moray james Posted April 18, 2012 Share Posted April 18, 2012 Hereare some pictures of an excellent job my brother just did on a pair of H3 cabinets. The cabinets had an issue with loose baffles and thinned white glue was worked into all the seams to tighten them up prior to additional 3/4 strapping to seal and stiffen the baffles. All internal material is 3/4" Oak as it is rigid and will take up little volume in a retro job like this. Each panel has a vertical brace except for the rear baffle which had two braces due to the mid horn driver. There are two 3/4" square struts which tie the top and bottom the two sides and the front and back. There is also a brace between the mid horn driver and the back baffle not shown in these pictures. These cabinets are rock solid and any comparrison to a stock hollow cabinet is simply a joke. I hope that the photo files are not too large to load. Best regards Moray James Heresy 3 cabinet (lo rez).zip Heresy 3 cabinet (lo rez).zip Heresy 3 cabinet (lo rez).zip Heresy 3 cabinet (lo rez).zip Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cfelliot Posted April 18, 2012 Share Posted April 18, 2012 Although a good idea, it seems like a lot of volume reduction! How do they sound? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moray james Posted April 18, 2012 Author Share Posted April 18, 2012 It is not a significant volume reduction less than 4% of the cabinet total vloume. I am sure that the new damping makes up for any volume loss. The tighter structure provide articulation they simply do do have without the brace wirk. If you prefer baffles loose enought to buzz when played hard and front baffle cut out between the woofer and mid horn you can twist with your hand and zero internal brace work then you might wantt to leave them stock. I should think it fair to say that stock cabinets would not be an option for even a casual listener once you tighten it all up. The cabinets have also been re damped with high density fiberglass material. Night and day would be a reasonable description between stock and as they sit right now. The horns have been treated with a dynamat type product and the face of the horns and inside the mouth have been damped with SAE rated F-11 wool felt. Best regards Moray James. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cfelliot Posted April 18, 2012 Share Posted April 18, 2012 Wow! It looks like more than 4%. But, I think you are more than correct that the damping will make up for this. I'm not too worried with my HIIIs as I cross them over to my subs at 80Hz. Tell me more about the "dynamat type" material you used. This I may try. I did do a bunch of bracing when I rebuilt my 3 Heresy I speakers. I also changed all screws to machine screws on the front baffle speakers mounts and rear panel - counter-sink hell on the front!!!!! Regards, Chuck Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moray james Posted April 19, 2012 Author Share Posted April 19, 2012 The braces and the strapping which ties the panels together make a world of difference. Before and after comparrison is kind of stupid when you hear it.I forget the name of the constrained layer damping material I think it was Hush Mat, came from the local auto hot rod shop it is a constrained layer damping material like dynamat. The rear of the horns has been treated along with a pad of the same material on the back of each magnet. Before and after give the horn a rap with your knuckle and it is easy to hear the difference. This difference is easily noticible when you play the horns as well. I am certain that you will hear a significant difference adding bracing (especially the strapping to tie it all together) even though you are crossing at 80 Hz.. Best regards Moray James. Here is a link to some work on the inside of a pair of Quartet's http://www.audiokarma.org/forums/sho...ighlight=klf20 more pics of the Heresy 3 http://www.audiokarma.org/forums/showthread.php?p=5616899#post5616899 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marvel Posted April 19, 2012 Share Posted April 19, 2012 It is not a significant volume reduction less than 4% of the cabinet total vloume. I am sure that the new damping makes up for any volume loss. The tighter structure provide articulation they simply do do have without the brace wirk. If you prefer baffles loose enought to buzz when played hard and front baffle cut out between the woofer and mid horn you can twist with your hand and zero internal brace work then you might wantt to leave them stock. I should think it fair to say that stock cabinets would not be an option for even a casual listener once you tighten it all up. The cabinets have also been re damped with high density fiberglass material. Night and day would be a reasonable description between stock and as they sit right now. The horns have been treated with a dynamat type product and the face of the horns and inside the mouth have been damped with SAE rated F-11 wool felt. Best regards Moray James. Perhaps you should start your own company... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moray james Posted April 19, 2012 Author Share Posted April 19, 2012 Bruce: it is way too much work and to make a profit would be difficult. Even if you did the full meal deal and charged for it I think it would be very difficult to make a go of it. A good example would be the Paladium. seemingly very well built and well designed with the performance to back it up all with a price tag to pay you for building it. Promotion cost are much higher at the price point of a Paladium. I think what a Paladium does for an established company like Klipsch is to raise the bar and provide a platform for learning (like F1 racing) and more importantly to establish your position within the industry. That alone probably raises the precieved value of your lower priced products. This is simply about DIY and about learning what you can do and what that will do for you. Before the Heresy 3 went out to the shop last week I hooked up a new set of mid horns, a rather large set of Peavey CH-1's. I set them up on top of the Heresy 3 mounted vertically with the same driver and ti diaphragms as the stock K701 has. The difference was impressive even given that the H3 crossover was not compensating for the new and much larger horn being a Cd horn. Then I pulld out some klipsch parts and mounted the horns up on top of my KLF20 bins. I installed a set of CF3 crossovers and used the CF3 compression drivers on the Peavey CH-1 horms. Now I had a two way crossover which was designed for a CD horn all be it a much smaller horn. I played with that for a few days enjoying the results and learning why bigger is better. The other day I set the CH-1's up so the driver is at ear level and so that the Vc of the comp driver more or less lines up with the VC's of the woofers in the KLF20 bins, I adjusted the subs so they start rolling off at about 30 Hz.which means they are only covering the bottom six Hz. The results are excellent especially given this is such a knock up of available parts. This set up has been running for a few days and a hand full of friends have had the chance to listen to it. Smaller horns can give you the range of response that you are looking for but they cannot give you the control that larger horns do, it's just not physically possible. I cannot see wanting to listen to the H3 after listening to this set up as it is now and a two way Vs a three way makes the added parts and network complexity seem a waste. Clearly bigger is better. Anyone with a set of K402 who is just plain tired of the space they take up please let me know,but I won't hold my breath on that happening. Best regards Moray James. PS: I do have a picture of this set up but the res is far to high to load it. I will ask the man with the camera if he can reduce the size of the file so I can post it and you can have a look. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Panacea Engineering Posted April 19, 2012 Share Posted April 19, 2012 Moray, You must get the picture to below 250K to load it in a post. Load the picture in Windows Paint or any simular picture program. On Paint choose Image in the top bar, then choose Stretch/Slew. Reduce it to 40% and save. Right click on the saved image and it will give you the new JPG file size. If necessary, keep reducing the percentage until you get below 250K. It is really very simple. If you are using a Windows Machine, all you have to do is right click on the file and pick what to open it with It will gibe you the option of "Open With in the dropdown window. Hope this made some sense W. C. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sancho Panza Posted August 22, 2013 Share Posted August 22, 2013 OLD THREAD TOP so I can find it later Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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