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Super Heresy 1 (Baby Cornwalls Mod.)


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1 minute ago, ClaudeJ1 said:

For those who are buying K700 Metal horns on Ebay, for about $40 a pair, I recommend the A-55-G driver from Crites Speakers as a brand new replacement for the old K55V along with his tweeters and autoformers.

Be sure to purchase the "8 hole" version of the K700 horn, not the 4 hole version.  There is a definite quality and weight difference between the two.

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On August 5, 2017 at 8:33 AM, DizRotus said:

Bumping this for easier referral as I convert some "speakers" bought online in a moment of weakness to "Super Heresys."

 

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This project is detailed in another thread.

 

The results look like this.  For now, the networks are still outside the boxes, with connections through the ports, to permit final tweaking.  The components that arrived with the Frankensmurfs were those of KP-201s, except without the woofers or boxes.   After turning a 4 x 8 sheet of Baltic birch ply into the boxes shown, with Claude's assistance, I modified the KP 2.0A networks, including Crites 3636 autoformers, to balance the recommended ported Eminence Delta Pro 12A woofers to the KP-201 squawkers and tweeters.

 

I started with the mids attenuated at -4dB (-6dB lower than the stock setting).  Using the 3636s to go -1dB at a time, they're now set at -7dB.  Next year I'll prevail upon Claude to bring some test gear to "curve" them to the space.  Until then, they sound superb to me.  Thank you Claude.

 

 

image.jpeg

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  • 2 weeks later...
On December 28, 2017 at 10:38 AM, jimjimbo said:

Links to parts needed

If anyone has a source for a lower price on the woofer, please share it here if you can.

 

Parts Express is currently selling the Eminence Delta Pro 12A woofer for $129.99 Each (will require 2)

https://www.parts-express.com/eminence-delta-pro-12a-12-cast-frame-driver--290-510

 

Parts Express has the plastic 4 inch ports for $2.89 Each (will require 2)

https://www.parts-express.com/speaker-cabinet-port-tube-4-id-x-4-l-flared--260-403

 

Amazon has a 6 pack of acoustic egg crate foam for $8.49

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B076JNCQ39/_encoding=UTF8?coliid=IS87SA03DYI68&colid=3KSFOVF15C12W&psc=1

 

Bob Crites has the 3636 autotransformer for $36 Each (plus shipping) (will require 2)

http://www.critesspeakers.com/prices-other_stuff.html

 

So I have acquired my Heresy I speakers and am getting ready to order parts for conversion.

I found Eminence Delta 12A woofers for $80 each. Are they the correct woofers? such a big price difference.

 

@jimjimbo

 

http://www.samash.com/delta-12a-12-speaker-edelta12a?cm_mmc=GoogleShopping-_-Live Sound-_-Channeladvisor-_-Eminence+Delta+12A+12"+Speaker&utm_source=GSH&utm_medium=CSE&utm_campaign=Channeladvisor&CAWELAID=500002510000040279&CAGPSPN=pla&CAAGID=28120526597&CATCI=pla-297143995846&CATARGETID=500002510000092368&cadevice=c&gclid=EAIaIQobChMI0Ny2kKHO2AIViEoNCh1DrAtsEAQYAyABEgK6JvD_BwE  

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1 minute ago, TFR1 said:

The numbers can be confusing.  They have to be Delta Pro 12A

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23 minutes ago, mopardave said:

if those are Delta Pro 12A for $80EA i would get them quick.  A smoking deal.    I just paid $110EA for those.

 

They appear to be Eminence Delta Pro 12As.  For $108 shipped, that's a good deal.

 

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Eminence-Delta-Pro-12A-Professional-Series-speaker-12-inch-8-ohm/183003206101?ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT&_trksid=p2055119.m1438.l2649

 

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i wonder how the Dayton PA310-8 sounds in a Super Heresy ? - its got a fair amount

of moving mass but has low qts & goes to ~4K on-axis plus sims nice in a Heresy sized vented box.  I think with appropriate autoformer tap (if a change is needed) and a solid state amp, it might be pretty good. 

