How To Improve Sound from La Scala's

[tube fanatic]

Thanks to all for the great feedback. I think I will start with refreshing the LS's.....new caps and maybe the CT125 tweeters from Bob....I'll also check the gasket on the mid horn. Overall, the bass is very acceptable. I may look at adding a sub down the road, but not a priority now. I like to listen around mid/high volume (about 9 or 10 o'clock on the Sansui dial). If this doesn't remedy the issue, I'll then start looking at replacing my amp and/or CD player.

If I end up replacing the amp (hopefully I won't need to), would a 3 or 4 watt tube amp give me enough power....in comparison to the Sansui AU-717 (which I believe is 85 wpc)? I don't know how many watts I usually use of the Sansui when volume dial is at 10 o'clock.....I know it is pretty loud.....floors are vibrating a bit. Of course, right now I have to choose the right music to play at that volume.....no thin vocals.

I really appreciate all the great advice you all have added.

There's no way to correlate volume control position with power output as there are other factors which will affect it- loudness of the recording, output voltage of your source, the taper of the volume control, etc. To get some idea of how much power you need, try this sound pressure level calculator:

http://www.doctorproaudio.com/doctor/calculadores_en.htm#calc_spl

Also, according to Dope from Hope, Volume 16 #1, the La Scala will produce a 100 db spl in a 3000 cu foot room with only 1 watt/channel. So, unless you are looking to blow out windows, a 2 or 3 wpc amp should be plenty.

[Chris A]

So, unless you are looking to blow out windows, a 2 or 3 wpc amp should be plenty.

A bit of rhetoric here...and I will take a point of order on this...I think that you will need more, and you will hear the effects of having added headroom from your amplifiers, and that is not opinion...but, if you don't mind tube amps "soft clipping", then amplifiers capable 3 Watts RMS into 8 Ohms won't bother you... if you don't mind harmonic distortion products at concert levels.

Some folks don't mind...I do, however. [] See enclosure. The Crown D-60 is a 35 W/channel into 8 Ohms (20 Hz-20Khz) at 0.05% THD amplifier.

Chris

PWK TubesVsSS.pdf

[tube fanatic]

So, unless you are looking to blow out windows, a 2 or 3 wpc amp should be plenty.

A bit of rhetoric here...and I will take a point of order on this...I think that you will need more, and you will hear the effects of having added headroom from your amplifiers, and that is not opinion...but, if you don't mind tube amps "soft clipping", then amplifiers capable 3 Watts RMS into 8 Ohms won't bother you... if you don't mind harmonic distortion products at concert levels.

Some folks don't mind...I do, however. See enclosure. The Crown D-60 is a 35 W/channel into 8 Ohms (20 Hz-20Khz) at 0.05% THD amplifier.

Chris

As mentioned in my original post here, it all depends on how loudly one listens. PWK's power calculations in Vol. 16, #1 also allow for 10db of headroom; so, actual power need is in fact lower than that stated. Besides, if an amp can deliver say 3 watts at 5% THD, the distortion isn't even going to remotely approach that at .5 watts which may be all that the listener requires. Having another 30 watts in reserve isn't going to make a difference. And, very low distortion (as you mention for the D-60) isn't necessarily the key to good sound- how often have we listened to a solid state amp with vanishingly low distortion and find that it sounds like garbage? To use another analogy, what advantage would there be to driving a formula one racer down Main Street at 25 mph when a 60s Beetle would be sufficient? So, again, it all depends on how much power is needed to satisfy a given listening level.

[Chris A]

I can only assume that you missed the enclosure to my previous post...just a heads-up.

Chris

[artto]

dump the Sansui integrated. It's comparable to driving a Porsche with a Briggs and Stratton engine. You need a better source, amplication and probably a better room (acoustics) if you really want to hear what the LaScala can do and eliminate the harshness you hear. The LaScala is simply exposing deficiencies in other parts of the reproduction chain. Once you get those thing corrected, then, you can start worrying about the other details like crossover networks or new caps.

Old adage: "garbage in - garbage out"

P.S the fact that you find these things more irritating as the volume goes up tells me it's the room interferring/interacting with the direct sound from the speakers. Others may disagree ~ but they are wrong []

[mikebse2a3]

And, very low distortion (as you mention for the D-60) isn't necessarily the key to good sound- how often have we listened to a solid state amp with vanishingly low distortion and find that it sounds like garbage?

Agreed..!!!! IMHO distortion measurements that are currently performed/published/advertised with all types of amplifiers are insufficient at giving us a total understanding of how any amplifier when combined with any given loudspeaker to reproduce music as (we currently attempt it) will be perceived by the human ear/brain let alone prefered by any given listener. Also remember many measurements are performed with signals that behave very little like real musical signals except at there very basic nature.

So if you are a person who believes that current advertised distortion measurements tells you all that you need to know about an amplifier then your search is over and all you need to do is select the amplifier with the power capability you need for your system.

Speaking for myself I do believe measurements are important but they must relate to how we as human listeners will ultimately perceive what they reveal to us for them to be usefull to us.

All I can say is IMHO for anyone to push any type(tube,solid state,digital,hybrid designs) amplifier as the only type of amplification that is correct is being foolish and showing a real lacking in experience of just what is capable from all the various designs available.

mike tn

[amadork9]

I picked up a pair of '78 La Scala's a few weeks back.....great condition.....all original components....no upgrades/mods. I have them hooked to a Sansui AU-717 integrated amp. Overall, the sound is very good at lower volumes, but can get pretty fatiguing (harsh sounding) at mid/high volumes.....especially with female vocals. I am using a hi-def type dvd player to play CD's. What should I be looking at to improve the sound.....within reason? I really don't want to get into tubes....can't afford it. What would be the top 2 or 3 things that I should change in my system? Would I hear a noticable difference by upgrading the LS's a bit....like the crossovers, which are type AA, (like putting in new caps) and maybe upgrading the tweeters? Secondly, is there a much better amp for the speakers than the Sansui.....say under $500 (new/used)? Lastly, would I get much improvement in picking up a better CD player? Any feedback would be appreciated.

Thanks,

Hogfan

ADC Sound Shaper Automatic Computerized Equalizer/Analyzer model ss-525x has remote and microphone for room leveling BSR makes one also, ebay for around 200 dollars and new caps inyour speakers, unless you want to spend tons on equipment to get it right

[amadork9]

Heres a model 325x can be had for under 150 i prefer the 525x there both really easy to use make sure you get the mic with it.