T2K Posted February 10, 2018 Share Posted February 10, 2018 18 minutes ago, oldtimer said: Wrong. It's because I am in Hawaii. I was referring to L.A. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WillyBob Posted February 10, 2018 Share Posted February 10, 2018 I lived/worked in the armpit of Kauai ... Lihue 8 years Was there when Iniki came through I was either at work, the beach, or asleep Kauai Marriott, prolly not now, ... but on beautiful Kalapaki Beach. HaHaHa It is a small jetty away from the commercial harbor. that is probably THE nastiest beach on the island 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldtimer Posted February 10, 2018 Share Posted February 10, 2018 7 minutes ago, T2K said: I was referring to L.A. Then you are closer to hell. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vasubandu Posted February 10, 2018 Share Posted February 10, 2018 21 minutes ago, dirtmudd said: authentic Italian made with bechamel sauce... OK let's get this straight. There is no such thing as lasagna without bechamel sauce. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vasubandu Posted February 10, 2018 Share Posted February 10, 2018 15 minutes ago, WillyBob said: what are your folks feelings on Spam Musubi? I think that is probably has a place in Hawaii and the South Pacific. I would love to have it available for a plate lunch, but I would never order it. I might buy some, but only to use as a punishment if one of my boys did something terrible. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldtimer Posted February 10, 2018 Share Posted February 10, 2018 5 minutes ago, vasubandu said: OK let's get this straight. There is no such thing as lasagna without bechamel sauce. OK let's get this straight. Bechamel is one of the mother sauces of French cuisine. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WillyBob Posted February 10, 2018 Share Posted February 10, 2018 ... and then there is WillyBob's ... I take a liberal attitude about cooking, some of my stuff is good. Mashed potato and hamburger enchilada style burros in green enchilada sauce. Unlikely combo that works. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldtimer Posted February 10, 2018 Share Posted February 10, 2018 1 minute ago, vasubandu said: I think that is probably has a place in Hawaii and the South Pacific. I would love to have it available for a plate lunch, but I would never order it. I might buy some, but only to use as a punishment if one of my boys did something terrible. It's like boxed macaroni and cheese. Kids grow up with it, and that's as good as you can say about it. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
richieb Posted February 10, 2018 Share Posted February 10, 2018 7 minutes ago, vasubandu said: I think that is probably has a place in Hawaii and the South Pacific. I would love to have it available for a plate lunch, but I would never order it. I might buy some, but only to use as a punishment if one of my boys did something terrible. - a more PC method, different take on washing their mouth out with soap ? 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WillyBob Posted February 10, 2018 Share Posted February 10, 2018 ... and then the Ahi ... I preferred Aku. but, I ate plenty of yellowfin. was privileged to be able to go blue water weekly. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vasubandu Posted February 10, 2018 Share Posted February 10, 2018 4 minutes ago, oldtimer said: OK let's get this straight. Bechamel is one of the mother sauces of French cuisine. Since we are talking lasagna here, you are on thin ice. According to the Italians, bechamel is the mother sauce of French cuisine because they stole it. From a book called The Food of Italy Cesana claims as its own a creation whose origin is disputed. It is a sauce called balsamella, described as a “ salsa bianca di farina rosolata net burro e nel latte” white-sauce flour browned in butter and milk. This is clearly the classic bechamel, usually said to have been invented by the Marquis Louis de Bcchamcil, maitre d’hotel for Louis XIV. “ Not so," says a Cesana brochure, “ this sauce has been made here since rhe Middle Ages, and delighted (Cardinal Allxirnoz when, in the 14th century, it was served him at a farewell banquet.” Cesana has a case. The post of maitre d’hotel for Louis XIV was held not by chefs, but by nobles, who were not likely to know much about cooking. Possibly some obsequious chef in the royal kitchens gave this name to a sauce already known to flatter the Marquis, or bechamel could have been a distortion of balsamella (some French authorities prefer to spell it bechiamella which gets it a shade nearer to the Italian word while conversely Italians also spell it besciamella, obviously in attraction from French ). Some citizens of Cesana arc inconsistent when they maintain that the name balsamella is a salute to Cagliostro, whose real name was Giuseppe Balsamo;Cagliostro was two Louis later than the Marquis de Bechamcil. However, Cagliostro was perhaps more of a culinary expert than the Marquis. When he became involved in the atfair of the diamond necklace, his house wras searched by investigators who were perhaps less interested in turning up evidence which would link him to this scandal than finding the formulas he was supposed to possess for making gold and diamonds. The only formula they found was a recipe for boeuf en danbe. Whatever the origin of bechamel, the ancient Italian balsamella is virtually the sauce we know today; French bechamel as made in Louis XlV’s time was somewhat different. Apparently, there are are four competing theories on the origin of Bechamel sauce The Italian version of who created this sauce is that it was created in the 14th century and was introduced by the Italian chefs of Catherine de Medici (1519-1589), the Italian-born Queen of France. In 1533, as part of an Italian-French dynastic alliance, Catherine was married to Henri, Duke of Orleans (the future King Henri II of France. It is because of the Italian cooks and pastry makers who followed her to France that the French came to know the taste of Italian cooking that they introduced to the French court. Antonin Careme (1784-1833), celebrated chef and author, wrote in 1822: “The cooks of the second half of the 1700’s came to know the taste of Italian cooking that Catherine de’Medici introduced to the French court.” Or, Bechamel Sauce was invented by Duke Philippe De Mornay (1549-1623), Governor of Saumur, and Lord of the Plessis Marly in the 1600s. Bechamel Sauce is a variation of the basic white sauce of Mornay. He is also credited with being the creator of