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#1 derrickdj1

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Posted 12 April 2014 - 09:04 PM

What a day, I got the VS 18.1 subs. First I had to get the monsters in the house and down stairs. These things are 40 X 22 X 22 inches and with the boxes, a little larger. Luckily, I made some subwoofer risers with wheels to make the task easier. And, it was still a big job. I now have 4 subs in the HT. I kown I am mixing 2 sealed sub with 2 vented sub, lol. The vented subs were on closeout and they are no longer making the sealed SS 18.2's. Next was running new wire and making all the tricky Neutrik connection and amp settings. This part is eay to messup using a pro amp.

I wondered if I would realize a large benefit going from two to four subs. The answer is a huge YES!. The headroom allows for increased dynamic response and range. They took a lot of work to get them to play well together but, I think I did it! The DSP on the Behringer amps went a long way in the integration process. All four subs are at a different distance(room constrints) so getting the phasing a timing correct was a monster.

I have demoed a few movie clips and did some extensive music listening. The bass is so tight and articulate using four subs. Movie dynamic and the low end is off the hook even in my concrete bunker, lol. The ears need rest as well as the back. I only took a few pic's and most of them look terrible so, I only have two, lol. I guess you don't do anythig right when you are tired. :(

PS I painted the bottom of the sub risers black.


Edited by derrickdj1, 12 April 2014 - 09:15 PM.

Entertainment Room/HT  7.2 system:: Klipsch RF 7 , RC 64, RS 35 Surrounds and FH

Subwoofers: Dayton Ultimax 18-22 DVC  Sealed Dual  Cab(3) and Large Vented Cab(2)

Aura Pro Bass Shakers (8)

Behringer I Nuke 3000 DSP(3)

Behringer I Nuke 6000 DSP(3)

 

Pioneer SC 35

Acurus by Mondial 200 Five amplifier

Rocketfish power consoles

Samsung BDP  F 7500

Asus/My Book Live HPC

 

Family Room: Sony STR HD 510, Samsung BDP C 5500, Klipsch I con VF 35, Klipsch subwoofer

 

Two Channel System: Yaquin VK 2100 amp, Samsung BFP F 7500, Klipsch Forte I w Crites XO3


#2 derrickdj1

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Posted 12 April 2014 - 09:17 PM

Oh, I need to put all the risers on wheels since these things are 120-140 lb. and only a few inches shorter than the RF 7's.


Entertainment Room/HT  7.2 system:: Klipsch RF 7 , RC 64, RS 35 Surrounds and FH

Subwoofers: Dayton Ultimax 18-22 DVC  Sealed Dual  Cab(3) and Large Vented Cab(2)

Aura Pro Bass Shakers (8)

Behringer I Nuke 3000 DSP(3)

Behringer I Nuke 6000 DSP(3)

 

Pioneer SC 35

Acurus by Mondial 200 Five amplifier

Rocketfish power consoles

Samsung BDP  F 7500

Asus/My Book Live HPC

 

Family Room: Sony STR HD 510, Samsung BDP C 5500, Klipsch I con VF 35, Klipsch subwoofer

 

Two Channel System: Yaquin VK 2100 amp, Samsung BFP F 7500, Klipsch Forte I w Crites XO3


#3 Ceptorman

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Posted 12 April 2014 - 09:31 PM

HOLY HECK!!! Those look larger than your tv in that pic. Congrats man, I can feel them from here!!!



#4 derrickdj1

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Posted 12 April 2014 - 09:40 PM

The TV is 51 or 52 in. and yes these are huge subs, lol. Thanks!


Entertainment Room/HT  7.2 system:: Klipsch RF 7 , RC 64, RS 35 Surrounds and FH

Subwoofers: Dayton Ultimax 18-22 DVC  Sealed Dual  Cab(3) and Large Vented Cab(2)

Aura Pro Bass Shakers (8)

Behringer I Nuke 3000 DSP(3)

Behringer I Nuke 6000 DSP(3)

 

Pioneer SC 35

Acurus by Mondial 200 Five amplifier

Rocketfish power consoles

Samsung BDP  F 7500

Asus/My Book Live HPC

 

Family Room: Sony STR HD 510, Samsung BDP C 5500, Klipsch I con VF 35, Klipsch subwoofer

 

Two Channel System: Yaquin VK 2100 amp, Samsung BFP F 7500, Klipsch Forte I w Crites XO3


#5 Scrappydue

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Posted 12 April 2014 - 10:33 PM

some of us are getting crazy with the 18's.


