Mike Lindsey Posted July 2, 2002 Share Posted July 2, 2002 quote: Originally posted by boa12: mike, are those the gel half sphere isolators you're talkin of? i just got a set of those fro the dvd/cd player in the main room. work pretty well, though a lil pricey for these AQ versions even from audioadvisor (about $50). boa, They are the Final Labs Daruma 3ii's... http://www.venushifi.com/products/daruma.shtml I ordered them from a guy on Audiogon -- dedicatedaudio@aol.com -- who provides free 2 day shipping. They are $99 for a set of 3. I will give it a whirl and let you know my thoughts... Mike Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sunnysal Posted July 3, 2002 Share Posted July 3, 2002 where I live Ed, earthquake foundation, is a REAL issue! LOL! I am shopping now for the Darumas...but in sets of three? doesn't match neatly with the feet on my CD changers....hmmmmm. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
edster00 Posted July 3, 2002 Share Posted July 3, 2002 Don't put the roller blocks under the feet. Put them under the chassis, 1 for R rear, 1 for L rear and 1 for front center. They should raise the chassis of the payer off the factory feet. Good luck! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deang Posted July 3, 2002 Share Posted July 3, 2002 Well no wonder they work so goodf>s> ------------------ Deanf>s> Bi-amplified Klipsch RF7s using a pair of AE-25 PP triode amps. A SF-Line 1 loaded with 6922's and a 9000ES finish the front. The low bass is supplied by SVS and Samson. The crossover is HSU.f>s> This message has been edited by deang on 07-03-2002 at 07:47 PM Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J M O N Posted July 3, 2002 Share Posted July 3, 2002 quote: Originally posted by Mike82: I don't put much faith in what "electrical engineers" have to say when it comes to audio... Wait a minute, aren't these THE GUYS that actually design ALL this audio equipment??? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike82 Posted July 3, 2002 Share Posted July 3, 2002 JMON: Yup, some audio engineers designed a lot of the stuff we listen to, but some hobbyists also did the same. I put the quotations around audio engineers in order to seperate these dweebs from the audio engineers--- audio engineering being a sub-specialty of electrical engineering. Like medicine, it;sa complicated feild and no one can be an expert on everything. I did my undergraduate work in mechanical engineering. I learned a little bit about everything, but not a great deal about anything. The real learning comes after you spend some time immersed in real work, not books and labs. So when I run into these dudes, I don't pay mmuch attention. ------------------ Transport: CEC TL-2X DAC: Audiomat Maestro Pre-amp: Wyetech Jade Amps: Wyetech Onyx monoblock Interconects: Analysis Plus Solo Monocrystal Speaker cable: Analysis Plus Solo Monocrystal Power cords: CPCC Top Gun and Model 11 Line conditioner: CPCC Super Power Block Equip Stand: Grand Prix Audio Monaco Currently hunting Klipsch (Khorn, Belle, Lascala) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deang Posted July 3, 2002 Share Posted July 3, 2002 I was kind of hoping this thread would die. I mean, sometimes it's just plain better to agree to disagree and let it go at that. But I can't!f>s>I don't put much faith in what "electrical engineers" have to say when it comes to audio. Their thinking seems to be limited to what the current technology allows them to "measure", ie, if it can't be measured, it doesn't exist.f>s> I really think your statement is somewhat unfair and prejudiced. The truth is, the nature of electricity, and the transfer of power is so well understood, that it doesn't even come down to "measurements" -- it comes down to what is possible and what is not, based upon the nature of it. "Sound" does not flow down our cables. "Sound" is merely the result of electrical impulses being translated into mechanical motion by the advancement of an electrical field. The "field" is advanced by electrons as they are "excited" and bump into each other. The field is either there or it is not. The resulting "impulses" are there, or they are not. There is nothing in the nature of a conductor itself to "create" or "shape" sound -- because "sound" does not exist until the electrical impulses create the mechanical motion. All cable and wire from the receptacle to the drivers, is simply different intensities of an electrical field. I work in the networking field. There is a company named "Pairgain" that makes some nifty T1 modems. You can change interface cards in them so you can use them in various applications. They can facilitate