a second job to feed my new Klipsch habit. ------------------ Barista T. Bill This message has been edited by Barista on 02-11-2002 at 04:16 PM Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Manuel Delaflor Posted February 11, 2002 Share Posted February 11, 2002 quote: Originally posted by Barista: Hmmm, maybe its time for a second job to feed my new Klipsch habit. lol, welcome to the forum Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mobile homeless Posted February 11, 2002 Share Posted February 11, 2002 I have tried to preach speaker placement for years and years... Many of the horn brigade are stuck on the "in the corner" routine. Many more will say that "soundstage" is overrated or even completely artificial. Horns do tend to be more directional, but bringing any speaker (besides the Khorn) out from the corners increases imaging, a realization of a soundstage with a font and back and instruments located in the space of the venue (especially for a live, properly miked recording). Some might go for the increased bass with corner placement..But I almost ALWAYS found that bringing the speakers OUT from the room bounderies to be a positive thing, especially with monitor speakers. I admit, I have more Cornwalls back in the corners about 10 inches from rear and sides. I thought they sounded BETTER out in my room, however. IT is just not feasible in this abode. My last system at my girlfriend's apartment revolving around monitors and/or ProAcs had the speakers over 4.5 feet from the wall and 8-10 feet from the side walls. http://66.155.4.65/eico_hf-81/eico_system_full.htm The imaging and soundstage was amazing and jaw dropping to say the least. The first time people hear this, they cant believe it. Still, I am getting a very good soundstage even with the CW nearer the corners; so far, this has been about the only speaker to do this due to horns better directional nature. kh ------------------ Phono Linn LP-12 Vahalla / Linn Basic Plus / Sumiko Blue Point CD Player Rega Planet Preamp Cary Audio SLP-70 w/Phono Modified Amplifier Welborne Labs 2A3 Moondog Monoblocks Cable DIYCable Superlative / Twisted Cross Connect Speaker 1977 Klipsch Cornwall I w/Alnico & Type B Crossover system one online / alternate components / Asylum Listing f>s> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris Robinson Posted February 11, 2002 Share Posted February 11, 2002 Mobile, I always feel like a voyeur when looking at pictures of other people's living quarters but I do want to say "nice setup!" Couldn't help but notice that old dreadnought leaning up against the wall ... Kind of looked like a mid-60's Martin (D-18 or something)? Tell me your a "picker and a grinner" ------------------ If you don't like what is coming out, you wouldn't like what is going in." -PWK- --------------------- Klipsch 1968 ALK Cornwall "II"s (LF/RF) ALK Belle Klipsch (Center) Klipsch Heresy (RR/LR) Klipsch KSW-12 sub Sonic Frontiers Anthem AMP1 (driving Cornwalls) Sonic Frontiers Anthem AMP1 (driving Heresy's) Denon AVR-4800 Toshiba SD-3109 DVD Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HornEd Posted February 11, 2002 Share Posted February 11, 2002 Welcome Barista... You are closer to a better 5.1 experience than you realize. 5.1 anticipates have five identical full-range speakers and a subwoofer. The most important speaker is the center... make it an RF5 (even if you have to build a modified motor board to turn it horizontal) and you have the most important 3/5ths of your main speakers making a big difference in your HT and multi-channel music life. Of course, the second most important speaker is a great subwoofer... and your post was too short to cover that end of your journey. Your on the right track, once you get center, the rest can come along when you can make it happen. Enjoy! HornEd =========================================== Brain MUST Be Engaged Before Shifting Into EAR! =========================================== "Where Klipsch Legends Cavort Six Ways to Someday!" FOREGROUND SOUND STAGE: KLF 30's: Left Main, Center Main, Right Main SB-2's: L & R Front Effects on 5' sand filled columns BACKGROUND SOUND STAGE: KLF 30's: Left Surround, Rear Effects, Right Surround LARGE MOUTH BASS: Twin SVS CS-Ultra subs, Samson Megawatt Amp KLIPSCH SPEAKER SUPPORT SYSTEMS: Mitsubishi RPHD1080i 65", Yamaha RX-V3000 Receiver Toshiba Pro Scan 6200, Toshiba Pro 6-head SVHS W808 in constant homage of the Eternal Tweak! Music Respite Room: Vintage Cornwall's in Transition Klipsched Class "A" Motorhome: On the road testing Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mobile homeless Posted February 11, 2002 Share Posted February 11, 2002 And then, miraculously, you flee from the 2 Channel forum...you have crossed the point of no return... you are ONE OF