Home Theater : Denon 4520, Klipsch Pro Cinema HT consisting of 3 KPT-904's and 4 KPT-100's. 4 DIY 18" Stereo Integrity in Sealed Boxes, Behringer iNuke 6000 DSP Panasonic AE-8000, Elite 138" 2.35 4K screen.

 

Living Room: Pioneer 50" KURO, Onkyo TX-SR 805, Palladium P-37F, P-27C, P-27S all in Merlot, SVS PC-12 Plus Sony bdp-5100, Apple TV

 

Computer: Emotiva Mini-X, TBD, Martin Logan Dynamo 300

 

In storage: 1985 Cornwalls in walnut

 

My Sub Build Thread:  http://community.kli...-integrity-18s/

 

Home Theater Build Thread: https://community.kl...-build-project/

 

 


#6 derrickdj1

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Posted 12 April 2014 - 11:45 PM

Yeah, yeah, lol. It is amazing the biggest change is in bass clarity. I think with the subs spread around the room, I am not hearing the room as much and more of the source. One thing for sure, most of the rules for setting up one or two sub have to be thrown out for setting up four. These things have a hyper phase response with the mains. This makes getting the phase tamed harder. Setting up the vented and sealed was non-intuitive but, they definetly sound great together and, the bass is seamless..


Edited by derrickdj1, 13 April 2014 - 07:51 AM.

Entertainment Room/HT  7.2 system:: Klipsch RF 7 , RC 64, RS 35 Surrounds and FH

Subwoofers: Dayton Ultimax 18-22 DVC  Sealed Dual  Cab(3) and Large Vented Cab(2)

Aura Pro Bass Shakers (8)

Behringer I Nuke 3000 DSP(3)

Behringer I Nuke 6000 DSP(3)

 

Pioneer SC 35

Acurus by Mondial 200 Five amplifier

Rocketfish power consoles

Samsung BDP  F 7500

Asus/My Book Live HPC

 

Family Room: Sony STR HD 510, Samsung BDP C 5500, Klipsch I con VF 35, Klipsch subwoofer

 

Two Channel System: Yaquin VK 2100 amp, Samsung BFP F 7500, Klipsch Forte I w Crites XO3


#7 CECAA850

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Posted 13 April 2014 - 02:48 PM

VERY nice. Where in the room are they all located?


A Harmony One remote runs a............. Pioneer Elite KURO 150FD display. Anthem D2 pre-pro. 4 QSC PLX 1104 amps. Oppo BDP-80 Blu-ray player. Toshiba XA2 HDDVD player. IB sub with 4 Ascendant Audio 18" drivers powered by a Behringer EP-2500. 2 Klipsch Dean G'd RF-7's, 1 Dean G'd RC-7, 2 RS-7's and 2 RB-35's, all protected by a Furman Elite 20-PFi

Bedroom 1, Lascalas w/ ALK networks and Crites tweeters, Juicy Music modded Crown D-45, Njoe Tjoeb CD player and an Anthem TLP-1. Tuba 18 sub powered by a Behringer A-500.

Bedroom 2, Heresy II's with III upgrade, Carver TFM-15, Carver CT-6 and a Sony CDP C235.

Bedroom 3, under construction.

#8 derrickdj1

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Posted 13 April 2014 - 10:57 PM

They are in as close as I can get in a sqare pattern. Only one is truly corner loaded and another close to a corner. The fun part was setting them up and integrating them. At first, I got a lot less low end with 4 subwoofer than I had with just two. Once I got them integrated you could see the spl in the low end take a sharp rise. The sub, VS 18.1, next to the main dose not use a xo. I am using a xo on the other 3 subs in addition to the avr bass management. On one sub I am using a 48 db Butter worth slope with a hpf, VS 18.1, this is the one around 17 ft from the LP. This keep the subs from being able to be located since 2 of them are not near speakers and one is fairly close to the seating area.

For right now I am using a HPF for the vented subs at 20Hz. Once I get the port plugs, I will experiment with them in the 16 Hz tune mode. I like sitting on the left or right side of the room feeling a cool breeze after every action scence blow by. A pair of VS 18.1 can produce around 117 db and 20 Hz and 129 db at 80 Hz.

I have increased the bass boost to 10 db on the sealed subs with the additional headroom. The vented subs don't need a boost on the low end. MCACC does not boost the subs so, I am safe. This give usable 5 Hz output. Things start to move in the room on a sine wave sweep from 0-100 Hz. I never brought into you only should use identical subs. The sealed and vented just have to be similar in output and spl to work.


Edited by derrickdj1, 13 April 2014 - 11:30 PM.