Mornay Sauce, Sauce Chasseur, Sauce Lyonnaise, and Sauce Porto. Marquis Louis de Bechamel (1603–1703), a 17th century financier who held the honorary post of chief steward of King Louis XIV’s (1643-1715) household, is also said to have invented Bechamel Sauce when trying to come up with a new way of serving and eating dried cod. There are no historical records to verify that he was a gourmet, a cook, or the inventor of Bechamel Sauce. The 17th century Duke d’Escars supposedly is credited with stating: “That fellow Bechameil has all the luck! I was serving breast of chicken a la creme more than 20 years before he was born, but I have never had the chance of giving my name to even the most modest sauce.” It is more likely that Chef Francois Pierre de la Varenne (1615-1678) created Bechamel Sauce. He was a court chef during King Louis XIV’s (1643-1715) reign, during the same time that Bechamel was there. He is often cited as being the founder of haute cuisine (which would define classic French cuisine). La Varenne wrote Le Cuisinier Francois (The True French Cook), which included Bechamel Sauce. It is thought that he dedicated it to Bechamel as a compliment. La Varenne recipes used roux made from flour and butter (or other animal fat) instead of using bread as a thickener for sauces. https://whatscookingamerica.net/History/SauceHistory.htm Although Marcell Hazan dies in 2013, I contacted her anyway, and she assured me that the would never put French Bechamel sauce in her lasagna, only Italian. And that settles that. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vasubandu Posted February 10, 2018 Share Posted February 10, 2018 32 minutes ago, oldtimer said: It's like boxed macaroni and cheese. Kids grow up with it, and that's as good as you can say about it. My wife and I met when we were both studying abroad in France, and I have this aching need for some mac and cheese. Not some fancy French dish, but real mac and cheese. And it is not be found anywhere in the country. So I had a friend send me some, and he sent me a great big case of it with 40 or 60 boxes. And this was in 1984/85. We really enjoyed, them, but when the other Americans found out that I have mac and cheese, they wanted some too, and when they found out how much I had, I thought they were going to have me killed. So I sold most of it. I am not necessarily proud of what I charged, but all I could do with the money was buy French wine. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dirtmudd Posted February 10, 2018 Share Posted February 10, 2018 1 hour ago, vasubandu said: OK let's get this straight. There is no such thing as lasagna without bechamel sauce. it's the standard....with the Bolognese lasagna... old style ricotta....and those are the one's I make.... had to look it up in my grandmother's cookbook...the talisman. Italian cook book....from 1951 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CECAA850 Posted February 10, 2018 Share Posted February 10, 2018 1 hour ago, vasubandu said: OK let's get this straight. There is no such thing as lasagna without bechamel sauce. That's funny right there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CECAA850 Posted February 10, 2018 Share Posted February 10, 2018 33 minutes ago, dirtmudd said: it's the standard....with the Bolognese lasagna... old style ricotta....and those are the one's I make.... had to look it up in my grandmother's cookbook...the talisman. Italian cook book....from 1951 I never once saw an Italian cookbook in my grandmother's kitchen. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vasubandu Posted February 10, 2018 Share Posted February 10, 2018 1 minute ago, CECAA850 said: That's funny right there. It would be funny, but do you know how many children go to bed every night after a meal of "lasagna" made with some browned ground beef, Hunt's tomato sauce and ricotta cheese with a few plastic pieces of "no boil" paste dropped onto the top. And they are told that everyone is OK with some Parmesan cheese out of a green cardboard container with a "made on" date too faint to be read except the first two digits, which are 19. Those poor tykes will leave home without ever tasting a bechamel sauce let alone a real lasagna. And we wonder why this country is going to hell, or is that to Texas or Alabama? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vasubandu Posted February 10, 2018 Share Posted February 10, 2018 And did anyone notice that I solved my subwoofer mystery? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CECAA850 Posted February 10, 2018 Share Posted February 10, 2018 3 minutes ago, vasubandu said: It would be funny, but do you know how many children go to bed every night after a meal of "lasagna" made with some browned ground beef, Hunt's tomato sauce and ricotta cheese with a few plastic pieces of "no boil" paste dropped onto the top. And they are told that everyone is OK with some Parmesan cheese out of a green cardboard container with a "made on" date too faint to be read except the first two digits, which are 19. Those poor tykes will leave home without ever tasting a bechamel sauce let alone a real lasagna. And we wonder why this country is going to hell, or is that to Texas or Alabama? No, how many? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CECAA850 Posted February 10, 2018 Share Posted February 10, 2018 I'll bet you could teach a coonass how to boil crawfish too lol. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
richieb Posted February 10, 2018 Share Posted February 10, 2018 10 minutes ago, vasubandu said: It would be funny, but do you know how many children go to bed every night after a meal of "lasagna" made with some browned ground beef, Hunt's tomato sauce and ricotta cheese with a few plastic pieces of "no boil" paste dropped onto the top. And they are told that everyone is OK with some Parmesan cheese out of a green cardboard container with a "made on" date too faint to be read except the first two digits, which are 19. Those poor tykes will leave home without ever tasting a bechamel sauce let alone a real lasagna. And we wonder why this country is going to hell, or is that to Texas or Alabama? --- You have flipped off Kansas as you left the state with your Jayhawk law degree and now you're moving your criticism to the south, Texas and Alabama? It's obvious your degree didn't include courses in mediation. So tell us - what states do make your cut? And what lucky state has you as a resident? Curious minds want to know - others probably don't give a shite. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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