New to the forums. Speaker choice options.

[StephenM]

Sorry to hear about the ML. Guess the price was too good to be true.

But I'm thinking the 15" would be 'slow', for music n stuff.

Nothing inherent with a 15" woofer that would make it slow; you just need motor of commesurate strength/quality. On the other hand, the 15" model Velo will have greater total output capability and less distortion for any given output level. Here is some data on their predecessors:

http://www.avtalk.co.uk/showthread.php?t=12089

http://www.avtalk.co.uk/showthread.php?t=12088

[Youthman]

All of my subwoofers have been Velodyne and I have been extremely pleased with them, especially their higher end subs. My past two Velodyne's were 15". I personally will always have either a 12" or 15". The Velodyne's often are Servo controlled to help reduce distortion and have pretty beefy amps. My amp has a 1250w RMS amp. Love it!

[vw_calvin]

What's your guys thought on dual velodyne 12s vs single 15? Cause I'm thinking of running two subs, but dual 15s might be overkill

[Youthman]

but dual 15s might be overkill

Crazy talk like that will get you sent over to the BOSE forum. [] You won't hear too many guys around here that feel anything is overkill. You just won't have to turn it up as loud. []

I had the opportunity to add a Velodyne DD12 along side my HGS15 and to be honest, I didn't really hear any difference by adding it. Not exactly sure why. I guess I was expecting the entire roof to cave in or something. You will have more surface area with two 12" drivers and if I remember correctly, if you are able to stack one on top of the other, you will dramatically add a considerable amount of bass (can't remember the exact SPL).

I'm sure others will chime in who have much more experience in this area than I.

TheEar....if you are listening, can you post a photo (or someone else post it) showing your thoughts towards "overkill"? []

[Heritage_Head]

but dual 15s might be overkill

Crazy talk like that will get you sent over to the BOSE forum. You won't hear too many guys around here that feel anything is overkill. You just won't have to turn it up as loud.

I had the opportunity to add a Velodyne DD12 along side my HGS15 and to be honest, I didn't really hear any difference by adding it. Not exactly sure why. I guess I was expecting the entire roof to cave in or something. You will have more surface area with two 12" drivers and if I remember correctly, if you are able to stack one on top of the other, you will dramatically add a considerable amount of bass (can't remember the exact SPL).

I'm sure others will chime in who have much more experience in this area than I.

TheEar....if you are listening, can you post a photo (or someone else post it) showing your thoughts towards "overkill"?

I agree with youth overkill isn’t

really proper klipsch forum etiquette hehehe (jk). Bass is going to be about room

and taste. So I would start with just one and see how it sounds. For me the

magic number was 3 subs. But I have a friend with a small $150 10” polk sub and

he loves it.

[vw_calvin]

So I brought home the demo 15" today and I'm loving it... Still have to fiddle a little more to get it blend nicely. I'll pick up a brand new one tomorrow...

I've got my RF-82's crossover set at 80Hz, and well my dumb receiver doesn't have a cross over setting for the sub, otherwise I'd set it at 80. However it does have the option for speaker size.... What does that do really??

The one 15" is pretty darn powerful, probably won't need a second, maybe later I'd I have extra cash to throw I'll bring one home and see what kind of difference there is.

Still want to get:

RC-62 (next paycheque, wish I could order the 64 :'()

Harmony 900 or 1100 (opinions?!? I just like the cool factor of the 1100 but the 900 is probably more practical)

Monster HDP2550

Surrounds (haven't decided bookshelves/dipoles/towers yet)

On a side note, I set up some Martin Logan XStat Vistas today with the ML Depth i (new, none broken:P) and a Pioneer SC-1525K and man oh man am I jealous!! Sub woesn't even turned on in the received at first and I was even impressed with the bass...

[K5SS]

I am very new to this site also(2nd post) but I still might be able to help... It sounds like you are sold on the 15" demo but if you can get a killer deal on the Martin Logan abyss i would jump on two of them, I have two of them in a 18ftx 12ft room and it sounds absolutely killer. I started with one and I was very happy but I m always wanting more so I added another and I haven't looked back. I don't know all of the technical terms but it made the bass much more powerful and less directional. I also own the harmony 1100 and I love it, all of the money I have tied up in everything else and the remote is the one thing that people notice. It does give you the wow factor but I bet the other harmony models would run everything just as good as th 1100. Keep us updated on your progress.

[vw_calvin]

The abyss was discontinued. The more recent model is the Dynamo. I can only get the dynamo 500s tho.

With your 1100, do you find it annoying having to look at the remote (buttons) to adjust stuff? Rather than having button locations memorized?

I'll prob end up with the 1100, just cause it's baller, and I work in HT at Futureshop, so it's always good when you've got the best stuff... My favorite's when people are saying 40s&32s are plenty big, then proceed to ask what size I've got... Lol. That'll be the case with the 15" sub now too. Everyone I talk to thinks this thing is redonkulous.

[robc1976]

Still want to get:
RC-62

I have a RC-62II available if interesyed...like new condition.

I would go with bookshelves with your set up. Probally RB-61II

[K5SS]

I think the remote is like anything, the more you use it the better you get at it. At first I didn't like having to look at the buttons but now it is like second nature. You also have to point the remote at the components but you can add the RF extender, I added it and now I don't have any issues.

[JasonJCarney]

in your original post it looks like you have a psb subsonic 6i... is that correct? If so, do you not care for it? Im looking at buying a couple but I really can't find anyone that has owned one. What do you think of yours?

[vw_calvin]

in your original post it looks like you have a psb subsonic 6i... is that correct? If so, do you not care for it? Im looking at buying a couple but I really can't find anyone that has owned one. What do you think of yours?

