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How bout a Jubilee top?


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the folding geometry of the Jubilee is a one plane re-entrant type where the horn expands at the throat horizontally instead of vertically like the old style Klipschorn. I saw the same folding geometry in a later version of the Vitavox corner horn. A customer of mine had one. When I first saw the Vitavox, I assumed that it was their version of the Khorn. But he showed me that it expanded horizontally from one Baker 15" woofer. The Jubilee uses two 12" woofers with two horizontal expanding throat manifolds. I do not know if Roy Delgado had ever seen or heard about the Vitavox horn. But the folding options are limited so a horizontal configuration is a viable choice. I'm trying to rack my brain, but the Hartsfield, I think, is a horizontal folding configuration. Roy would be familiar with the Hartsfield layout. The next time I'm in Hope, I'll try to remember to ask Roy.

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That does look similar.....the internals seem different though.

I think that measurements/testing and multiple ears/subjective opinions is the key. There are some things that can be appealing that can't be demonstrated by objective testing. Such as say a Heresy 1 with first order networks vs a modern day reference series Klipsch that may be triple to quad the cost. There are qualities of the original heresy that are appealing to my ears.....that would make me "like" them more than any of the reference line. Not sure how curves/distortion, FR are to compare the two.

I have no reason to believe what you are building suks. It would be cool to see at least an RTA curve. Maybe some folks who own these speakers can do some curves and also give subjective opinions.

jc

edit

wow...that is more similar than i thought.

jc

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That's a post by Bruce Edgar at the Audio Asylum back in October. The pictures are from Dennis' photobucket that he posted in the same thread.

Dennis' response to Bruce was as follows:

"Early Hartsfield expansion is in both planes, after 1958 it is in one plane (horizontal) only."

With that out of the way, the real point is simply this -- cut up the wood to make a Hartsfield, and you'll have a hell of time making a Jubilee.

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JC -- the picture in the upper left hand corner is the Hartsfield, the large black and white drawing below it is the Jubilee. I wanted to clarify this in the event that anyone thinks the latter is the Hartsfield.

Got it.

For more clarification...that "jubilee" rendition isn't the jubilee.....this is a forum members interpretation of the real jubilee. Very close though. But a point is made.

jc

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Look closer guys the intial expansion from the driver is vertical until the area of expansion becomes large enough at the front to turn horizontal.

Miketn.

I don't understand.

On the jubilee....there is zero vertical expansion once the sound wave fires to the back of the horn and then turns again to the front. Initially, the two 12" woofers fire forward to a splitter and then the wave front expands vertically up to a max of about 40"....(depending on the plan). At that point there is no more vertical expansion.

Are we saying the same thing here but worded differently?

jc

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Mike I think what ssctrojan is saying is that the folding of the jubilee horn "favors" the design used in the hartsfield, even though the actual chamber of the JBL is closer to the khorn design in the way it exits right after the driver, and the fact that it uses one 15". I think you would have to agree though that the design of the jubilee follows much more closely the design of the hartsfield which also followed some of the design used in the khorn. I am amazed however by the attitudes of you and so many forum members who seem to want to tear down what some would try to do. While I do agree that at some point testing beyond the ears only is needed are you so bold to say that all of this equipment should be purchased before you build anything to listen to? If Henry Ford had attempted to construct an assembly line before he made a few Fords he would have been out of business before he ever got started! I was amazed at how many people on the forum were enraged a few months back when ssctrojan stated he had jubilee clones or copies for sale, many talked of patent infringement and trademark and copyright violations all the while many had on their own list of equipment at the bottom of their page jube clone or copies, how hipocritical! Is this forum simply full for the most part of snobs who think they are the elite? So what if ssctrojan builds copies of a speaker and sells them to people who will never be able to afford the real thing, are you going to tell me that they then don't deserve to own or listen to the jubilee even if it is a copy and possibly not exact! I also have constructed a couple of sets of jube copies and am starting a couple more, I like ssctrojan sell these for half of what you will pay american cinema for a pair of bass bins, and I assure you it is a much more appealing speaker to the eyes, one you can be proud to have in your listening room! I have 32 years experience as an interior residential finisher are you now going to tell me I'm not qualified. Reading the way you go after people on the forum I am sure you have never built and delivered a product to a person that they without you could have never afforded to own, you should see the way there eyes light up! You should witness first hand their gratitude in having part in something that others would say you cannot have. I think you should take a DEEP BREATH and ease up on the idea that everything and everybody has to be perfect, I assure you if you will just look in the mirror you will quickly notice that even you Mike aren't either! Maybe some on this forum should make newyears resolutions to be kinder and have a more generous idea that all people should be able to have the best sound that they can afford for their own enjoyment! And last I will just say that 34 years ago I had the pleasure to meet a man named Paul Klipsch who was at the time "just coming by to check on one of his dealers and see how it was going". that was in Springfield, Mo.when I was attending college, and as a young man I was most impressed by how this man clearly ingenious in his approach to audio and so casually dressed could have accomplished so much and still remained so humble! I think maybe this forum needs a healthy dose of that same humility!!!

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Look closer guys the intial expansion from the driver is vertical until the area of expansion becomes large enough at the front to turn horizontal.

Miketn.

I don't understand.

On the jubilee....there is zero vertical expansion once the sound wave fires to the back of the horn and then turns again to the front. Initially, the two 12" woofers fire forward to a splitter and then the wave front expands vertically up to a max of about 40"....(depending on the plan). At that point there is no more vertical expansion.

