Belles vs KLF-30

[seti]

I already have a pair of KLF-30's and love them! Ive just always wanted to get the heritage series, and the belles look sweet! I want the khorns, but I dont have the room or I dont think I will ever have the right room to make them sound their best. I was told that the belles are like the khorns, just without the need for corners and a big *** room!

It should be more of Belles and KLF-30

I like the height of the Belles in a smaller room over khorns and ability to toe in to the sweet spot just right. It was something I missed going from Belle to Khorn in my room. Don't get me wrong the extra low end was appreciated.

[USNRET]

I was told that the belles are like the khorns

False, they are not the same even given my tiny room I tried the Khorns in. I just didn't want to sit 6 feet back and the kids wanted their toy room back. Didn't have a way to put the Khorns in my mancave.

just without the need for corners and a big *** room!

Corners dig deeper and bigger is better but I can live with what I have for now for the 2 channel.

[SWL]

I can think of a number of subs that worked perfectly with bells and la scalas over the years. They sound amazing when the bottom octave is filled it.

That is correct.....as long as it is done properly with some type of bass management tool. If it sounds like a sub......it ain't right.

[Islander]

I normally use a 500-watt sub with my JubScalas and it sounds great, but when I had to send it in for a minor repair, I used one of my bedroom 100-watt subs in its place. When watching movies, the big sub was really missed, but for music the little sub was not bad at all. It could be called adequate, which surprised me.

[wpines]

I've looked everywhere for a freq curve for the Belles.

I though the chart room might have one but I couldn't find one.

[4tay]

.as long as it is done properly with some type of bass management tool. If it sounds like a sub......it ain't right.

I don't really need any software or specialized tool, but keenly matching the sub amp controls can be a bear. But agreed...if the sub sticks out, it's not right. I have heard that plenty of times. A sub with "X" speaker that still sounds like it's on it's own, or worse: stepping on the speakers it's supposed to support.

One sub I have had *Great* success with is the VMPS larger sub. The mass-loading on the PR/changing the Q (in conjunction with adjusting the plate amp parameters) provides a seamless blending sub.

[SWL]

I don't really need any software or specialized tool

How do you implement the sub into your two-channel system?

[4tay]

I don't really need any software or specialized tool

How do you implement the sub into your two-channel system?

I start by plugging it in and placing it between the speakers.

If you are implying it requires that I use quasi-anechoic and FFT analysis by the team at Canada's central audio research facility followed up by a week of averaging SPL measurements and laser inferometry backed by intensive software analysis. It's not magic, nor does it require an EE with extreme measures. It's not that difficult...really.

[Dennie]

I don't really need any software or specialized tool

How do you implement the sub into your two-channel system?

I start by plugging it in and placing it between the speakers.

If you are implying it requires that I use quasi-anechoic and FFT analysis by the team at Canada's central audio research facility followed up by a week of averaging SPL measurements and laser inferometry backed by intensive software analysis. It's not magic, nor does it require an EE with extreme measures. It's not that difficult...really.

If it's not that difficult, then why don't you answer the question?

Some of us might want to learn.

Thanks,

Dennie

[4tay]

If it's not that difficult, then why don't you answer the question?

Some of us might want to learn.

Thanks,

Dennie

My listening room, system and components are all different from anyone else's here. No matter what I do, your setup will be different. You should consult Tom Nousaine and others that have guides online that cover this topic. I can't express it better than what has already been written.

[Dennie]

If it's not that difficult, then why don't you answer the question?

Some of us might want to learn.

Thanks,

Dennie

My listening room, system and components are all different from anyone else's here. No matter what I do, your setup will be different. You should consult Tom Nousaine and others that have guides online that cover this topic. I can't express it better than what has already been written.

Thanks!

Dennie

[SWL]

I don't really need any software or specialized tool

How do you implement the sub into your two-channel system?

I start by plugging it in and placing it between the speakers.

If you are implying it requires that I use quasi-anechoic and FFT analysis by the team at Canada's central audio research facility followed up by a week of averaging SPL measurements and laser inferometry backed by intensive software analysis. It's not magic, nor does it require an EE with extreme measures. It's not that difficult...really.

