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Klipsch KPT-1802-HLS Horn Subwoofer

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Excuse my ignorance, but I was wondering why the use of commercial loudspeakers in a residence? Apart from the obvious increased sound levels, what other benefits are provided by this setup?

You're kidding, right? It's not about the decibels, but the less restricted soudscape. The traditional K-55 V midrange "squawker driver" is 5/8" or about 16mm diameter driver's surface area pales in comparison to the 3" voice coil feeding a 2" throat in the large midrange horn. The tweeters have a full 1-2" drivers also, depengin, and the woofer sections have flatter output, and the subwoofers move some serious air. All have 100-1112 db/watt efficiency requiring only MILLIWATTS of power, hence, ridiculously low distortion, clarity, micro detail, ambience recovery, TRANSIENT response and realism to scare you out of your seat.

The decibels is the least of it but it will do that too untilil you are deaf, if that is what you want, but most of us keep it under the "safe zone" of 85 db average level and below.

Edited by ClaudeJ1

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Is there a frequency response graph for this sub anywhere? 26Hz +/- 3dB is pretty solid but not enough to cope with a lot of LFE out there. I'm quite interested in what it can do below that and the graph would give some indication.

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I said, excuse my ignorance, but you have to get all high and mighty. I was just curious. Sorry for the bother. Jerk.

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I said, excuse my ignorance, but you have to get all high and mighty. I was just curious. Sorry for the bother. Jerk.

I'm sorry you took it that way, I just thought it would be pretty obvious to someone that calls themselves an "advanced member" with the thousands of posts written here about this very subject. Unfortunately, it's easy for either of us to come off in ways that were not meant to be, and this is clearly the case. I originally misinterpreted your intent as total sarcasm base on your "excuse my ignorance" opening statement along with your Advanced Member title. No offense meant either way, I'm sure. No bother at all, we are all here to figure all this out.

Edited by ClaudeJ1

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Is there a frequency response graph for this sub anywhere? 26Hz +/- 3dB is pretty solid but not enough to cope with a lot of LFE out there. I'm quite interested in what it can do below that and the graph would give some indication.

I can see where we would all be curious about this. Just keep in mind that for THX theaters, going much below 25 Hz. is not part of the specification. Whereas, with the advent of all the tapped horns out there and the HT guys that dig down to single digit sub sub bass, I do get the reasoning behind your question.

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I said, excuse my ignorance, but you have to get all high and mighty. I was just curious. Sorry for the bother. Jerk.

I'm sorry you took it that way, I just thought it would be pretty obvious to someone that calls themselves an "advanced member" with the thousands of posts written here about this very subject. Unfortunately, it's easy for either of us to come off in ways that were not meant to be, and this is clearly the case. I originally misinterpreted your intent as total sarcasm base on your "excuse my ignorance" opening statement along with your Advanced Member title. No offense meant either way, I'm sure. No bother at all, we are all here to figure all this out.

And on that note, I'm cancelling my forum membership, so you want have to be insulted by my dumb questions.

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I said, excuse my ignorance, but you have to get all high and mighty. I was just curious. Sorry for the bother. Jerk.

I'm sorry you took it that way, I just thought it would be pretty obvious to someone that calls themselves an "advanced member" with the thousands of posts written here about this very subject. Unfortunately, it's easy for either of us to come off in ways that were not meant to be, and this is clearly the case. I originally misinterpreted your intent as total sarcasm base on your "excuse my ignorance" opening statement along with your Advanced Member title. No offense meant either way, I'm sure. No bother at all, we are all here to figure all this out.

With all due respect Claude, your response is really a "back handed" apology. I believe that just stating "Im sorry, it wasn't my intent" then moving on from the conversation would have been sufficient.

By stating "I'm sorry you took it that way" only implies to most readers that you are taking no responsibility in the interaction.

