DACs with USB

[philipbarrett]

Your cousin's analogy is an excellent one. Just as a car engine uses a timing belt to synchronize the mechanical functions so digital audio needs a timing clock to synchronize the data.

As discussed above, some digital audio signals contain this timing data which the receiving device can read and some signals require the receiving device to re-create the timing data. IMO this re-creation is where the most audible artifacts occur.

To confuse issues, some DAC (digital to analog convertors) ignore the signals timing data and recreate their own. This is common in the USB world where low end, off the shelf chips are used to build interfaces. A fantastic guide to Adaptive & Asynchronous USB can be found here (although I wonder about the author's use of expensive solutions to an inherent problem when the FW alternative is available):

http://www.computeraudiophile.com/content/Asynchronicity-USB-Audio-Primer

In a nutshell, Firewire offers the best solution at the lowest price. The FW audio signal contains a clock and all FW chipsets use this clock to synchronize their workings to the incoming data stream. Signal coloration is minimized, mostly leaving the analog section to define the "sound" of the system. Of course there are better and worse FW systems (professionally we use interfaces costing many $1,000s) but I believe that the clock resolution gives even the most basic FW interfaces the edge over DACs costing much more.

[The Dude]

Well after reading this several times and looking at all the products, and your in the nutshell of it all I think I finally understand were your coming from. The nice thing about it all is I am some what of a musicain that is always trying to find a interface that alows me to record my stuff to my comp, and with this I am able to do that plus have great play back from computer. Funny I remember a few years ago I was looking at usb interface for recording but like I said this looks like it would be a way better deal. So thanks for your help again on understanding.

[captmobley]

So,

Speak very slowly for us technologically challegened-I have a new Macbook Pro-that has a firewire port

If I understand, and please correctly me if I'm wrong-

all I need is the Behringer fca202-a fire wire cable to it-then RCA cables out to my HT amp(or 2 channel amp)

and it will play from my ITUNES?

[The Dude]

thats how I am understanding, and from what Philip is saying it will be just as good of sound since the dacs wont clock with the rest of the comp. They will be alot cheaper to. One thing I think I have noticed is that you don't have to go with the behringer, there are other brands out there its just that the behringer is very low cost. You just need something with a firewire port that has analog outs.

[philipbarrett]

Exactly, y'all are correct. The little Behringer will do a better job than DACs costing 10x as much (dare I say 20x?). As I mentioned before, there are better units out there but they cost substantially more. Mostly what you would be paying for are additional multitrack outputs, profesional mixing & processing capabilities that you wouldn't need anyway. You'll need 1/4" to RCA adaptors to hook into a home system, if you're on a PC then you'll install the FCA software, on a Mac it will be automaticaly recognized and If you buy from Muscian's Friend you get the option for a full refund if you don't like what you hear.

http://pro-audio.musiciansfriend.com/product/Behringer-FCA202-F-Control-FireWire-Audio-Interface?sku=240108

For easy switching between and assignment of system sounds away from the DAC I highly recommend the free Soundsource program from Rogue Ameoba (Mac only) - http://rogueamoeba.com/freebies/

Please let me know how it works out.

[psg]

Reviving an old thread...

Does the asynchronous mode USB of the High-Resolution Technologies Music streamer II address this jitter issue?

http://www.highresolutiontechnologies.com/products /

This is another product that gets "better than DACs costing 10x as much" reviews... I am wondering which way to go.

[MikeFord]

Synchronous, PC says here comes the data and sends it out based on the PC clock.

Asynchronous, PC sends the data out when the external device requests it based on the external device clock.

Jitter is usually associated with the recovery of the timing clock by the external device from the source, so yes it should address it.

Issues seem to be drivers for older OS than 7, and this being a fairly bonehead simple pair of cheap chips, it should show up before long on a cheap soundcard. This isn't something I feel too compelled to jump into the first generation of.

[RRFL]

I use an ARCAM rDAC on my netbook to play music between band sets and music for various DJ like events.

Specifically, for the USB connection, the rDAC re-clocks the data which can be out of sequence causing the jitter.

I was surprised to discover that so many people "who I though would not notice any difference" actually noticed the improvement to playing a CD and it wipes the floor with any of the iPhone or iPods even with wav files on the iDevice.

I only got it to use for my personal satisfaction as it is very portable and iDevices or well used CD players in venues don't do anything for me at all.

I rip all the CD's onto the netbook as wav files using the Sony Sonic Stage software then play them from the hard disk.

[psg]

That's for the low-doen Mike.

This isn't something I feel too compelled to jump into the first generation of.

First gen was released in 2009 as Music Streamer. Now they have the Music Streamer II, the Music Streamer II+ and the Music Streamer Pro. [^o)]

[Invidiosulus]

I had a presonus firebox and it sounded wonderful on playback either via FireWire or the coaxial spdif. Unfortunately my example picked up some noise from the internal clock on the xlr inputs which rendered it useless as a recording interface. It also had plenty of gain on the headphone out and could drive my hd414's with no trouble at all.

[MikeFord]

That's for the low-doen Mike.

This isn't something I feel too compelled to jump into the first generation of.

First gen was released in 2009 as Music Streamer. Now they have the Music Streamer II, the Music Streamer II+ and the Music Streamer Pro.

I was thinking of the chip set used more than variations using same chips.

People have been messing with jitter for two decades, so until a product matures a bit its hard to say if its going to be a solution or another dead end.

Also for me, I want more than a two channel solution, and I want a complete solution that manages all of the sound from a PC, and that is currently a major driver and licensing issue.

[psg]

Gotcha. Good points.