Entertainment Room/HT  7.2 system:: Klipsch RF 7 , RC 64, RS 35 Surrounds and FH

Subwoofers: Dayton Ultimax 18-22 DVC  Sealed Dual  Cab(3) and Large Vented Cab(2)

Aura Pro Bass Shakers (8)

Behringer I Nuke 3000 DSP(3)

Behringer I Nuke 6000 DSP(3)

 

Pioneer SC 35

Acurus by Mondial 200 Five amplifier

Rocketfish power consoles

Samsung BDP  F 7500

Asus/My Book Live HPC

 

Family Room: Sony STR HD 510, Samsung BDP C 5500, Klipsch I con VF 35, Klipsch subwoofer

 

Two Channel System: Yaquin VK 2100 amp, Samsung BFP F 7500, Klipsch Forte I w Crites XO3


#9 CECAA850

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Posted 14 April 2014 - 08:03 AM

At first, I got a lot less low end with 4 subwoofer than I had with just two

That's more common than you would think.

I never brought into you only should use identical subs. The sealed and vented just have to be similar in output and spl to work.

It makes life a little easier if you do. Different subs roll off differently making constant SPL difficult across their usable frequencies. That's not to say that you can't make dissimilar subs work though. It's just easier when they're all alike.


A Harmony One remote runs a............. Pioneer Elite KURO 150FD display. Anthem D2 pre-pro. 4 QSC PLX 1104 amps. Oppo BDP-80 Blu-ray player. Toshiba XA2 HDDVD player. IB sub with 4 Ascendant Audio 18" drivers powered by a Behringer EP-2500. 2 Klipsch Dean G'd RF-7's, 1 Dean G'd RC-7, 2 RS-7's and 2 RB-35's, all protected by a Furman Elite 20-PFi

Bedroom 1, Lascalas w/ ALK networks and Crites tweeters, Juicy Music modded Crown D-45, Njoe Tjoeb CD player and an Anthem TLP-1. Tuba 18 sub powered by a Behringer A-500.

Bedroom 2, Heresy II's with III upgrade, Carver TFM-15, Carver CT-6 and a Sony CDP C235.

Bedroom 3, under construction.

#10 derrickdj1

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Posted 14 April 2014 - 08:55 AM

It makes life a little easier if you do. Different subs roll off differently making constant SPL difficult across their usable frequencies. That's not to say that you can't make dissimilar subs work though. It's just easier when they're all alike.

It does make getting the vented and seal to work well under the vented subs tunning a little harder. I Just could not pass on the closeout price Luckily I have enough DSP and backgroud to do a reasonably good job. It was much easier to do with smaller subs in the past. I think I will rename the subs to the 4 bunker busters, lol.


Edited by derrickdj1, 14 April 2014 - 10:51 AM.

Entertainment Room/HT  7.2 system:: Klipsch RF 7 , RC 64, RS 35 Surrounds and FH

Subwoofers: Dayton Ultimax 18-22 DVC  Sealed Dual  Cab(3) and Large Vented Cab(2)

Aura Pro Bass Shakers (8)

Behringer I Nuke 3000 DSP(3)

Behringer I Nuke 6000 DSP(3)

 

Pioneer SC 35

Acurus by Mondial 200 Five amplifier

Rocketfish power consoles

Samsung BDP  F 7500

Asus/My Book Live HPC

 

Family Room: Sony STR HD 510, Samsung BDP C 5500, Klipsch I con VF 35, Klipsch subwoofer

 

Two Channel System: Yaquin VK 2100 amp, Samsung BFP F 7500, Klipsch Forte I w Crites XO3


#11 Cinema_head

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Posted 14 April 2014 - 07:28 PM

Congrats on the new toy


PRO CINEMA HOME THEATER ROOM                                                  HERITAGE HOME THEATER                                                  

   KPT-904 X3 FRONT THREE                                               Cornwall 1981 FRONTS

   KPT-1201-T2 SIDE SPEAKERS                                         Heresy  1973 SIDE/REAR

   HERESY 2 REAR SPEAKERS                                            EMO UMC-1 PRE AMP

   SVS PB13-ULTRA BACK SUB                                           Sherbourn 4z-75 & Adcom5300 power amp 

   SVS PB12-PLUS X2 FRONT SUBS                                   Sharp 70" 732 TV 

   SC-55 Elite AVR                                                                 SVS SB-2000 SUB

   B&K 200.7 S2 POWER AMP

   JVC RS-45 (with Darbee) PROJECTOR

   Seymour center stage "125 2.35 AT SCREEN

   OPPO BDP-103 BLU RAY PLAYER 

 

 

 

 

 

 


#12 derrickdj1

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Posted 15 April 2014 - 06:47 AM

Thanks reference_head. I think I am finished with subwoofers for a long while. The wife thinks the room looks nice with 4 subs and not over crowed. I have changed a lot of gear since being on the forum but, not the Pioneer Elte SC 35. Man, that is one great avr to build a system around. I have always liked the standing wave function with subwoofers. It gives a very even sound to the bass in the room if you use the 3 point measurement.


