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Daddy Dee

What makes some tractrix horns suitable for HF?

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"uses a narrow diffraction slot, yet is regarded in "ultra-fi" circles as an exceptionally good sounding horn"

The slot is in the other plane, and thus can be much wider and still control the dispersion.

The smaller HR90 sounds great. It is designed for 800hz/12dB, but may be used as low as 630hz/24dB.


I also like the HP640. It may be crossed at 400hz/24dB for home use.

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I see the biggest limitation of the DIY tractrix horns being the mating of the driver to the horn....or basically, the inability to design your own phase plug and the difficulty of trying to maintain a smooth tractrix expansion through the throat. The tolerances become a bigger issue as you move higher in frequency too.

Bentz. All of these horns are the same as you know. Edgar style tractrix horns with the intent for midrange only. Greg's V-trac, and the three horns Gothover has out there are built on the same principle. They are pure tractrix with zero attempt to modify to help with higher frequencies or polars or anything else.

I'm gonna take a stab to say that although "limitation" in principle......we can beat this up all day and I'm gonna bet that people who decide to listen to these horns verses what was in the heritage stock, majority are gonna chose the tractrix ones.

So for those that want to improve on these horns that are circulating out there.........start building. Make a target to get the curves cleaner, polars better and to have better HF extension. Let's not forget that we want it to sound good.

I'm totally serious. Right DD...what can we do to get the HF for 2 way....whos gonna f/u on these ideas. I want to see it done.

djk......I was wondering if the Faital Pro drivers sounded good. Have you heard any of their cone midranges horn loaded?

jc

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I just want to mention in passing that this is often true, but should not be taken as a general guideline. For example, the long-discontinued EV HR9040 CD horn uses a narrow diffraction slot, yet is regarded in "ultra-fi" circles as an exceptionally good sounding horn. As always, YMMV

I've heard the 9040, 6040, and 4020 horns all with DH1A drivers and would never consider using them in the home (especially the 4020). I'm sure it's not as bad at quieter levels, but they still have a diffraction slot type sound to them. Not as sizzly as the old JBL biradial horns though.

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Bentz. All of these horns are the same as you know. Edgar style tractrix horns with the intent for midrange only. Greg's V-trac, and the three horns Gothover has out there are built on the same principle. They are pure tractrix with zero attempt to modify to help with higher frequencies or polars or anything else.

I'm gonna take a stab to say that although "limitation" in principle......we can beat this up all day and I'm gonna bet that people who decide to listen to these horns verses what was in the heritage stock, majority are gonna chose the tractrix ones.

So for those that want to improve on these horns that are circulating out there.........start building. Make a target to get the curves cleaner, polars better and to have better HF extension. Let's not forget that we want it to sound good.

I'm totally serious. Right DD...what can we do to get the HF for 2 way....whos gonna f/u on these ideas. I want to see it done.

I hope I didn't come across as knocking the DIY designs....I agree that they likely sound better than the stock Klipsch Heritage stuff, and I only say likely because I haven't heard one for myself yet.

I also agree that it's just better to build something better than to just talk about it all the time. I've actually got a few designs ready to go, just no means to get them realized. It's mostly a time issue for me as I just have way too many projects on my plate right now.

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It would be cool if someone would offer a DIY design for two way. I think it would be a real challenge and would have to make several stabs at it. I'm interested to see how it is done.

jc

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It would be cool if someone would offer a DIY design for two way. I think it would be a real challenge and would have to make several stabs at it. I'm interested to see how it is done.

jc

JC, have a look at the quadratic throat horns that I provided links for (Charles Hughes - Peavey design). I'll confess that I have not made them yet, but they look very do-able. They have a CD dispersion and can be made axisymetric or not. He even provides some info on the distortion measures.

Okay, have I succeeded in "volunteering" you?

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Okay, have I succeeded in "volunteering" you?

whew......the pressure. Well I'm really not interested in building a top horn right now......the last one I jigged up is now a fixture on my kids playground.

I enjoy building bass horns better. However, that doesn't keep me from scratching up the design on paper and sending it to someone else to build.

I'll read up on your link...but I would bet I would need to read up a lot more to offer something worth building for two way.

jc

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It would be cool if someone would offer a DIY design for two way. I think it would be a real challenge and would have to make several stabs at it. I'm interested to see how it is done.

jc

I've been thinking about this project for a while now. I think it's important for the horn to be tested as part of the design. I'll be the first to say that test curves only tell part of the story, I'll use my ears for the rest. But I also think it's critical to have that starting point of a good test. No disrespect intended, but a lot of the tests I see being done on horns seem to be too flawed for me. I want to be able to test in very controlled conditions and get curves that are as accurate as possible. I've been thinking about ways to build a space to do testing at my shop, where I can keep reflections down to a bare minimum and be able to do consistent tests from one speaker to another.

It's time for me to get set up to test speakers.

Greg

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Look, like I have mentioned before, get in line to hear Greg's v-trac demo's with the BMS drivers and you will then get it.Until you have heard a high quality 2 " mid tractix horn and drivers that the demo's offer, there is nothing else for the average home khorn setup that will beat it. One inch, two way or whatever. You people have to hear this. I realize that there are better bass bin designs and Greg has admitted to this but this is a next level upgrade and one as for as home use will be hard to beat. Like we all say, let your ears be the last word.

Thanks,

Randy

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Thinking about the original title of this tread, has anyone
tried the Faital with a circular tractrix like the Stereo-Lab CF250 for a 2-way
system? I have read glowing reports of
the Eliptrac in a similar application, I would love to know how a circular
performs. Thoughts?





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I think you will find yourself wanting a tweeter (like their CF1000) with this horn, it gets very narrow in the top octave.

http://www.diysoundgroup.com/horns/autotech-horns/iwata300.html

This might be a better choice for a two-way. It is not as expensive as it seems as it ships from the USA, the Stereo-Lab horns ship from Europe, and the 'FREE OF SHIPPING COSTS' means that shipping is not included in the posted price.



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