SCOOTERDOG Posted April 27, 2002 Share Posted April 27, 2002 One Word is All I Have For You...Heritage! ------------------ Denon AVR 3801 Onkyo M504 Power Amp driving the mains Techenique A-10 DVD Audio/Video Player Pioneer DVL-909 Laserdisc/Dvd Player Dish Network Dolby Digital Sat receiver Klipsch La Scala ( Mains) Klipsch RFC5 Center Klipsch RSS6 Surround Side Klipsch RSS .5 Back surround Klipsch KSW 12 Subwoofer Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BBB Posted April 27, 2002 Share Posted April 27, 2002 If you could return your RF-7s for the full list price to the authorized dealer you purchased them from for a trade in on a BRAND NEW set of speakers by ANY other manufacturer what would you choose? Im not talking about what dealer does that? because I have one. It is not an internet dealer. And Im not talking about horse trading on the internet either. What I mean is taking four new $1,100 Klipsch speakers and getting four NEW $1,100 speakers of ANY brand from an AUTHORIZED dealer. I dont want to take the $4,400 and contact Joe Shmo from Kokomo whos selling $30,000 speakers out of his garage that he picked up at some estate auction. Dollar for dollar, Manufacturer Suggested Retail Price,what would you buy that included the same type of warranty as Klipsch ? Im not being a wise guy. I am totally serious. What manufacturer offers better sound and better quality for this amount of money ? Klipsch has allowed their customers to discuss their competitors on this forum so why not mention an equal product for an equal retail price? Something that will handle 400 watts a channel. Thats what my Cinepro is delivering to them now without a shake rattle or hum. Bye the way Im also biamping an RC-7,400w/400w, and have used the system way above reference levels and havent noticed anything coming unglued or falling apart at the seams. I also own RS-7s and RF-5s and crank them without a problem. But we are discussing just the RF-7s. Any opinions from people who own or have owned the RF-7 who have replaced or want to replace them ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Audible Nectar Posted April 27, 2002 Share Posted April 27, 2002 BBB asked: "If you could return your RF-7s for the full list price to the authorized dealer you purchased them from for a trade in on a BRAND NEW set of speakers by ANY other manufacturer what would you choose? Dollar for dollar, Manufacturer Suggested Retail Price, what would you buy that included the same type of warranty as Klipsch? Im not being a wise guy. I am totally serious. What manufacturer offers better sound and better quality for this amount of money ?" IMO, the only thing that would be an improvement would be Heritage - a Cornwall or larger. Yes, you would need to get these used at your price point - although 2 LaScalas and 2 Heresys new would likely be in the $4400 range. Other than that, these speakers don't exist (IMO). That's why we're here. I am not just giving you the "party line" - I first heard Klipsch 17 years ago, back in the mid eighties - and have yet to find any consumer line product offering such sound today at Klipsch prices. In fact, I can't find any consumer available horn loaded product, period. (Unless you go vintage Altec, JBL Pro, or Edgar horns, which aren't consumer line product). I have 2 Cornwall II's and an Academy up front (both in mint or near mint shape) and 2 Chorus as surrounds (fair condition, but sound great). I have a total of $1500 invested in all 5 speakers. If I had it to do over again, I would not change it. I would also put this setup against any new 5 channel setup at 3 times that price - including the RF series. That said, the RF series is no slouch - they certainly do hold their own. Ultimately, the decision is yours as to what to do with your RF-7's, but I believe that you will have difficulty finding that level of performance at an equivalent price. ------------------ First we Rock, then we Roll! A Beast is Lurking.........To be unleashed May 2002 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seb Posted April 27, 2002 Share Posted April 27, 2002 dndphishin, I see your sig... May is almost here... WHAT IS THE BEAST? ------------------ http://members.fortunecity.com/sebdavid - go laugh at my crappy website/equipment http://www.dvdprofiler.com/mc.asp?alias=Sebdavid - go laugh at my puny little DVD collection This message has been edited by Seb on 04-27-2002 at 12:20 PM Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