Edited by derrickdj1, 15 April 2014 - 06:56 AM.

Entertainment Room/HT  7.2 system:: Klipsch RF 7 , RC 64, RS 35 Surrounds and FH

Subwoofers: Dayton Ultimax 18-22 DVC  Sealed Dual  Cab(3) and Large Vented Cab(2)

Aura Pro Bass Shakers (8)

Behringer I Nuke 3000 DSP(3)

Behringer I Nuke 6000 DSP(3)

 

Pioneer SC 35

Acurus by Mondial 200 Five amplifier

Rocketfish power consoles

Samsung BDP  F 7500

Asus/My Book Live HPC

 

Family Room: Sony STR HD 510, Samsung BDP C 5500, Klipsch I con VF 35, Klipsch subwoofer

 

Two Channel System: Yaquin VK 2100 amp, Samsung BFP F 7500, Klipsch Forte I w Crites XO3


#13 MichaelandKlipsch

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Posted 15 April 2014 - 11:45 AM

What a day, I got the VS 18.1 subs. First I had to get the monsters in the house and down stairs. These things are 40 X 22 X 22 inches and with the boxes, a little larger. Luckily, I made some subwoofer risers with wheels to make the task easier. And, it was still a big job. I now have 4 subs in the HT. I kown I am mixing 2 sealed sub with 2 vented sub, lol. The vented subs were on closeout and they are no longer making the sealed SS 18.2's. Next was running new wire and making all the tricky Neutrik connection and amp settings. This part is eay to messup using a pro amp.

I wondered if I would realize a large benefit going from two to four subs. The answer is a huge YES!. The headroom allows for increased dynamic response and range. They took a lot of work to get them to play well together but, I think I did it! The DSP on the Behringer amps went a long way in the integration process. All four subs are at a different distance(room constrints) so getting the phasing a timing correct was a monster.

I have demoed a few movie clips and did some extensive music listening. The bass is so tight and articulate using four subs. Movie dynamic and the low end is off the hook even in my concrete bunker, lol. The ears need rest as well as the back. I only took a few pic's and most of them look terrible so, I only have two, lol. I guess you don't do anythig right when you are tired. :(

PS I painted the bottom of the sub risers black.

I agree I love what four subs brung though I don't have the subs you have lol look incredibly powerful.
"We do not follow maps to buried treasure and X never, ever marks the spot" ~ Indiana Jones


Please see "My System" for details

#14 MichaelandKlipsch

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Posted 15 April 2014 - 11:46 AM

It took me a while to align the phase with 4 subs but once you do the basis tight powerful and you have no idea where it's coming from;) The vented subs will hit harder but roll off faster, the sealed subs should sound tighter and great below 20hz. If you have them all working together it should create a incredible audio experience. Proud of you mate! I will say with the size of those speakers I think it is time for a bigger tv lol.

Edited by MichaelandKlipsch, 15 April 2014 - 11:50 AM.

"We do not follow maps to buried treasure and X never, ever marks the spot" ~ Indiana Jones


Please see "My System" for details

#15 derrickdj1

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Posted 15 April 2014 - 12:45 PM

The wife was down in the HT a little while ago for the first time to hear the system. She said is this why you need 4 sub :) . She was grinnig watching Tron Legacy. Michael, my problem is I am on concrete in the basement and the room is around 5300 cu ft. The good thing is with the space the room is not crowded. These subs certainly won't win a beauty contest, lol.