Are we saying the same thing here but worded differently?

jc

I agree jc that there is an initial vert expansion to the Jubilee but were those transitions are is critical to the performance of the horn so each horns performance will be unique. In a very basic way they might seem similar in concept but the details make them very unique.

mike tn

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Look closer guys the intial expansion from the driver is vertical until the area of expansion becomes large enough at the front to turn horizontal.

Miketn.

I don't understand.

On the jubilee....there is zero vertical expansion once the sound wave fires to the back of the horn and then turns again to the front. Initially, the two 12" woofers fire forward to a splitter and then the wave front expands vertically up to a max of about 40"....(depending on the plan). At that point there is no more vertical expansion.

Are we saying the same thing here but worded differently?

jc

I agree jc that there is an initial vert expansion to the Jubilee but were those transitions are is critical to the performance of the horn so each horns performance will be unique. In a very basic way they might seem similar in concept but the details make them very unique.

mike tn

2A3 Mike I may not have gotten across that my previous remarks were directed to you and deanG along with others, I'm not a big poster on the site and am a little unfamiliar unlike those that hover watching what anyone might say, but to be a little more accurate being such an avid poster have you forgotten that most of you comments have gone OFF TOPIC, and as you have said in the past "this should be on another thread"
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Spamhead,

I've heard people who sell pirated CD's make the same argument.

This forum doesn't need more humility, it needs more honesty.

-JPB
WAKE UP! the cd's are copyrighted and the jubilees are NOT, and don't say "it needs more honesty" while you are making a statement that is NOT!
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Calm down spamhead.

What is my attitude? Do you really think you know me by reading a few post? One of my best friends has built clones but you know what...? He built them for his own use and note for profit so anything that is right or wrong about them is his problem and no one elses and by the way he has also since bought factory built Jubilees?

Now I will admit I have a problem with someone using the Klipsch Forum to sell products for profit because it is a conflict of interest and is prohibited by the forum rules to protect members and visitors to the forum. As a member of this forum I have tried to bring a reality check to what is happening and hopefully bring to light what some people would think are important issues about what we are discussing here.

Maybe you would be wise to calm down and reread your post later because for me to reach conclusions about you like you are doing with me without us having ever met or even talked on the phone would be wrong and I think we are probably both better people than that...!

mike tn

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2A3 Mike I may not have gotten across that my previous remarks were directed to you and deanG along with others, I'm not a big poster on the site and am a little unfamiliar unlike those that hover watching what anyone might say, but to be a little more accurate being such an avid poster have you forgotten that most of you comments have gone OFF TOPIC, and as you have said in the past "this should be on another thread"

spamhead maybe you should get to know those you are so quick to critize before you rush to judgement.

My arguments hopefully are based on sound logic and I truely try to leave the emotion out of it but like everyone including yourself it's not always easy to do.

mike tn

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mike

I'm assuming from your name that you have a 2a3. In your opinion and only your opinion, you probably think that your 2a3 is best? I also like 2a3. But only for my midrange and tweeter. As the base on a 2a3 stinks. Thank god for byamping with a better bass amp. Just my opinion. But i'm sure on paper though... the tests say otherwise... My point being. To you your 2a3 might be perfect and sound perfect. Just as my horns (whatever tests say) might sound better than really other big horn.

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Calm down spamhead.

What is my attitude? Do you really think you know me by reading a few post? One of my best friends has built clones but you know what...? He built them for his own use and note for profit so anything that is right or wrong about them is his problem and no one elses and by the way he has also since bought factory built Jubilees?

Now I will admit I have a problem with someone using the Klipsch Forum to sell products for profit because it is a conflict of interest and is prohibited by the forum rules to protect members and visitors to the forum. As a member of this forum I have tried to bring a reality check to what is happening and hopefully bring to light what some people would think are important issues about what we are discussing here.

Maybe you would be wise to calm down and reread your post later because for me to reach conclusions about you like you are doing with me without us having ever met or even talked on the phone would be wrong and I think we are probably both better people than that...!

mike tn

You are probably right Mike, I should calm down, and if I have offended you by my words I do appologize! the reason for my assumption is the way that you went after Maron Hornzak, I surely did detect what I thought was an attempt to belittle or intimidate him and if that wasn't what you were doing all I will say is then it could have been better stated so that I and others would not come to that assumption. But like I stated I don't want or advocate being judgemental. I purchased my first hi-fi stereo in 1973 and what really drew me to audio was the way others, even if they had much better equipment were like comrads and were always helping, I see how the numbers in this hobby or pastime have dwindled and wonder if it is due to attitudes? I check this forum from time to time and am always amazed that someone is always going after someone in a negative way and wonder why the other forums have so little of this, maybe it is just timing and the fact that I am far to busy to spend much time on any of the forums unless I have a question, and like some friends am getting the attitude don't ask unless you are willing to get ridiculed by the so called forum geru's, doesn't this scatter the flock and not gather them? My intent is not to belittle you or anyone else for that matter, but maybe ALL should step back and say what if a would be audio buff checked out the forums, would he want klipsch? this forum is decidedly more hostile than any others. I spent over 20 years after hearing my first khorns and meeting Paul Klipsch before I owned a pair and if I had checked this forum regularly I can say I would have never purchased them because of attitudes by klipsch owners, maybe this is because we all have so much love and zeal over our beloved klipsch products and their copies, but in the end haven't we become our own worst enemy and everything that Paul himself hated about the audio world?
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