My intent was not to come accross as a smart ***. I'm curious because I've found that simple external crossovers were a big help in blending in the sub. Anything above and beyond simple in this matter is not my style.

For a long time I was using the built-in parametric eq on my SVS PB-12 Ultra/2......in conjunction with simply splitting off from the preouts of the preamp. I had no idea what I was missing out on.

I'm not attacking you dude.

[4tay]

]My intent was not to come accross as a smart ***. I'm curious because I've found that simple external crossovers were a big help in blending in the sub. Anything above and beyond simple in this matter is not my style.

For a long time I was using the built-in parametric eq on my SVS PB-12 Ultra/2......in conjunction with simply splitting off from the preouts of the preamp. I had no idea what I was missing out on.

I'm not attacking you dude.

No problem, it's just been one of those personal attack/troll gang-up weeks by non-modders and even a Klipsch engineer with an axe to grind against the mod community. One moment it's "You don't need measurements" the next "You must prove it with measurements." lose/lose....

VMPS (and others) recommend an external active xover for best results. I agree.

[Boxx]

They are classic, beautful and will always do just what you want them to.

Now, if I could only find a WIFE like that!!!

(Paul did and her name was Belle)

Dennie

Well said Dennie.

When I brought home my La Scala the wife said "wtf...where are we gonna put these?" Now, we would never let them go.

Get the "Belles." Funny, my wife said the same thing....

[rennoc442]

OK how about comparing the belles to the la scallas? I heard that the la scallas are really weak on the bottom end. I just cant fathom the thought of adding a sub when the mains have 15 inch woofers!

[4tay]

OK how about comparing the belles to the la scallas? I heard that the la scallas are really weak on the bottom end. I just cant fathom the thought of adding a sub when the mains have 15 inch woofers!

They are the same, except cosmetically. The trade off of the horn loaded design is thus: ULTRA quick and INSTANTLY impactful bass, that sacrifices a portion of the 1st octave. I know a lot of people that enjoy them as is... but I prefer more low end, that's just me. I find that my classical material REALLY works when one of these gets augmented by a sub.

You really have to experiance this kind of bass in person. It hits like a truck. While other styles of speaker (like cornwall) have a BIG full bass, the belle/la scala bass pressure and definition is RIGHT NOW. The only speaker that sounds more realistic for drums is...the klipschorn.

[Islander]

I heard that the la scallas are really weak on the bottom end. I just cant fathom the thought of adding a sub when the mains have 15 inch woofers!

You'd think 15 inch woofers would mean lots of bass, but what it means in the case of the La Scala and Belle is lots of air moved for strong bass. It doesn't go that low because, believe it or not, the cabinets aren't big enough to go really low. One of the characteristics of horn-loaded woofers is that the horns have to be pretty big to go really low, and as PA cabs, as the La Scalas were originally designed, they had to be small enough to be "portable".

Klipschorns and Jubilees have more bottom end, but are somewhat bigger and more costly speakers.

Someone else may comment on this, but I don't think recordings back in the day when the LS was introduced had much bottom end anyway.

When you add a suitable sub to a pair of La Scalas or Belles, you get a realistic sound of live music that's hard to find with almost any other speaker.

[rennoc442]

That makes sense, instant bass. OK so now here is my next question! Which one? La Scalla or Belle? I love the look of both. I think the open look of the Scalla are sweet.

[Islander]

The sound of the two speakers is quite similar. The Belle is the pretty version of the La Scala. It's also wider and more shallow, so it makes a better TV stand if you have a TV with a wide base. The LS is only 24 inches wide, which may be a good thing, depending on the layout of your room.

Not as many Belles were produced as La Scalas, so they can be harder to find and are often a little more expensive, but not always.

[rennoc442]

There is a guy on this forum selling a pair of belles in miami, about 3hrs from me. I am still waiting to hear back from him to see pics before I decide to drive that far. If it doesnt pan out I will keep looking for la scallas or belles. Im guessing either or I will be happy with! I actually think la scallas would fit in my room better, being not as wide as the belles.