Entertainment Room/HT  7.2 system:: Klipsch RF 7 , RC 64, RS 35 Surrounds and FH

Subwoofers: Dayton Ultimax 18-22 DVC  Sealed Dual  Cab(3) and Large Vented Cab(2)

Aura Pro Bass Shakers (8)

Behringer I Nuke 3000 DSP(3)

Behringer I Nuke 6000 DSP(3)

 

Pioneer SC 35

Acurus by Mondial 200 Five amplifier

Rocketfish power consoles

Samsung BDP  F 7500

Asus/My Book Live HPC

 

Family Room: Sony STR HD 510, Samsung BDP C 5500, Klipsch I con VF 35, Klipsch subwoofer

 

Two Channel System: Yaquin VK 2100 amp, Samsung BFP F 7500, Klipsch Forte I w Crites XO3


#16 MichaelandKlipsch

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Posted 15 April 2014 - 01:14 PM

If you are on concrete in your basement I’m sure those risers help big time! I’m where is the second one located? You will have to take some more photos for the gallery when they are all completed. At least with a basement you didn’t have to bring them down to many stairs I couldn’t imagine hauling them up to my theater.
"We do not follow maps to buried treasure and X never, ever marks the spot" ~ Indiana Jones


Please see "My System" for details

#17 Scrappydue

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Posted 15 April 2014 - 01:16 PM

They sure could win a Beauty contest. You seen the ones with the big girls? These could be in a BBW (big beautiful woofers) contest lol

Home Theater : Denon 4520, Klipsch Pro Cinema HT consisting of 3 KPT-904's and 4 KPT-100's. 4 DIY 18" Stereo Integrity in Sealed Boxes, Behringer iNuke 6000 DSP Panasonic AE-8000, Elite 138" 2.35 4K screen.

 

Living Room: Pioneer 50" KURO, Onkyo TX-SR 805, Palladium P-37F, P-27C, P-27S all in Merlot, SVS PC-12 Plus Sony bdp-5100, Apple TV

 

Computer: Emotiva Mini-X, TBD, Martin Logan Dynamo 300

 

In storage: 1985 Cornwalls in walnut

 

My Sub Build Thread:  http://community.kli...-integrity-18s/

 

Home Theater Build Thread: https://community.kl...-build-project/

 

 


#18 MichaelandKlipsch

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Posted 15 April 2014 - 01:25 PM

Fell off my chair laughing
"We do not follow maps to buried treasure and X never, ever marks the spot" ~ Indiana Jones


Please see "My System" for details

#19 derrickdj1

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Posted 16 April 2014 - 10:58 AM

That is a good one Scrapy!


Entertainment Room/HT  7.2 system:: Klipsch RF 7 , RC 64, RS 35 Surrounds and FH

Subwoofers: Dayton Ultimax 18-22 DVC  Sealed Dual  Cab(3) and Large Vented Cab(2)

Aura Pro Bass Shakers (8)

Behringer I Nuke 3000 DSP(3)

Behringer I Nuke 6000 DSP(3)

 

Pioneer SC 35

Acurus by Mondial 200 Five amplifier

Rocketfish power consoles

Samsung BDP  F 7500

Asus/My Book Live HPC

 

Family Room: Sony STR HD 510, Samsung BDP C 5500, Klipsch I con VF 35, Klipsch subwoofer

 

Two Channel System: Yaquin VK 2100 amp, Samsung BFP F 7500, Klipsch Forte I w Crites XO3


#20 derrickdj1

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Posted 17 April 2014 - 03:16 PM

It took me a while to align the phase with 4 subs but once you do the basis tight powerful and you have no idea where it's coming from;) The vented subs will hit harder but roll off faster, the sealed subs should sound tighter and great below 20hz. If you have them all working together it should create a incredible audio experience. Proud of you mate! I will say with the size of those speakers I think it is time for a bigger tv lol.

It is funny all this time that I never considered a bigger TV, lol. I guess because I am usually listening to music. Oh, if I was upstair the pictures most likely would fall off the wall. That has low WAF, lol. I have vent plugs and have been using the sub tuned to 16 Hz. Not a whole lot of difference compared to without the vent plug. I guess if I did a FR graph, the plugs rob the around 15-25 Hz response for a little lower extension. Real world, for HT no difference since I can just turn the sub up or down.


Entertainment Room/HT  7.2 system:: Klipsch RF 7 , RC 64, RS 35 Surrounds and FH

Subwoofers: Dayton Ultimax 18-22 DVC  Sealed Dual  Cab(3) and Large Vented Cab(2)

Aura Pro Bass Shakers (8)

Behringer I Nuke 3000 DSP(3)

Behringer I Nuke 6000 DSP(3)

 

Pioneer SC 35

Acurus by Mondial 200 Five amplifier

Rocketfish power consoles

Samsung BDP  F 7500

Asus/My Book Live HPC

 

Family Room: Sony STR HD 510, Samsung BDP C 5500, Klipsch I con VF 35, Klipsch subwoofer

 

Two Channel System: Yaquin VK 2100 amp, Samsung BFP F 7500, Klipsch Forte I w Crites XO3