crd97086 Posted November 25, 2011 Share Posted November 25, 2011 Hello. I am in my 3rd iteration of higher end CD players. For reference, I had the Marantz SA-11S2, then dramtically better as upgraded by The Upgrade Company and now the McIntosh MCD-500 by The Upgrade Company. For your reference these have all happened in 3 months ear time. My question is, do you who purchase actually hear a 'significant' difference between the redbook CDs and the SACD? I just have not in all 3 of these players in such a short period of time. The only quality difference is by going to genres of music, and music houses, that record properly in the first place. That is the only difference that I feel actually exists. I am curious what others truly find, and I mean 'feel' without a whisker of skeptacism. Thanks for any feedback. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RagingBullWinkle Posted November 25, 2011 Share Posted November 25, 2011 Some do some don't. If your in theChicago land area stop over and spin a few. FWIW just got Jimmy D. Lane with Double Trouble SACD 12.50 sounds GREAT! what a bargin. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dennie Posted November 25, 2011 Share Posted November 25, 2011 No! Yes! Sometimes! But no! Are you strickly talking 2 Channel? Or are you asking about Surround Sound? Or Both? Dennie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boxx Posted November 25, 2011 Share Posted November 25, 2011 No! Yes! Sometimes! But no! Are you strickly talking 2 Channel? Or are you asking about Surround Sound? Or Both? Dennie Well maybe, possibly, Si, nein, or something like that.... lol.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gnatnoop Posted November 25, 2011 Share Posted November 25, 2011 i (and i bet all of us have) CDs that vary from superb to yuch.. the few sacd's i've heard are comparable or better than the best cd's i;'ve heard. i have a couple of hirez tracks from hdtracks.com that are similar..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crd97086 Posted November 26, 2011 Author Share Posted November 26, 2011 No Worriess................I do raise some of the best best questions anywhere............just a thinker out doin hi business........................thanks? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crd97086 Posted November 26, 2011 Author Share Posted November 26, 2011 Well, HELLO>>>>> this would be a MAJOR TOPIC...........guess what????????? We aren't suposed to be token' bout' it..........we just old hone boys.......wise up and talk about it it..........it you have ...........then sorry about that.................but keep holdin' between your check and your graw' ................the commercedddddddddddddddssssss to know.........Thanks..........................and start makin..........some NOISE ya' ALLLLLL............has SILENCE got you any where???????????????????????????? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crd97086 Posted November 26, 2011 Author Share Posted November 26, 2011 Just to be specifically specific......I was referring to the SACD layer of the SACD. Thanks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Schu Posted November 26, 2011 Share Posted November 26, 2011 No CD I own, and I own at least a thousand, comes close to my SACD's... it's not like the cd's lack definition or even richness, but the sacd's take it to another level... specifically in fullness and smoothing out harshness. this has come from back to back playing on the same system... albeit not a great highend system(all SS using a PS3 as playback, not all PS3's are sacd compatable). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wrinkles Posted November 26, 2011 Share Posted November 26, 2011 I did a comparison on an OPPO player maybe 3 years ago. I compared the Weather Report "Heavy Weather" SACD to Redbook. It took all of 5 seconds to realize how much better the SACD was to the Redbook. More detail. I listened to it on all solid state equipment and through Klipsch Jubilee speakers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zen Traveler Posted November 26, 2011 Share Posted November 26, 2011 Hello. I am in my 3rd iteration of higher end CD players.... Fwiw, I am guessing there isn't much difference between a high-end CD player that plays SACDs and a lower end SACD player as long as the Bass Mgmt is similar. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SonicSeeker Posted November 26, 2011 Share Posted November 26, 2011 Sacd's seem to smooth out the music while at the same time giving more detail especially when the music gets complicated with several instruments. What kind of difference did you see from sending your mcintosh to the upgrade company and what exactly do they do? I have a MVP 871 going through a Mcintosh c33 to a McIntosh mc2255 feeding Klipschorns. I listen in two channel only, I also find my DVD audio two track are better than the sacd so far but I only have a few of each as of yet. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ducatista Posted November 26, 2011 Share Posted November 26, 2011 Yes, in my experience SACDs are often dramatically superior to the CD version. In addition to more detail, I typically find the SACD version to be smoother and less fatiguing for long listening on my Khorns. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mallette Posted November 26, 2011 Share Posted November 26, 2011 Topic is meaningless as phrased. Now, please don't take that as a cut. What I mean is that SACD and CD (as used here, it's safe to assume we mean Redbook) are just packaging schemes that can sound no better than the source material being stored. Now, if you ask "Does 1 bit, 2.8mhz offer superior potential for audio quality over 16 bit, 44.1khz?" Then the answer is "Well, Duh..." However, when you compare any two recordings on any media, you are comparing ENGINEERING in the main. Certain discs will not differ sonically to any but the most golden eared genetic accident. I have a copy LoneLobo recently gave me of the Virgil Fox Garden Grove sessions reissued on LaserLight...which I've found to be very variable in quality in the past. Very early digital, 37.5khz but the very finest (250k worth, if I recall correctly) components and one of the finest engineers who ever walked at the controls. The LL folks got this one right and I was amazed at how well the CD compared to the analog direct to disc and the digital to LP (there was NO CD at the time) version. DSD would have offered little as there are few harmonics above 15khz on such an organ. I think the comparison is even better in that the 15khz 'brickwall" of the algorithm employed leveled the playing field and enables a real "apples to apples" comparison of direct cut LP, digital to LP, and digital media. OTOH, if you are talking a Strad solo, or piano, DSD both on paper and to the ear will offer substantial and clearly audible improvement over Redbook in the hands of an engineer who is completely competent both technically as well as aesthetically. Dave Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boxx Posted November 26, 2011 Share Posted November 26, 2011 Topic is meaningless as phrased. Now, please don't take that as a cut. What I mean is that SACD and CD (as used here, it's safe to assume we mean Redbook) are just packaging schemes that can sound no better than the source material being stored. Now, if you ask "Does 1 bit, 2.8mhz offer superior potential for audio quality over 16 bit, 44.1khz?" Then the answer is "Well, Duh..." However, when you compare any two recordings on any media, you are comparing ENGINEERING in the main. Certain discs will not differ sonically to any but the most golden eared genetic accident. I have a copy LoneLobo recently gave me of the Virgil Fox Garden Grove sessions reissued on LaserLight...which I've found to be very variable in quality in the past. Very early digital, 37.5khz but the very finest (250k worth, if I recall correctly) components and one of the finest engineers who ever walked at the controls. The LL folks got this one right and I was amazed at how well the CD compared to the analog direct to disc and the digital to LP (there was NO CD at the time) version. DSD would have offered little as there are few harmonics above 15khz on such an organ. I think the comparison is even better in that the 15khz 'brickwall" of the algorithm employed leveled the playing field and enables a real "apples to apples" comparison of direct cut LP, digital to LP, and digital media. OTOH, if you are talking a Strad solo, or piano, DSD both on paper and to the ear will offer substantial and clearly audible improvement over Redbook in the hands of an engineer who is completely competent both technically as well as aesthetically. Dave I had a feeling Dave would weigh in on this one..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Schu Posted November 26, 2011 Share Posted November 26, 2011 I guess the way the question was originally phrased, it could have better been illustrated by saying... can you see the moon better with made by coca cola or glass made by Zeiss. if resolution means anything to you, you have your answer. I realize resolving power doesn't cure cancer, but it does ensure that when you look at it, the least amount of extraneous material, or loss of information, is... well... lost, or worse yet, interpolated. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jdm56 Posted November 26, 2011 Share Posted November 26, 2011 I'll just weigh in with my own very limited experience with hi-rez (DVD-A & SACD): I bought into these formats mainly for the multi-channel aspect, not the higher resolution. Well, we all know how that worked out. Except for classical music, there seems to be practically nothing new coming out in multi-channel of any kind. And even in the classical field, I can't tell that there is a lot of activity, let alone growth, there. Besides, a lot of the multi-channel that did come out was of questionable fidelity, as far as the way they were mixed. That leaves the 2-channel resolution question. My own personal experience would lead me to answer your question with a big "It depends!". Mainly, it depends on the quality of the original recording/mixing/mastering process. If that is sufficiently high, then I would say yes, SACD can offer a higher quality sound. But again, in my experience, most recordings outside of the jazz and classical fields, aren't of high enough quality to begin with that the extra resolution of SACD has anything to offer. Of the handful of SACD's I have that do have clearly top flight sound, I would agree with others that it is the smoothness that stands out compared to CD. Just a smoother, less granular sound. Just like comparing a high-rez photo to a low-rez. So if you have, or will have, a large collection of high-quality jazz and/or classical recordings, then go for it! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mallette Posted November 26, 2011 Share Posted November 26, 2011 Except for classical music, there seems to be practically nothing new coming out in multi-channel of any kind. Multi channel, good. Engineering, bad. Bottom line: 2 channels of bad engineering is better than 4, 5, or 6 channels of bad engineering. Dave Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zen Traveler Posted November 27, 2011 Share Posted November 27, 2011 ... Besides, a lot of the multi-channel that did come out was of questionable fidelity, as far as the way they were mixed. Fwiw, I am a Rocker and have over a hundred well made multichannel disks and very rarely do I find one that I think was mixed bad. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jdm56 Posted November 27, 2011 Share Posted November 27, 2011 I guess it just depends on what you think multi-channel music should sound like. Personally I can't stand feeling like I'm in the middle of the band. It's weird and unnatural to me. I like the band to be together, on the stage, and in front of me. Ambience (reflected sound and reverb swirling all around is cool, as are special effects type sounds and crowd noise, but please...keep the band in front of me, where they belong! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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