Woah! That's crazy, it looks almost identical to that PSB. No it was a older Fidek 12" that my room mate had. Was a POS with a 100RMS amp. It ended up being blown after watching Tron

[StephenM]

TheEar....if you are listening, can you post a photo (or someone else post it) showing your thoughts towards "overkill"?

Don't know about TheEar, but this might qualify:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=19489036#post19489036

4 Epik Empires, 5 Seaton Submersives, and of his speakers, 9 have powered subs built in.

[Youthman]

That's some crazy bass Steven. The ear has a ton of subs stacked with pro amps hooked up to it. It's pretty insane. I just can't find any of the forums where he has posted pics of his gear. All his subs are custom made, I believe with Danley drivers or TL something. Can't remember.

[StephenM]

I've got my RF-82's crossover set at 80Hz, and well my dumb receiver doesn't have a cross over setting for the sub, otherwise I'd set it at 80. However it does have the option for speaker size.... What does that do really??

Setting your speaker to large means you're running the speaker full range. It is rarely recommended to run in such a configuration for a variety of reasons, although some people on this forum seem to like it.

Setting your speakers to small and specifying a crossover frequency means that the receiver will apply a high pass filter to the speakers and a low pass filter to the subwoofer. IOW, if you set your mains to small and specify a crossover frequency of 80Hz, a typical result is that the receiver will set the 3dB down point of your mains at 80Hz, and apply a 12dB/octave rolloff beyond that, ie they will be 15dB down at 40Hz, 27dB down at 20Hz. On the other side, the subwoofer will receive bass data from the main channels, but will have its own filters, a common setup being that it will be 6dB down at 80Hz, with a 24dB/octave slope above that (ie it would be 30dB down at 160Hz).

[StephenM]

That's some crazy bass Steven. The ear has a ton of subs stacked with pro amps hooked up to it. It's pretty insane. I just can't find any of the forums where he has posted pics of his gear. All his subs are custom made, I believe with Danley drivers or TL something. Can't remember.

I think he was a fan of TC Sounds drivers, but I could be wrong. I am just curious how those setups would compare to the horn loaded subs some of these guys here are building. Of course, I'd suppose in either case, they'd have enough output to destroy your hearing in a rather short period of time if you were so inclined.

[DrWho]

The three 8" should be close to a single 14", so roughly a 15.....

The effective acoustic radiating area (Sd) is always smaller than the basket diameter. The acoustic radius on an 8" basket driver is going to be around 7", which puts you at ~12pi sq in area for a single driver, or 36pi for three of them. You're looking at 30pi sq in for a 12" driver. Neither is close to the 49pi you'll see from a 15" basket.

Subwoofers are operating in their piston region, so the downside to a smaller basket diameter is that the spider diameter will also be smaller which will reduce CMS linearity (the suspension stiffness will change more with excursion). It is also cheaper to manufacture a single larger basket than to make three smaller baskets, so for the same engineering cost, the larger diameter drivers will naturally be better performing - even for the same acoustic radiating area and volume displacement.

[vw_calvin]

I've got my RF-82's crossover set at 80Hz, and well my dumb receiver doesn't have a cross over setting for the sub, otherwise I'd set it at 80. However it does have the option for speaker size.... What does that do really??

Setting your speaker to large means you're running the speaker full range. It is rarely recommended to run in such a configuration for a variety of reasons, although some people on this forum seem to like it.

Setting your speakers to small and specifying a crossover frequency means that the receiver will apply a high pass filter to the speakers and a low pass filter to the subwoofer. IOW, if you set your mains to small and specify a crossover frequency of 80Hz, a typical result is that the receiver will set the 3dB down point of your mains at 80Hz, and apply a 12dB/octave rolloff beyond that, ie they will be 15dB down at 40Hz, 27dB down at 20Hz. On the other side, the subwoofer will receive bass data from the main channels, but will have its own filters, a common setup being that it will be 6dB down at 80Hz, with a 24dB/octave slope above that (ie it would be 30dB down at 160Hz).

This is what I've got set.

Fronts: 80Hz. (RF-82)

Center: 120Hz. (Sound dynamics cine-center 4" drivers, it's crappy)

Surrounds: 100Hz. (Technics towers)

Subwoofer: 15 inch. (velodyne DLS-5000R, with the crossover set at around 1/2. Stupid velodyne didn't give me a scale, so not 100% what hz it's at.)

Everything seems about right, that's what the calibration set stuff at with exception of the RF-82 were set at Large, and it didn't take in the sub size.

what exactly does setting the 'size' of the sub do tho? I understand the crossover for the sub being set when adjusting the fronts.

[StephenM]

(velodyne DLS-5000R, with the crossover set at around 1/2. Stupid velodyne didn't give me a scale, so not 100% what hz it's at.)

The crossover knob on the subwoofer should be set at "disable" or as high as it will go. The sub's crossover is not needed, as your receiver will be handling the bass management.

what exactly does setting the 'size' of the sub do tho?

Had to actually look at your receiver's manual, as I've never seen that before. I have no idea what it does and the manual doesn't specify that I see... If I were to hazard a guess, maybe it sets a high pass filter on the sub to protect it from too low a frequency, ie cuts it off at 20Hz for a 15", 25Hz for a 12", and so on? Other than that, I have no idea.

PS: Have you tried running in stereo mode, ie without the center and surrounds? I'd have to wonder if they don't present a net negative when being introduced to a system consisting of much better components.

[vw_calvin]

I always run it in stereo when listening to music, but I don't under stand what you mean "present a net negative" lol.

Do I need to run a hpf on the sub? Won't it just not produce the sounds and not do any harm? Or can harm be done?