By stating "I just thought it would be pretty obvious to someone that calls themselves an "advanced member with thousands of posts written here about this very subject" you have shown a reader that you most likely do not understand the forum conversion protocols written to assign titles and have not looked at his post count, let alone, read any of his previous posts.

I believe that upon conversion to the new forum, the conversion protocol assigned certain titles based on certain criteria. For example 90 posts could be considered a "newbie" but registering during 2000 and assigning a title of "newbie" would seem odd, hence the title most likely being unaltered by pgh was converted as "advanced member."

When I look at the situation, I see someone who registered on 12/19/2000 and has ~ 90 posts over 13 1/2 years on the forum, which approximates 6 posts a year. While some people with 6 posts a year may still read alot of threads on a multitude of topics, most do not read anything other than what interests them or only read threads where they have specifically posted. In addition, while I see a few posts in the "pro audio" section, most were from 2003 - 2004 time frame and no posts "on this very subject." I did see a post recently asking about "Danley Labs" that has no responses.

To pgh - I find it interesting that you are now asking about removing your membership in another thread over this one incident. If this negative interaction is the worst thing to happen to you in life, I would say you are doing doing pretty damn good for yourself.

I am now reminded of a few words of wisdom my Dad gave me after my first school-yard scuffle at six years old. He didn't console me or baby me or blame anyone else, but said "son, it's time you 'grew a pair' and learned how to defend yourself......" as he took me to the back yard to start teaching me how to fight.

I hope this helps both parties.

Edited by Fjd
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...I hope this helps both parties.

Fwiw, I feel better. :)

That said, the offensive part must have been edited out of Claude's original post because I don't see anything wrong with his response:

Excuse my ignorance, but I was wondering why the use of commercial loudspeakers in a residence? Apart from the obvious increased sound levels, what other benefits are provided by this setup?

You're kidding, right? It's not about the decibels, but the less restricted soudscape. The traditional K-55 V midrange "squawker driver" is 5/8" or about 16mm diameter driver's surface area pales in comparison to the 3" voice coil feeding a 2" throat in the large midrange horn. The tweeters have a full 1-2" drivers also, depengin, and the woofer sections have flatter output, and the subwoofers move some serious air. All have 100-1112 db/watt efficiency requiring only MILLIWATTS of power, hence, ridiculously low distortion, clarity, micro detail, ambience recovery, TRANSIENT response and realism to scare you out of your seat.

The decibels is the least of it but it will do that too untilil you are deaf, if that is what you want, but most of us keep it under the "safe zone" of 85 db average level and below.

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That said, the offensive part must have been edited out of Claude's original post because I don't see anything wrong with his response:

I'm not sure if there was more and it was edited out. I wouldn't have found it offensive either; however, as in my post, my Dad made me 'grow a pair' a long time ago and I focused more on the 'back handed' apology, which did give me a good chuckle this morning as I don't consider an apology with so many 'qualifiers' and 'disclaimers' to be a real apology as the 'qualifiers' and 'disclaimers' tend to mask any sincerity.

Edited by Fjd

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That said, the offensive part must have been edited out of Claude's original post because I don't see anything wrong with his response:
The decibels is the least of it but it will do that too until you are deaf, if that is what you want

The only thing I would change is a small part of my original response, which is to remove the two "you" words in my quote above to read like a more generic: "The decibels is the least of it but it will do that too until the listener is deaf, unless that is the intent....." Does a newcomer with the title "advanced member" presume too much and overreact with above average sensitivity and misinterpretation?" Some people just don't want to jump in the pool after dipping their toe in new waters, which is the power of choice.

My response wasn't an apology, per se, but trying to identify the root cause of the misunderstanding on both sides. After all, the biggest assumption is that we are grown men with thick skin. But, I suppose all of us can have a lapse of that quality from time to time (at the wrong time and place as well). However I think that taking all our marbles and going home is a display of another over reaction, but I'm not a shrink. It's only happened to me a couple of times that I can recall out of thousands of post, so I believe my batting average is still good and my integrity secure. I'd like to think that my thousands of posts, all of them attempting to inform with discoveries and data, not just opinions.