anarchist Posted April 27, 2002 Author Share Posted April 27, 2002 Wow, This has become the 'Defenders of the Faith' thread. Klipsch lovers are certainly a loyal group and the bottom line is I have bought NO other speaker from any manufacturer nor had an inkling to since I bought my first pair of Klipsch. But it is ridiculous to assert my purchasing speakers at deep discounts (The KSP400's were brand new by the way) and buying at 60% of MSRP provides me with a distorted perspective of price. It's a capitalist society Bob - Klipsch is trying to sell their speakers at the highest possible price to capture a certain market share AND I am trying to buy not only Klipsch but every good at the lowest possible price. Suggesting people buy at the lowest possible price is not a distorted perspective, it is common sense. Let us not forget it was one of Klipsch' authorized dealers who mentioned the real value was 50%. I will be glad to provide the name of that dealer and location of the store for you. The salesman is probably long gone since this was 1989. Let us not forget the complaints in my first post also come from someone who has long worked at a Klipsch authorized dealer. While the RF-7's may use a similar construction process as Heresys from the 80's, there are several items that have lowered the quality regardless. You are building far more speakers which mandates less attention to detail than in the past and the grills off the newer speakers are the cheapest things. There have been too many instances, for my comfort level, where those pretty copper cones get creased with minimal contact. Those little prongs break off the 'protective' grills with far too much regularity and the older models magnet fasteners were far more secure and reliable. I won't mention that black plastic facia. "Ultimately you get what you pay for." Absolutely correct and my only argument is manufacturers, retailers, etc. all try to make you pay for more than what you are getting. It is the consumers responsibility to make certain they in fact are getting what they paid for and are not just being overly generous. Companies love to tout price/value ratios to consumers but the reality is they have a price target to sell the largest quantity and cut costs wherever possible (always in quality) to maximize profit potential. I am content with my Klipsch purchases and expect to continue to be but I will never pay MSRP, distorted perspective or not. End rant and paranoia. ------------------ Home Theater KSP 400's KSP C6 KSP S6's Yamaha RXV995 Music Room Heresy's KG4's KSW200 The move to separates is coming, I can feel it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Audible Nectar Posted April 27, 2002 Share Posted April 27, 2002 Yes Seb, it's almost May ------------------ First we Rock, then we Roll! A Beast is Lurking.........To be unleashed May 2002 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boa12 Posted April 27, 2002 Share Posted April 27, 2002 dnd, i though you already got the jbl LF beast. you gonna get another one & stack 'em like h-ed? inquiring minds need to know. ------------------ My Home Systems Page Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marathon Man Posted April 28, 2002 Share Posted April 28, 2002 WOW! nice thread. ------------------ MM Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
USparc Posted April 28, 2002 Share Posted April 28, 2002 I own 4 RF-3's and replaced the internal wires. So I know their construction and how they look inside. The RF-3's are "rock" solid: The drivers on it's own are very nice and solid with very serious magnets. The MDF-pannels have a good thickness. Even the motorboard is extra dense MDF. I noticed it when unscrewing the drivers. Really tight. Don't see any chance to see hanging a driver out of its cabinet one day!!! The cabinet construction looks solid and everything is glued very good. The damping material can be indeed attached a bit better what I did myself. Adding some more internal construction like the b&w matrix would indeed be better, but at what price. Also the internal wires could be better, but again ... Changed them with FTP cat 5 cable. crash827 mentioned that $40 in cost = $500 in price. That is a bit extreem, but true. If I count the hours spent on tweaking my RF-3's then they are more then $2000. RF-3 takes about 80" of internal wire. If you would replace it with kimber cable of 10$/ft --> +$66. What would the market price be .... I paid my RF-3 $700/pair. Could I expect more from those speakers. Hell no. I only can get them better by tweaking. That is my reaction on this quality issue of the reference series of klipsch. But what about the RF-7 and RF-5. There is indeed a gap in price between my RF-3's : RF-3: $800 RF-5: $1500 RF-7: $2200 Ok, the RF-7 is bigger and uses larger drivers. But the RF-5 is almost the same as the RF-3. So tweaks (internal wires, damping material,...) cost $. If you want to save $, do them yourself. But indeed, I understand that you would not expect to tweak on a $2200 priced speaker!!! Don't worry, be happy (with your klipsch 's) ------------------ ------------------------- Receiver: Pioneer VSX-909RDS DVD: Pioneer DV-525 Screen: Thomson 46" RetroProjection Front: RF-3 tFTP Rear: RF-3 tFTP Center: RC-3 tFTP Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
m00n Posted April 29, 2002 Share Posted April 29, 2002 Well, all I know is that I am replacing my RF-3II's with a pair of RF-7s. They sounded incredible in the store, I am sure they will in my home also. ------------------ the m00n system Update. RF-3II and RC-3II to be replaced with RF-7 and RC-7c>s> RF-3II Front floors RC-3II Center RS-3II Surrounds RSW-12 Subwoofer Harman Kardon AVR 520 Toshiba SD 3205 DVD Samsung 27" Flatscreen c>Microsoft XBOXc> f> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
