JohnA Posted March 21, 2009 Share Posted March 21, 2009 Really wish someone could prove me wrong but to me, a decent vinyl rig will smoke a CD player.Doomed to the ritual. Agreed. But then I discovered DVD-Audio at 24b/192kHz. Even 24/96 is very good, as good as vinyl.IMHO. I know changing from 16/44.1 to 24/96 or 192 is not supposed to make enough difference to be audible, but I find that indescribable diference to be there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mallette Posted March 21, 2009 Share Posted March 21, 2009 Really wish someone could prove me wrong but to me, a decent vinyl rig will smoke a CD player.Doomed to the ritual. Agreed. But then I discovered DVD-Audio at 24b/192kHz. Even 24/96 is very good, as good as vinyl.IMHO. I know changing from 16/44.1 to 24/96 or 192 is not supposed to make enough difference to be audible, but I find that indescribable diference to be there. Yeah. Back on topic... I've done A/B's for audiophiles and "normal" folks as well of vinyl and the same vinyl at 24/88.2 and not a soul has been able to tell the difference. To me, this THE way to test digital, in that when you record from vinyl you are getting any influence from the table, arm, cart, preamp, et al and recording it. It's the reason I find the debate silly. Digital is technically superior to analog in every way. Try cutting an LP at home. Heck, even making a good reel to reel or cassette requires a bit of skill. Grab a Korg MR-1, your laptop with a late model HD chipset, or whatever and I can have you making digital clones of anything you have in a few minutes, no high priests needed. That does NOT mean it sounds better than one of the few near perfect LPs, as they are capable of recording everything you can hear, but it means it sounds every bit as good and is certainly a lot handier, easier, and cheaper to re-constitute to sound. Further, it will continue to sound that way as long as the bits are preserved as it is incapable of wear. I have three turntables, and I love each and every one of them. They sit on polished granite with ballasted bases the PAW and I joined forces to design and build. They won't go away until I do as they perform a required function in my musical life. But they are not sacred and they are not the end product of acoustic preservation. I've compared them to the analog gunnery computers on the Iowa class battleships. When these ships were re-outfitted it was assumed the analog aimming computers would be replaced with modern digital ones. However, it was found they were inherently unimprovable. That is not the lesson, however. The battleships themselves are now gone and rest in places of honor. The same will happen to the LP...after us old sailors are all gone. Dave Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hifi jim Posted March 21, 2009 Share Posted March 21, 2009 Dave, I respect your computer skills and needs but I'm not sure what more you could ask for from an OS, at least a daily notebook with music server abilities? iTunes is not what you think. Unlike other servers, iTunes will accept your disk and immediately download all of its title and track information, or automatically connect online to find the proper information. The average cd is uploaded and automatically filed in your music library in a couple of minutes, complete with album artwork. Drag and drop the rare art not in the iTunes catalog. Only custom cds, bootlegs, etc. need to be manually input. Have you seen the McIntosh (no relation) MS300 music server? It comes with a keyboard... yeah like I've got time for that. This is all automatic and beautifully done. Smooth as silk operation like any iPod, iPhone. Played wirelessly as I write this, it is a joy for everyday music from anywhere inside or out with remote volume. My friend was so impressed with the sound and interface, he purchased a Macbook and Airport thinking it would be a music server only and never replace his new desktop PC. That was a year ago. His PC has disappeared. I encourage everyone to get a Mac laptop as a music server alone, but chances are you'll love it as a computer. Now I know you dislike its proprietary nature, but iTunes can convert and store any number of formats any number of times, and they can all be burned to CD. I've purchased a single song or two from the iTunes store, and then later purchased the CD. But comparing the CD I burned with the downloaded file verse the commercial copy proved indistinguishable on most. I use the Apple Lossless code and think it really sounds great. I also use the Apple Time Capsule which is a wireless router and 1 Terabyte hard drive that automatically stores all of my files. I don't think about it, and everything works beautifully. No crashes, no problems. If I had an iPhone, or iTouch, it would act as a remote for iTunes, and everything connects easily and smoothly using BlueTooth or Wi-Fi. When I purchase my next laptop, or any computer for that matter, my files from my current computer will automatically transfer to my new computer. My Apple TV, which allows you to buy and rent HD movies and tv shows, view photos on tv, and play music is another simple Apple device. It's wireless, so I unboxed it, plugged the HDMI and power cable in and I was done. All shows, music videos, movies, photos, music... everything is backed up on the Time Capsule. One guy dies, or the management steals, and you're sunk. I'm not worried about Apple going under anytime soon, even in this economy... they are the largest music retailer and sell the most popular MP3 player ever. Mismanaged? Well, I guess you could argue that you never see that one coming, but I can always burn all my music back to CD, and that is good enough for me. [] For me, and my idea of simplicity (I hate computer foul ups and things I don't understand), this is Heaven. And all of their devices are constantly updated seemlessly to improve security and add new features. At $1200 for the laptop and Airport Express, there is nothing at any price that can really compare. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BLSamuel Posted March 21, 2009 Share Posted March 21, 2009 My TT still boots INSTANTLY and never crashes. My approximately 20 year old Dual CS 5000 takes 1 to 2 secondes or is it one or two rotations for the speed control to lock? [] Blazing fast to any PC I've owned. []. And like Dave's, it never crashes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mallette Posted March 21, 2009 Share Posted March 21, 2009 Doggonit, Jim, you're a disciple. I can name have a dozen free utilities that doe precisely what you are saying on Linux alone. In my case, I prefer Exact Audio Copy, which is almost as easy but does require a bit of skill to get the most out of it. In any event, you are certainly correct that Apple is now a music company and computers are a sideline. Without Jobs, it's probably a sideline they won't be able to afford for very long. They just about went under before he returned in glory. Good on him, but nobody lives forever. If Apple OS was a trully preemptive multitasking OS of a reasonable, say 200mb (and that's really too large) and wasn't dongled I'd be likely to drink the cool-aid. However, been there, done that, and I'm whipped. I've seen nothing but regression in computer systems in the past 15 years and now all my programmers tell is "Dave, it can't do that." It's usually something we did before we found out it couldn't be done. I've just put together a VESA mount unit that will be about an inch thick, 8X10", 1.5ghz processor, hardware mpeg, 1mpixel camera, wireless n, embbeded OS, and will cost the company about 750.00 mounted to a 24" monitor ready to run. We're going to put one on every rig in the fleet worldwide Yes, it's gonna run XP...it's the only game in town, but it would work better with Linux. It would work a LOT better with Amiga, BeOS, and several other late, lamented REAL operating systems. Arguing the merits of the current computer scene harks back to the Blues and the Reds of the chariot teams of Constantinople. They are just colors of the same thing and whoever the emperor bets on is going to win. Sorry to sound so cynical, but I've been in this business a long time and, while it is still making me a good living, it has disappointed me. We should not be having this discussion via keyboard but by VR by now. Really. Dave Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hifi jim Posted March 21, 2009 Share Posted March 21, 2009 See, that's why Apple suits me so well and not you. I caught about half, or make that a third of what you're talking about. Your computer lingo shoots straight over my head, and I probably look like my gf does when I start jabbering about audio... or the Mets. I remember the Amiga though. Took computer graphics in HS on those, and my uncle had one that played Test Drive better than any video game console could for years. My artsy ex girlfriend got me into the Mac craze, and refuse it I did but she made the best Kool-Aid! [] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mallette Posted March 21, 2009 Share Posted March 21, 2009 See, that's why Apple suits me so well and not you. I caught about half, or make that a third of what you're talking about. Your computer lingo shoots straight over my head, and I probably look like my gf does when I start jabbering about audio... or the Mets. I remember the Amiga though. Took computer graphics in HS on those, and my uncle had one that played Test Drive better than any video game console could for years. My artsy ex girlfriend got me into the Mac craze, and refuse it I did but she made the best Kool-Aid! Good on you, Jim. Enjoy! I am really a frustrated old nerd...and I mean that! I'm just peeing on your parade and I should shut up, and that's just what I'm gonna do, about two or three posts too late. Dave Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hifi jim Posted March 22, 2009 Share Posted March 22, 2009 Good on you, Jim. Enjoy! I am really a frustrated old nerd...and I mean that! I'm just peeing on your parade and I should shut up, and that's just what I'm gonna do, about two or three posts too late. Oh it's all right Dave. We're both nerds if we're debating computer systems (some that don't exist anymore) on a Saturday night. [:|] [] I just enjoy understanding anothers perspective on most anything, including computers which I don't know much about. [:#] I'm very impressed with how inexpensively one can build a PC though, referring to the refurbs you were speaking of. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mallette Posted March 22, 2009 Share Posted March 22, 2009 Good on you, Jim. Enjoy! I am really a frustrated old nerd...and I mean that! I'm just peeing on your parade and I should shut up, and that's just what I'm gonna do, about two or three posts too late. Oh it's all right Dave. We're both nerds if we're debating computer systems (some that don't exist anymore) on a Saturday night. I just enjoy understanding anothers perspective on most anything, including computers which I don't know much about. I'm very impressed with how inexpensively one can build a PC though, referring to the refurbs you were speaking of. Crikey...we're doing this in real time almost. [^o)] Dave Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hifi jim Posted March 22, 2009 Share Posted March 22, 2009 Crikey...we're doing this in real time almost. Nope, it's Sunday here. [] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jamesV Posted March 22, 2009 Share Posted March 22, 2009 As I haven't really had a good CDP I can say that I really enjoy my vinyl. I do listen to music on my Oppo 981 but that is hooked up to the HT so stereo is with RF-83's. While I can sit a listen for a few hours with the Cornwalls and vinyl as it just seems more relaxed. Granted that you need clean material for a pop and crack free listening but once that is achieved it sounds great. JMHO James Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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