Truthfully, I'm a little fed up with this kind of BS and if I ever decide to leave it will not have been after billing myself as "advanced" with 86 posts.

Edited by ClaudeJ1

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That said, the offensive part must have been edited out of Claude's original post because I don't see anything wrong with his response:

I'm not sure if there was more and it was edited out. I wouldn't have found it offensive either; however, as in my post, my Dad made me 'grow a pair' a long time ago and I focused more on the 'back handed' apology, which did give me a good chuckle this morning as I don't consider an apology with so many 'qualifiers' and 'disclaimers' to be a real apology as the 'qualifiers' and 'disclaimers' tend to mask any sincerity.

I did not edit anything from the original post. My edits are usually to add other things and correct typos, since I tend to type fast.

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That said, the offensive part must have been edited out of Claude's original post because I don't see anything wrong with his response:

I'm not sure if there was more and it was edited out. I wouldn't have found it offensive either; however, as in my post, my Dad made me 'grow a pair' a long time ago and I focused more on the 'back handed' apology, which did give me a good chuckle this morning as I don't consider an apology with so many 'qualifiers' and 'disclaimers' to be a real apology as the 'qualifiers' and 'disclaimers' tend to mask any sincerity.

Generally you are both right, and that can often be the case. But like all general things in life, one had to make room for exceptions. It's hard to be truly objective about one's own words until much time has gone by, like months instead of minutes. So after a good night's sleep, I can SINCERELY say that I was trying to ANSWER the question and he too easily took offense. In fact, I think all of my responses were way more sincere than the presentation of himself and his question.

It seems to me that one is a newcomer to an internet group with a zillions topics and posts, one would do a bit of reading first to get a bit of a feel for the subject at hand.

Now I need to get back to making my "Super Heresys" which I will post about later. In the mean time, let's not waste any more bandwidth on this and enjoy some great music!

Edited by ClaudeJ1

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For the record, I didn't find anything wrong with your post as I read it this morning and is why I asked/mentioned the edit, not having read the original last night.

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Fwiw, I feel better. That said, the offensive part must have been edited out of Claude's original post because I don't see anything wrong with his response:

Thanks for a correct interpretation of my words. No I did not edit out anything.

Edited by ClaudeJ1

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I believe that upon conversion to the new forum, the conversion protocol assigned certain titles based on certain criteria. For example 90 posts could be considered a "newbie" but registering during 2000 and assigning a title of "newbie" would seem odd, hence the title most likely being unaltered by pgh was converted as "advanced member."

Truthfully, I'm a little fed up with this kind of BS and if I ever decide to leave it will not have been after billing myself as "advanced" with 86 posts.

I don't want to keep re-hashing as we are only cluttering a very informative thread on this great horn sub, but I think you missed this portion of my post as I do not believe that he has purposely billed himself as an "advanced member."

I once worked for a company where the person's "title" dictated how good of a desk phone they gave you. What resulted was a situation where the people with the lowest titles that had to actually use the phone most of the day, got a crappy phone, while those that didn't even necessarily use a phone once a day, got the best money could buy. It didn't make sense to me as people need to sometimes look past a "title" and do what makes "sense."

I actually like the way that diyaudio does it. They just state "DIY audio member" and have a join date. Of course, the "join date" can be misleading without reading a few posts to understand the audience. However, they have no "rankings" no post counts shown, etc.

All said, making assumptions based on limited information is not a substitute for a little research or reading a few posts to better understand your audience. I see poor face to face understanding of one's audience almost daily and it is only more difficult with on line communication.

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you have shown a reader that you most likely do not understand the forum conversion protocols written to assign titles and have not looked at his post count, let alone, read any of his previous posts.

Correct. seriously I have no clue about conversion protocols by software, politics, or self proclamation. But I know I have helped a lot of people here get better sound.