THEM. kh Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barista Posted February 11, 2002 Author Share Posted February 11, 2002 I spent this whole evening listening to the 5s again. I was almost in disbelief of what I heard the day before. Yeap, still there, and in so many levels. No sub, straight 2 channel. Luckily the Sony STR-333ES has a straight through 2 channel bypassing the DSP and going straight into the amp (Well, EQ too). When I put the receiver into ANY sound field, resolution was lost, and in came the sludge locking the horn and woofers into a muddled abyss. Had a good friend over (A musician as well), and he was as enthralled as was I. Hehehe, its funny. Its like seeing someone watching HDTV for the first time. In a way it seems the Reference Series is the High Definition of Audio. He had the same kind of blissful half smile as me. Tapping feet, nodding heads. Which leads me to my next question. Does anyone have a SACD setup out there with these? I bet that sound amazing. quote: The most important speaker is the center... make it an RF5 Im truly afraid of how bad my receiver would butcher a good center. Seems anything having to do with the Sony ES DSP all but ruins the quality. Even Auto Format Decode (2 channel too) witch has no effects as I can tell, sounds muddled with a very narrow sound field. Anyone want to comment on a decent priced receiver, which might provide quality reproduction in 5 channels? Rotel looks nice. quote: And then, miraculously, you flee from the 2 Channel forum...you have crossed the point of no return... I dont know. With my budget, Ill be here a while. Besides, a receiver who can reproduce a good 2 channel musical recording in 5.1 is a rare bird is it not? I also think there is some gold to be found in tube amplification as well. Call me sentimental, but Ive got to explore that avenue a little more. Anyone seen the Olympics in HD yet? I havent been able to turn on my TV for 3 days. ------------------ Barista T. Bill Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mike stehr Posted February 11, 2002 Share Posted February 11, 2002 Two channel is Cool! I don't think you will find 5.1 tube stuff. I like to keep things simple. This message has been edited by mike stehr on 02-11-2002 at 11:48 PM Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deang Posted February 12, 2002 Share Posted February 12, 2002 I would only do multichannel if I hit the lottery. I have enough trouble getting 2 channel to play at a level I find acceptable. My two channel amps weigh more than most 5 channel amps. ------------------ deanG Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mobile homeless Posted February 12, 2002 Share Posted February 12, 2002 Stick with HIGHER quality 2 Channel. With proper source, amplification, placement, and attention to detail, you will yield three-dimensional sound that is far more transparent - alive - "umuddled" as you call it, and realistic. Music will not seem like amusement park ride... Suddenly, it will sound more natural, less processed... and you will forget the process-O-Rama boom-chick-boom of Pearl Harbor Soundtrack. But, hell, that's just my unmitigated, biased opinion. Remove the 5 channel receivers, junk, gadgets, buttons, controls, blinking lights, gyroscopes, soundfield joy stick, and IT WILL COME! DE-BOSE the brain... kh Phono Linn LP-12 Vahalla / Linn Basic Plus / Sumiko Blue Point CD Player Rega Planet Preamp Cary Audio SLP-70 w/Phono Modified Amplifier Welborne Labs 2A3 Moondog Monoblocks Cable DIYCable Superlative / Twisted Cross Connect Speaker 1977 Klipsch Cornwall I w/Alnico & Type B Crossover system one online / alternate components / Asylum Listing f>s> This message has been edited by mobile homeless on 02-12-2002 at 09:35 AM Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mike stehr Posted February 12, 2002 Share Posted February 12, 2002 Good thing you posted that here, and not the Home Theater Forum. Much agreed, more junk in the single path just makes it more of a PITA. Think about it Mobile, A lot of these guys have more into HT gear than your two channel rig. If you watch DVD 90% of the time, I could understand. My money only dictates two channel, and I am fine, but would like too experience the valve thing, soon. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheEAR Posted February 12, 2002 Share Posted February 12, 2002 Mobile Home, "Remove the 5 channel receivers, junk, gadgets, buttons, controls, blinking lights, gyroscopes, soundfield joy stick, and IT WILL COME! DE-BOSE the brain... " Damn right,more knobs and gizmos = severed sound quality and castrated muicality. De-Bose the brain,good one Mobile. LOL TheEAR(s) Now theears Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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