T1 and DSL over copper, and can be used to create an Ethernet bridge over 2 miles. When they came in to demonstrate the device, they used a long piece of old, completely rusted barbed wire. We use these devices exclusively as T1 modems and DSU/CSUs for clocking on Cisco routers. They are used on pre-World War II paper wrapped lead circuits. The condition of this wire is simply horrid -- yet we have no trouble pushing data across most it. Some of it is, however, so bad that we can't use it. So, I maintain that it doesn't matter if your copper is from Home Depot or Cardis. If the conductor is in good shape -- it will simply do it's thing.f>s>...an "electical engineer" came in and told me the best way to demonstrate the speakers was to have them pointing dead-on axis at the listener. He went on to blather about anaechoic testing, blah, blah, but he was full of crap! My ears, and the designers ears told us otherwise.f>s> Well, he was an Electrical Engineer, not a Sound or Acoustics Engineer. Setting up speakers properly for a given room situation has nothing to do with "electricity" -- so I don't understand your point here. At any rate, what he told you was not "incorrect", as positioning speakers on-axis limits side wall reflections.f>s>. Unfortunately, psychoacoustics is a newer field and the "electrical engineers" sure as **** don't have the technology to measure psychoacoustic phenomena.f>s> Actually, "psychoacoutics" was a much discussed topic back in the 70's. It's just a big word that has more to with what is in your head, affecting how, and what you hear. I should add here that my comments are in the context of "wire". "Wires" are not "circuits", and I certainly do not believe all CD players, amp, preamps, etc., sound the same. BTW, did you know some manufactures of high-end electronics recommend the elimination of extraneous power condioning? This is because good equipment already has "power conditioning" built into it.f>s>------------------ Deanf>s> Bi-amplified Klipsch RF7s using a pair of AE-25 PP triode amps. A SF-Line 1 loaded with 6922's and a 9000ES finish the front. The low bass is supplied by SVS and Samson. The crossover is HSU.f>s> This message has been edited by deang on 07-03-2002 at 09:21 PM Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kenratboy Posted July 3, 2002 Author Share Posted July 3, 2002 Deang, I know where you are coming from! My DSL (1.5/384, FAST!!!) runs over normal phone lines and then goes into the DSL moden, then the router, then to our NIC cards. All the phone cabling is CRAP, and our stuff is from Home Depot and other retailers (about 10 different stores...) Well, I have been downloading DVD's, and the so called "line loss" or UN-99.9999% copper lines hasen't hindered my gigabytes of downloads. Now, why do I need a $60 digital cable that is 100X less critical than a DSL line that is made of 100% cheap KoPper? ------------------ Receiver: Sony STR-DE675 CD player: Sony CDP-CX300 Turntable: Technics SL-J3 with Audio-Technica TR485U Speakers: JBL HLS-610 Subwoofer: JBL 4648A-8 Sub amp: Parts Express 180 watt Center/surrounds: Teac 3-way bookshelfs Yes, it sucks, but better to come. KLIPSCH soon! My computer is better than my stereo! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
justin_tx_16 Posted July 3, 2002 Share Posted July 3, 2002 I have digital cable. you only notice improved picture on stations that are digital, and as luck would have it, most of the digital channels i like never work. our HDTV signal is always choppy, if there. it is getting worse and worse. we get our digital cable, our HDTV and our internet from Time Warner. About 3 times every month we lose complete connection to Time Warner, no internet, not tv for anywhere from 15 minutes to 3 hours, normally a few hours. why should we pay them >$100 a month when we get service like this? I can not remember the last time our HDTV worked like it should, or the last time at least half of the digital (fully digital) channels worked, such as MTV2 and MuchMusic (sent digitally, wow, a lot better than digital regular MTV... not really a digital feed I guess, same with everything under channel 200 it seems, or something around there) ------------------ -justin SoundWise Support A technical help site created by me and my fellow Klipschers I am an amateur, if it is professional; ProMedia help you want email Amy or call her @ 1-888-554-5665 or for an RA# 800-554-7724 ext 5 Klipsch Home Audio help you want, email support@klipsch.com or call @ 1-800-KLIPSCH RA# Fax Number=317-860-9140 / Parts Department Fax Number=317-860-9150s> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skonopa Posted