I got a good chuckle about your response and the story about your dad. Thanks for that one.

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I believe that upon conversion to the new forum, the conversion protocol assigned certain titles based on certain criteria. For example 90 posts could be considered a "newbie" but registering during 2000 and assigning a title of "newbie" would seem odd, hence the title most likely being unaltered by pgh was converted as "advanced member."

Truthfully, I'm a little fed up with this kind of BS and if I ever decide to leave it will not have been after billing myself as "advanced" with 86 posts.

I don't want to keep re-hashing as we are only cluttering a very informative thread on this great horn sub, but I think you missed this portion of my post as I do not believe that he has purposely billed himself as an "advanced member."

I once worked for a company where the person's "title" dictated how good of a desk phone they gave you. What resulted was a situation where the people with the lowest titles that had to actually use the phone most of the day, got a crappy phone, while those that didn't even necessarily use a phone once a day, got the best money could buy. It didn't make sense to me as people need to sometimes look past a "title" and do what makes "sense."

I actually like the way that diyaudio does it. They just state "DIY audio member" and have a join date. Of course, the "join date" can be misleading without reading a few posts to understand the audience. However, they have no "rankings" no post counts shown, etc.

All said, making assumptions based on limited information is not a substitute for a little research or reading a few posts to better understand your audience. I see poor face to face understanding of one's audience almost daily and it is only more difficult with on line communication.

No kidding!

Now back on topic. Roy Delgado is, as far as I know, the most prolific engineer Klipsch has ever had. I can only imagine all the stuff he designed that never made it out the door as a product. A Quad of this new sub in large venues will provide the lowest sub bass distortion possible with the utmost impact where it counts for thousands of people who witness new movies in the Malco Theaters.

Since the OP was bold enough to buy one, let's face it, it resulted in lots of envy, since putting one in a house will definitely created killer bass with ridiculously low distortion. Low distortion was ALWAYS the point that PWK drove home in his products and published technical papers.

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you have shown a reader that you most likely do not understand the forum conversion protocols written to assign titles and have not looked at his post count, let alone, read any of his previous posts.

Correct. seriously I have no clue about conversion protocols by software, politics, or self proclamation. But I know I have helped a lot of people here get better sound.

I got a good chuckle about your response and the story about your dad. Thanks for that one.

I've greatly enjoyed how freely you share your insights and new discoveries and sure want you to continue (hint - I still would like you to run Hornsrep on the AE TD 15 M 4 & 8 ohm drivers on your Quarter Pie and Jamboree). I was just hoping to bridge a gap here.

Sometimes I think if someone has read enough of your posts, it comes down to "those of us that know you, no explanation is necessary and for those out there that don't know you, if they don't invest some time, no explanation is possible."

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For the record, I didn't find anything wrong with your post as I read it this morning and is why I asked/mentioned the edit, not having read the original last night.

Again, thank you for that.

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I've greatly enjoyed how freely you share your insights and new discoveries and sure want you to continue (hint - I still would like you to run Hornsrep on the AE TD 15 M 4 & 8 ohm drivers on your Quarter Pie and Jamboree). I was just hoping to bridge a gap here. Sometimes I think if someone has read enough of your posts, it comes down to "those of us that know you, no explanation is necessary and for those out there that don't know you, if they don't invest some time, no explanation is possible."

Not possible? another good laugh.

Looking into your woofer request, the Outer Diameter of those drivers are larger than would fit in my Quarter Pies. However, if someone were to set their table saw to 15 3/4" instead of 15 1/2" to cut the plywood strips, they could be mounted in there with very little consequence to the horn. Further discussion should be placed in the Quarter Pie thread as we have gone off topic enough here.

Even if the AE drivers were used, which appear to be rugged beasts, the basic low end cutoff of the horn would still be the same within a few Hz. and with the variance at the midrange/midbass end being the greatest change, if any.

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