anarchist Posted April 30, 2002 Author Share Posted April 30, 2002 Let me assure you, the RF7's do sound incredible. You will be very happy moving from the 3's up to their big brother. No remorse, no regret, no reason not to get them - the subject of this thread notwithstanding. If it weren't for all my other Klipsch - and the fact I have yet to build a dedicated HT in the basement - I would have at least one pair. Eventually the house will be nothing more than a Klipsch showroom. Here is the heritage room, here is the kg room, here is the synergy premiere room, here is the reference room... ------------------ Home Theater KSP 400's KSP C6 KSP S6's Yamaha RXV995 Music Room Heresy's KG4's KSW200 The move to separates is coming, I can feel it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
m00n Posted April 30, 2002 Share Posted April 30, 2002 quote: Originally posted by BobG: That is why we are second in the US market and the envy of most competitors. So if Klipsch is #2 in the US, who is #1? ------------------ the m00n system Should have my R3 system replaced with R7 this weekends> FRONTS: RF-3II CENTER: RC-3II SURROUND: RS-3II SUB: RSW-12 RECEIVER: Harman Kardon AVR 520 DVD: Toshiba SD 3205 (DD, DTS) TV: Samsung 27" Flatscreen COMPUTER: ProMedia 4.1 c>Microsoft XBOXc> f> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boa12 Posted April 30, 2002 Share Posted April 30, 2002 moon, here's a hint: direct/reflecting, cubes, wave radio. crash i hear you. that was good. right now I have a ref room (maybe upgrade to rf-7 fronts there someday) & a combo legend/heritage room. some day w/ more house I hope to have heritage, ref & legend rooms all seperate & all at least 5.1 systems. ------------------ My Home Systems Page Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T2K Posted April 30, 2002 Share Posted April 30, 2002 I lost track of this thread temporarily and am glad to have wandered back into the fold.I'm happy that the Moderator offered a defense for Klipsch and I am therefore hoping that Mr. BobG will answer a question that has lingered on my mind for some time. During a time that work controlled my every minute and I had no spare time for enjoyment of my audio hobby, Klipsch introduced and discontinued the Klipsch Synergy Premiere line.During a hiatus from work I blew the dust off my equipment and was reminded that only a good woman gave more pleasure than good music.But then again,the pleasure that music brought seemed to last longer with less negative feedback. Maybe that's my fault. hmmm........ Anyway,my question to BobG is this: Why did Klipsch introduce the Synergy Premiere line only to discontinue the line two years later? I've been told that,generally,a speaker line lasts about two years. I understand the marketing and technological aspects involved.What I'm having trouble with is that I also know that these speakers have high build quality and give a big HT bang for the buck.For the average smoe that wants a good looking speaker to introduce into his/her traditional home environment that will not overwhelm same,these speakers are the ticket.It just so happens that they sound great too! Of course you know that Bob,so how about the inside scoop on why this speaker line was discontinued? If the info is top secret,then simply e-mail me and I'll post .... I mean I'll keep it to myself. When 10,000 people gather in one place and argue which speaker, built buy the same manufacturer, sounds best you know you're doing something right. Thanks in advance Bob. Keith Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
anarchist Posted May 5, 2002 Author Share Posted May 5, 2002 Hi, Thought I would bump this and see if BobG might respond. I will also add this for Keith. This weekend I had the opportunity and inclination to 'really' turn up the dial on my Synergy Premiere system. Much higher than I had previously with KG4's being the big dog. I was blown away - I didn't swap in the Heresys' to compare with the second horn - and listened to multiple CD-s in their entirety I haven't listened to in a long time. I was just never happy with the music on the system as it was previously. What did I hear? With eyes closed, the music seemed to be encompassing about a thirty foot stage - speakers are about 8 feet apart. Drums solidly (and impressively) playing back behind the singer. An envelope of sound with focused presence when applicable. I listened to "Surfing with the Alien" which is simply heavy drums, guitars, and bass. God, almighty. I wanted to call up friends and associates from work and have them come over and listen to what Klipsch can do. It is by far the best sounding system of any of my audio buddies and blows away most speakers sitting in a dealership today - in its price range and I dare say above in many instances. Thanks to Keith for pushing me to complete the system with KSP400's. I almost bought another LSP300 this weekend after the listening but will wait until another set of KSP400's seek me out. So how about it BobG? Why did Klipsch stop making these beautiful, great sounding speakers? ------------------ Home Theater KSP 400's KSP C6 KSP S6's Yamaha RXV995 Music Room Heresy's KG4's KSW200 The move to separates is coming, I can feel it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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