July 4, 2002 Share Posted July 4, 2002 Deang mentioned in a post: When they came in to demonstrate the device, they used a long piece of old, completely rusted barbed wire. Hmmm, kinda sounds like what they use for our phone service! They must transmit the signal through all that barbed wire on the cow pastures here Then Justin says: About 3 times every month we lose complete connection to Time Warner, no internet, not tv for anywhere from 15 minutes to 3 hours, normally a few hours. why should we pay them >$100 a month when we get service like this? I can not remember the last time our HDTV worked like it should, or the last time at least half of the digital (fully digital) channels worked, such as MTV2 and MuchMusic (sent digitally, wow, a lot better than digital regular MTV... not really a digital feed I guess, same with everything under channel 200 it seems, or something around there) I had the same question as you. I ended up ditching the cable service and getting DirecTV instead, maybe something you guys ought to consider. Pay much less and very rarely ever lost a signal (only during extremely heavy downpours - rain fade as they call it). The picture has alway been very clear. Hell, my parents ended up doing the same thing when they saw my setup! They live in a rinky-dinky little town way up in the northern part of VA (almost into W-VA) and thier cable service really sucked major. I later added the Ultimate TV reciever. Being able to digitally record programs (would love that see that movie, but it is on at 3am - no prob, just save it and watch it later! I wanted to watch all 5 of those Babylon 5 movies back at the beginning of June on the Sci-Fi channel, but didn't want to sit inside all day on a gorgeous sunday afternoon, no prob - I saved them all and watched them at my own leisure!) as well as pause and rewind live TV (dude - that was an awesome play, I gotta see that again!) is a god send! That one piece of gear has gotta be one of the best things I have ever spent my money on! Unfortunatly, I still get my internet access through the cable system. I wonder if they send the cable signals through that same rusty barbed wire here . To Adelphia's credit, it has actually been pretty reliable, despite all thier financial woes. (Financial woes or not, as long as I continue paying my $54/month, it better keep f'ing working!). Also, when Kenratboy talked about a $60 digital cable, I don't think he ment digital cable TV service, I think he ment an actual cable for connecting the digital output of a DVD player to the digital input of the reciever or pre-pro. (I only spent $40 on mine, but I needed two of them - one for the DVD player and one for my DirecTV reciever ) (Boy has this thread gone way off topic ). ------------------ Steven Konopa Fredericksburg, VA Denon AVR3802 (Receiver) RF-7 (Fronts) RC-7 (Center) RC-7 (Rear) RS-7 (A Surrounds) Infinity RS2000.5 (B Surrounds - recycled) REL Storm III (Subwoofer 1) Yamaha YST-SW40 (Subwoofer 2 - Recycled) JVC XV-S65GD (DVD) Sharp DX-200 (CD - ancient) RCA DWD490RE (DirecTV/Ultimate TV receiver) Sharp 32 inch (TV) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
justin_tx_16 Posted July 4, 2002 Share Posted July 4, 2002 here is the deal... our cable service comes in on really nice cable, RG-6 or better. our neighborhood is new, so that is not really an issue. our cable service for internet is all we can get, no DSL out here. we get so much rain, every day for the past like 15 days, that we are afraid of even worse conditions with a DTV i have also heard that you can not get HDTV though that??? no, that can not be true. Time Warner is about to release, iConnect. Watch any movie they have, anytime you want, fast forward, pause, rewind it, you have total control. that i have to see. so we will stick with this time warner stuff, just maybe get some months for free, we at least got the Tyson Lewis fight for free, saved $50! though the actualy fight was only like 15 minutes. got $150 off that game... duh! Lewis was gonna win ------------------ -justin SoundWise Support A technical help site created by me and my fellow Klipschers I am an amateur, if it is professional; ProMedia help you want email Amy or call her @ 1-888-554-5665 or for an RA# 800-554-7724 ext 5 Klipsch Home Audio help you want, email support@klipsch.com or call @ 1-800-KLIPSCH RA# Fax Number=317-860-9140 / Parts Department Fax Number=317-860-9150s> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kenratboy Posted July 4, 2002 Author Share Posted July 4, 2002 Yes, I ment a actual digital cable, as in a Monster or Kimber optical digital cable. But, Justin's brings up a good point, CABLE TV