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just.not.happy


colterphoto1

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Yes, it's the P.Audio. Okay then, several, or many have dropped the driver. Everyone who actively posts has dropped it, and everyone else I know wants to get rid of it, but can't afford to. I have no horse in this race, so right, I don't really care. I would like to see Michael happy though.

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Michael,  If one of the problems are the drivers. Let me know, I would be willing to let you borrow my Faitals.  To see if that helps make them right.  Maybe someone has a set of the other low cost options, such EV's DH1A, or B&C, etc..   Come on guys what can we do to see that these things are running at full potential.

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It's amazing to me that the world has to be black or white/"either/or" in people's minds.  Fortunately, the truth is pretty easy to unwind from the fiction in this case.  Let me explain:

 

The K-69-A driver is actually pretty good, as long as you use it below about 11 kHz.  It suffers from the same illness that all other titanium diaphragm "full range" compression drivers suffer from: chatter at or above 14 kHz.  If you are willing to work around that, the K-69-A is a very good driver.

 

My solution (which works extremely well, IMHO) has been to use the K-69-A between two Jubs/TAD TD-4002s as a center speaker JuBelle with a K-510 horn, and a Beyma CP25 "baby cheek" driver on top, crossing carefully at 425 Hz and 8 kHz.  The active settings and delays can be found here.  I don't recommend using a passive crossover or an active analog that cannot compensate for the time delays - as this is a really big deal in terms of sound quality at the K510/K-69-A to CP25 crossover region.  You really need to adjust the time delays to within 1/4 of an inch at these crossover wavelengths (0.018 milliseconds) empirically, i.e., the 1/10th of a wavelength time alignment rule holds for this frequency regime.

 

The polars of the K-510/K69-A and the Beyma match well in the horizontal axis at this crossover point and have about a 5 degree coverage difference vertically on the K-510 to CP25--almost not worth mentioning. 

 

What I find interesting is that a solution is available and has been available for sometime. The problem that I see is that the people that say that one driver is bad or another is good -- aren't taking time to actually find a workable solution to the integration issues. 

 

Every solution approach has its ups and downs. If you're not going to spend the money for a single driver that can easily go from 425 Hz-20 kHz (and we all know what driver type I'm talking about), then you're going to have to deal with the issues on the solution path that you choose.  Any titanium diaphragm driver is going to have trouble above 10 kHz if you are trying to use "full range" compression drivers.  ALL of the titanium-diaphragm full-range compression drivers have problems in this region--it's just physics. 

 

If you are contemplating using dual diaphragm compression driver(s)--and this is also a workable solution--you must also pay attention to the crossover matching of phase and amplitude within that dual diaphragm compression driver.  I bet that the listening differences between a properly crossed and EQed dual diaphragm compression driver/horn can go toe-to-toe with a beryllium diaphragm "full range" compression driver with very little audible difference.

 

Just my $0.02.  YMMV.

 

Chris

Edited by Chris A
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I have more than my share of 402s in my house and have experimented with several different drivers.  There is a ranking that one would establish if you did the same testing and listening.  But there is something that overshadows this driver issue.

 

I agree with Chris to an extent that the 2-way solution works but may not be optimal in some cases.  The bottom line is that when you put a 510 (tweeter) on top of the 402...........and split the high frequencies between the two..........then you have something that does not require the high dollar drivers as much.  I just don't get the same strong HF emphasis in 2-way (Even with the TADs) that I get in 3-way with a less expensive driver on a 510 (above 10-12Khz).  When instead you feed the highs through a 510 you get better emphasis, focus and it reduces the need for an expensive driver.

 

I still have not heard any clearer midrange than a TAD 4002 but I believe it is the 402 horn that is just too big to focus the extreme highs as well as a smaller horn like a 510 can.

 

Yes...........you can have a very nice sounding 2-way setup with a K402, but the 3-way sounds much better to me, more effortless and with more HF emphasis.

 

So...........I would not be so critical of the K69.  it is asking a lot of any driver to play from 400-20K and be perfect the whole way through  on a single horn.

 

One driver I am having great results with in 2-way though is the BMS 4592ND coaxial.  Now that driver is a powerhouse at the top and could make a liar out of me.  But it is not really a single driver..........so all bets are off.  It's a bear to dial in, but it drivers the horn like no other driver I have tried.

 

I guess this doesn't help Mike any............maybe it does.

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  • Klipsch Employees

This is an "adult" site, we should work harder at being adults that either glorify God with our lives, or if you're a non-religious, use your life to help those around you, as well as steering this civilization from barbarism and to some higher level of enlightenment. I don't know what the picture was, but if it involved exploitation of women, no, we don't need that here (or anywhere else for that matter).

So, are there really that many weak minded men here, still being led by their peckers, and can't seem to remember that women are human beings, not objects.

So I see you chose to glorify God deano. Awesome! It is so obvious in your post!!! Edited by Chief bonehead
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Apparently this isn't possible with the driver Klipsch is using, since just about every single Jubliee user has dropped it in favor of something else. Anyways, jokes at someone else's expense aren't really funny, unless you just don't give a **** about the person's feelings.

 

 

Not true but I guess you just don't give a ****

 

miketn

 

Jubilee's rock the ****!

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Our school has a pair of MWMs, and a pair of JBL 2365 horns. If anyone would like to donate a pair of K69 drivers, we would appreciate it. We can give you a receipt for tax purposes. The other gear is coming together slowly.

Bruce

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