Steve Phillips Posted March 29, 2001 Share Posted March 29, 2001 Just for the heck of it,try Mains large with "fronts+subwoofer" My bed room system is;KSB 2.1's,SC-1,SS1's and 2 SW 8 II subs(8"driver w/10"passive) set that way and I have the levels on the subs set just short of half with the level on my 2800 at about -7. I have found that setting the fronts+sub will get you bass on all material not just LFE. Room size is 13'X 21' Try that and let me know what happens.You shouldn't have any problem getting good bass. When you get the Rat shack meter you might be suprised at how much bass is really there. You might try the manual level setting on the Denon,that way you can move to each speaker on your own.Easy way to get used to the meter. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Domain Posted March 30, 2001 Author Share Posted March 30, 2001 Steve, Thanks for the advice. I'll give that a try after I get off work late tonight and see if it makes a difference. I'm going to go ahead and return the current cable, and replace it with a Monster Bass 400. If that still doesn't make the difference, I'm considering talking with the dealer and see if I can just upgrade to the KSW-12. I don't need earth-shattering bass or anything, but if output is still a problem after all the above, I don't think the unit is powerful enough to keep up with the rest of the system. The SF-1's need very little volume to fill the entire room, and start filling other parts of the house too Thanks again, Domain Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DLUngurait Posted March 30, 2001 Share Posted March 30, 2001 Domain, If you can swing the extra $100...the KSW-12 will definitely make you happier than the KSW-10. I myself am a KSW-10 owner and I kick myself all the time for not spending the extra $100. Having said that...do experiment more with sub-woofer placement. I don't really believe that spending more $$$ on a new cable is going to do much to improve your bass output. Upon finding the best placement for my KSW-10 (in a corner about 6" from either wall), I found I had plenty of bass for listening to music, but still kind of lacking for some of the bigger home theater SFX. I know most people here subscribe to the "set all speakers to small / sub yes" idea...but I actually like the way my set-up sounds better when my fronts (KG-3.5's / IMHO very similar to SF-1's) are set to "large". My motto: "Don't spend more money until you are done with experimenting" Good Luck Dave Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boa12 Posted March 30, 2001 Share Posted March 30, 2001 domain, since u settled on the sf-1, keep in mind these are powered towers. they have i think something like 225W peak amps built into each cabinet. i started w/ the rp-5 w/ a similar structure. putting a sub with those u could be experiencing some bass cancelation. maybe ideal placement of the sub would work. or maybe u don't need a ksw at all. or maybe if u want to use a seperate sub u could get like the sf-2(non-powered) w/ a ksw. these are the things a knowledgeable dealer can help u with. with a ksw added though, you're in effect running 3 seperate amplified subwoofers where the 2 sf-1 subs are identical & i assume placed on the same plane, whereas the ksw is not the same & maybe not positioned best. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Domain Posted March 30, 2001 Author Share Posted March 30, 2001 DLUngurait, Thanks for the response Luckily the new monster cable will actually be cheaper then the one I am returning, so I really can't lose there I think. I'm only replacing the cable on the off chance that its having a problem (I read about someone having a similiar problem on the powered subs forum). I "think" this unit should be able to produce more then it is currently...I could be wrong though. As far as room placement, I've moved it just about everywhere, and the results are still unfortunately disappointing. Right now its at the far corner of the room, just about 6" from the adjoining walls. Anyway, after I try some of the previous advice/replace the cable, and if the results are the same, i'm think i'm going to go with the KSW-12. I hadn't planned to drop the extra $$$, but I don't think i'll happy unless I do. Domain Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boa12 Posted March 30, 2001 Share Posted March 30, 2001 when u get the new sub, try putting it in your listening position then move your body around the room w/ the sf-1 & everything else playing too. then put the sub where or if it sounds louder in that place. if it doesn't sound noticeably louder in a certain place u may not need the sub. how do u have the sf-1 hooked up? line level from sub outs to the lfe in jacks? ------------------ Klipsch KLF-30 (front), KLF-C7, Cornwall I (rear) Velodyne HGS-18 sub woofer Monsterbass 400 sub interconnect & Monster Z-12 cable Sony STR-DE935 a/v receiver Sony DVP-C650D cd/dvd player Sony Trinitron 27" stereo tv Toshiba hi-fi stereo vcr Technics dual cassette deck Technics direct drive turntable Scientific Atlanta Explorer 2000 digital cable box rock on! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PaulE Posted March 30, 2001 Share Posted March 30, 2001 I have the SB3s upfront, and teh matching synergy center and surrounds...For the sub, I have the highly rated, and cheap, Sony SAWM40. Now, my receiver, like yours, is a Sony STR model like yours..Only mine is the cheapest STR which gives DD and DTS, ie, the 445. It came from an awards catalogue at work, so I didnt exactly pay for it...Nevertheless, the sound is fine, and works well with the speakers....Your 945 is a Fine receiver...The reason you dont hear good stuff about Sony is two words : Snob Appeal. The same reason you dont see Klipsch speakers mentioned, instead of the 'snobbier' speakers like NHT, Paradigm, B&W, etc. I think youd be nuts frankly to replace your Sony....Theres absolutely nothing wrong with that receiver...Ive read that these receivers run hot, and humm...Well, so what...Mine runs warm, not hot, and its never caused problems...And as far as the hum goes, well, What Hum? I dont have any...I think those guys are turning it up to max volume, putting it on a silent passage, and surprise, surprise, theres hum! So What! Those in the know, who arent swayed by snob appeal will readily admit the Sonys are fine. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Domain Posted March 31, 2001 Author Share Posted March 31, 2001 Well, I finally got home, switched the Denon setup to Front , Sub , Sub , unfortunately there isn't any noticeable difference in the sub output. Just to make sure i'm not crazy, I had someone else come listen with me, and they couldn't tell any difference either. I'll deal with it some more when I have a few days off, test the cable theory, and if it doesn't improve, i'll probably talk to the dealer to see what we can arrange on a KSW-12. Boa12, I think your refering to the SP-1's?? The SF-1's have a tranix horn/mid bass driver, but not the powered woofer. PaulE, I ended up with the Denon because it was more along the lines of what I wanted, and there would have been another reciever purchase in the future anyway (someone else in the family is looking at a set of Quint's). So I figured i'd get it out of the way now, get what I want, and be done with it Domain I didn't mention, but I played around with turning the sub on/off, and its not apparent that is even missing unless the level is past the 3 O'clock mark Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Phillips Posted March 31, 2001 Share Posted March 31, 2001 Domain, I hate that didn't work.There sure is a problem somewhere. I'm using Stinger Queen interconnects to feed my 2 SW 8 II subs and like I said,no problem with the bass.In my oppinion you won't get any difference in cable changes.In my living room I changed from the Stinger Queen to Monsters lest expensive bass interconnect and there was maybe just a bit of diff. I use regular RG-6 coax to feed my 12"powered sub that's running from my surround pre-outs and there is plenty of bass when it's in the surround channel. Maybe the upgrade to the 12 will help.Trey says the my 2 SW 8 II's are about the same as an KSW 10,maybe a 12. I know what I told you works for me and I've tried it all sorts of ways. My 2 8"'s are in the corner and about 6"from the walls. If your dealer is one of the"good"guys,he'll let you upgrade. In my 15.5'X26' living room there are 2 12"sealed with 400 watts rms to each and the one 12" powered,ported behind the couch,there is plenty of bass even at 115dB.And I want to change all that to 2 18"Infra 18"powered Bag Ends.The more the better! Good luck. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boa12 Posted March 31, 2001 Share Posted March 31, 2001 sorry domain, my mistake lordy yes u need a good sub that ksw-12 should be fine. use that sub placement method above. works great, kinda like the method to adjust a rifle site, well u know... steve, 2 18" powered bag ends! i can't keep up w/ u! won't even try ------------------ Klipsch KLF-30 (front), KLF-C7, Cornwall I (rear) Velodyne HGS-18 sub woofer Monsterbass 400 sub interconnect & Monster Z-12 cable Sony STR-DE935 a/v receiver Sony DVP-C650D cd/dvd player Sony Trinitron 27" stereo tv Toshiba hi-fi stereo vcr Technics dual cassette deck Technics direct drive turntable Scientific Atlanta Explorer 2000 digital cable box rock on! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Domain Posted March 31, 2001 Author Share Posted March 31, 2001 Thanks for the responses I called the dealer this morning, and he said I could just pay the difference to do a trade up on the KSW-12, so I suspect i'll head down there tommorow and make the trade. I'm still thinking the KSW-10 is capable of producing more then its currently is, but either way, i'd rather have more then enough power and turn the level down, rather then having the sub level on max all the time. Anyway, I appreciate all the information / advice. Domain Well I traded to the KSW-12 this afternoon, and it was an instant improvement. Everything sounds absolutely stunning now, and finally nice, tight bass. All thats left is just making a few level adjustments when the SPL meter finally comes in Anyway, many thanks for all the advice and help, I'm off to listen to it for a long while Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BLOOMIS914 Posted April 1, 2001 Share Posted April 1, 2001 Domain, try these two items to improve sub output: 1) Be sure to buy/use the Y-splitter to the R/L inputs on your KSW-10/12/or 15. According to Klipsch this will provide a +6Db increase in output. 2) Try running speaker line level inputs and compare to single monster coax cable with splitter. Good luck Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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