SUCKS!!! GET DSS, NOW!!! It is great, we have had it for over 5 years in two different countries (British satellite TV is crappy, but 100X better than getting BBC 1, 2, and 3. There is also a TV licence in England, about $100 a year, really, we had to pay it.) DSS is NEVER down (like ONCE a year, for a FEW minuits, hasn't happened for over a year.) Anything but a foot of snow won't hurt reception. POSSIBLY a HUGE storm. It is great, all the channels (quality and sound wise) are 2-5X better than digital cable (we had digital cable for a few months) and, well, IT'S GREAT!!! We get DSL from SBC/Nevada Bell, and except for ONE line problem at the beginning, it is GREAT! Send me a PM and I will tell you all the joys of "file-sharing." I don't want the forum admin to have to stop my "file-sharing" tales. Anyway, the way to go is DSL (not cable, but even cable is WAY WAY WAY better than 56K) and DSS. They are fairly priced (compared to cable) and the reliability is AWSOME!!! Like I said, the two services just don't break down. For you rural people, there is also a TRANSMIT AND RECEIVE (if you know the technology, yes, I mean transmit) DSL/DSS service, but it is new and VERY expensive, but too cool to not like. ------------------ Receiver: Sony STR-DE675 CD player: Sony CDP-CX300 Turntable: Technics SL-J3 with Audio-Technica TR485U Speakers: JBL HLS-610 Subwoofer: JBL 4648A-8 Sub amp: Parts Express 180 watt Center/surrounds: Teac 3-way bookshelfs Yes, it sucks, but better to come. KLIPSCH soon! My computer is better than my stereo! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
justin_tx_16 Posted July 4, 2002 Share Posted July 4, 2002 cable internet is my only option, but that is a-ok speed wise. i average 2997kbps you have my email, i have yours, lets talk DSS ------------------ -justin SoundWise Support A technical help site created by me and my fellow Klipschers I am an amateur, if it is professional; ProMedia help you want email Amy or call her @ 1-888-554-5665 or for an RA# 800-554-7724 ext 5 Klipsch Home Audio help you want, email support@klipsch.com or call @ 1-800-KLIPSCH RA# Fax Number=317-860-9140 / Parts Department Fax Number=317-860-9150s> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kenratboy Posted July 4, 2002 Author Share Posted July 4, 2002 Justin, an e-mail is on its way. ------------------ Receiver: Sony STR-DE675 CD player: Sony CDP-CX300 Turntable: Technics SL-J3 with Audio-Technica TR485U Speakers: JBL HLS-610 Subwoofer: JBL 4648A-8 Sub amp: Parts Express 180 watt Center/surrounds: Teac 3-way bookshelfs Yes, it sucks, but better to come. KLIPSCH soon! My computer is better than my stereo! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boa12 Posted July 4, 2002 Share Posted July 4, 2002 ken, you seem to tie dss & dsl together as one service. of curse they be for marketing but the tech is 2 totally dif systems. cable tv reliability & service can always use some improvement, but dss experiences the same weather-related outages if not more from what i've heard. & the cusomer service can be the same as, if not worse, for both dss & dsl too. i'll give you dsl is more reliable against outages about as much so as the local phone service which is really what it is. but the tw cable internet here smokes the basic dsl at comparable prices (around $40/mo.) in speed (about 1mbps for the cable). one thing i don't like about the digital cable tv i have here though is the PPV movies are all still just dolby 2.0 & not 5.1. hopefully they rectify that soon. both have advantages & disadvantages. not trying to start up the old dss vs cable war again. but dss does overall require more cash outlay than cable & also suffers from the outages. "cable tv sucks" from the dss crowd sounds to me more like personal post-purchase reinforcement. now dsl tv service would be the best of all for reliability, but i don't know if that's even available anywhere yet. but i'm not going to get into a dss vs cable or cable vs dsl debate. just seems odd that the many of the dss'ers slam cable even after they've switched. ------------------ My Home Systems Page This message has been edited by boa12 on 07-04-2002 at 05:51 PM Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kenratboy Posted July 4, 2002 Author Share Posted July 4, 2002 boa12, in a nice way, I know how the systems work, we installed them ourselves. If I am not being clear in my posts, I will clarity. OK. what i am saying is there is DSS. Satellite TV, it comes through a dish. ALSO, there is a system, with the DSS satellite, which will, in addition to DSS, will give you psudo-DSL through the satellite data stream. One dish, one satellite, TWO services, DSL and DSS. It is for people who cannot obtain land-based broadband, hence it is more expen$ive. DSL, can come through the phone lines (it rides a higher frequency) OR, see above. Customer support, SBC (DSL) has been excellent, much to our shock, they really can help you, at least from our experience. Customer support for DSS? Well, we have never had to use it, in 5 years, so I don't know. Weather problems? Not a issue is you take the proper steps. Two things, you get a heater than sticks on the dish, and mests snow and ice off. Two, you can literally wrap the satellite in a bag (they sell fitted ones) and the snow cannot cling to it. So, weather is not an issue. Last, WE DO NOT HAVE ANY SERVICE OUTAGES!!!s>, at the most, 5-10 minuites a year. Really, there is a lot of anti-satellite TV propaganda going around, I speak from using the system heavily for the past 5 years, there are FEW outages, and they are SHOURT. We have had NO outages since last year (Oct or Nov 2001) ------------------ Receiver: Sony STR-DE675 CD player: Sony CDP-CX300 Turntable: Technics SL-J3 with Audio-Technica TR485U Speakers: JBL HLS-610 Subwoofer: JBL 4648A-8 Sub amp: Parts Express 180 watt Center/surrounds: Teac 3-way bookshelfs Yes, it sucks, but better to come. KLIPSCH soon! My computer is better than my stereo! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike Lindsey Posted July 4, 2002 Share Posted July 4, 2002 Ken, You are also in Nevada where it rains like 10 times a year. I live in Florida where it rains every day. When I had Satellite, it would go down every day. I got tired of it and opted for Time Warner. It has it's faults too but at least it stays up most of the time... Mike Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boa12 Posted July 4, 2002 Share Posted July 4, 2002 ken, thanks for being nice. somehow i got the sense you were slamming digital cable & guess I have the same knee-jerk reaction to that as somebody w/ a $3000 sub slamming a $500 sub that only goes down to 30-25hz. but how do you control the atmospheric disruptions between the sat & dish? maybe reno's a great place to avoid those. i've always thought eventually all signals will move strictly through the air. iow, a wireless world. & that means no more speaker cables & interconnects to mess w/ too. i'm not against sat/dbs/dss at all. looking to learn more about all actually. but at this time i'm pretty satisfied w/ cable tv & internet for the money i want to spend. & i've noticed the dss services have their share of anti-cable propaganda too. given some pro-dss, anti-cable comments on this forum, you'd think there was a total breakdown in information to the public. iow, why doesn't everybody have sat? ------------------ My Home Systems Page Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kenratboy Posted July 4, 2002 Author Share Posted July 4, 2002 No, I am not slamming digital cable, I am just saying, I had it, spent $100's on it, and I thought it was HORRIBLE. $500 vs. $3000, WRONG!!! They are about the same price, DSS is cheaper in many cases (packages start at ~$30.) OK, I had DSS in both San Francisco, CA and here in Reno, NV. In Reno, we have dust, thick smoke from forrest fires, HUGE (not Texas-sized) thunderstorms, and SNOW. They DO NOT effect the system. However, if the dish is not pointed exactly at the satellite (the satellite is PERFECT, never moves) and it is "slightly" off, you can have a reduced signal streangh and it will be flakey. There is a mode in the satellite menu that gives you real-time signal streangh so you can adjust it IF it was improperly installed. We had one dish up for two full years (with BAD, constant wind) and it never moved. I am not bashing digital cable (although I HATE it), but rather saying that DSS is all that, and I think people should try it. No one here gets attacked for promoting Klipsch or SVS, so why can't I express my happiness and sucess with DSS in hopes of making others happy, and hopefully having my experience (not luck) with DSS? ------------------ Receiver: Sony STR-DE675 CD player: Sony CDP-CX300 Turntable: Technics SL-J3 with Audio-Technica TR485U Speakers: JBL HLS-610 Subwoofer: JBL 4648A-8 Sub amp: Parts Express 180 watt Center/surrounds: Teac 3-way bookshelfs Yes, it sucks, but better to come. KLIPSCH soon! My computer is better than my stereo! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fini Posted July 5, 2002 Share Posted July 5, 2002 0.999...=1 and here's why. 0.999...X 10= 9.999... 9.999...- 0.999...= 9 9/9= 1 Throw that through your window... fini Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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