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On 1/11/2018 at 3:41 AM, karlson3 said:

i wonder how the Dayton PA310-8 sounds in a Super Heresy ? - its got a fair amount

of moving mass but has low qts & goes to ~4K on-axis plus sims nice in a Heresy sized vented box.  I think with appropriate autoformer tap (if a change is needed) and a solid state amp, it might be pretty good. 

Then my suggestion would be for to buy a pair of used Heresy's, get a pair of those woofers, buy a pair of new tweeters, modify the mounting slightly for the new tweeter, buy some foam insulation, buy a router, route a hole in the back panel of the Heresy to put in the port. Then you buy a UMIK, download REW, make a donation to them, do multiple measurements of the before and after by only modifying ONE channel of against the original. Measure both woofer's performance, the port's performance, in and out of a corner, buy different part to modify the network, then listen to the results with lots of test recordings with the different iterations. IF and ONLY IF the results are any good, provide more measurements as proof that it worked, in a Room, along with some listening tests on the part of other interested Klipsch people, whereby others agree it sounds better than "vanilla" factory Heresy's.

 

 

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1 hour ago, TFR1 said:

Claude,

Your instructions are very clear. 

After hearing the Super Heresy's that Jimjimbo has, there seems no reason to "reinvent the wheel".

 

Tfr1

 

Thank you for your supportive comment. It's much better coming from you than from me. I would add, that to save money, I thinks I said this before, remember, it's been a few YEARS now.................you can save money by keeping the K77 tweeter and just upgrading the bass/midrange with the K-42 EV or Eminence driver.

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12 hours ago, karlson3 said:

i wonder how the Dayton PA310-8 sounds in a Super Heresy ? - its got a fair amount

of moving mass but has low qts & goes to ~4K on-axis plus sims nice in a Heresy sized vented box.  I think with appropriate autoformer tap (if a change is needed) and a solid state amp, it might be pretty good. 

OK, do aside from my original response to this post, which, upon review, might have sounded a touch "whiney" about how much work was involved when I created Jim Jimbo's famous Super Heresys, curiosity got the best of me. Why? Because those Dayton Woofers are Half the Price of Eminence Woofers and CAN be used in a Super Heresy. So if saving $100 or more on the upgrade then I approve as a WORKABLE alternative with the following cautionary comment.

 

Different is not the same, so when I did a computer model of that woofer vs. the original Super Heresy, the following differences exist. It's a 3"voice coil and not 2 1/2 inches. It is about 2 db less sensitive, so it means, depending on your listening preference, you would probably drop the midrange and tweeter horns an additional 3 db on a Klipsch T2A Autoformer (unless you use the ones from Crites). You would then have to cut your capacitance in half to retain the same crossover points. You would be increasing the impedance at mid and high frequencies with more Amplifier Power going to the woofer, but they can handle more power (according to the specs) than the Eminence. The benefit then would be a bit extra bass extension traded for a bit more midrange rolloff.

 

So for some people who favor 5-10 Hz more bass extension than the original Super Heresys (without a sub), this may be an acceptable way to go while saving a bit of cash in the process.

 

 

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OK, so I woke up this morning and realised that, based on intuition and experience, using the Dayton PA310-8 woofer, not only save you money, but PROBABLY, you can just do a woofer swap with the original K-22, cut a hole in the back, glue in the port, and you PROBABLY won't have to do anything at all to the E network. You will just have better BASS, which is the #1 issue with old Heresy 1's. Talk about "too easy."

 

So thanks to Karlson3 for the discovery. It might become a really good solution for some DIY modders. It's my hope that if any of you do this, you will report here with measurements and listening impressions. Thanks in advance.

 

That being said, the original Heresy is 3 db more efficient and probably the better of the two mods, I guess one gets what they pay for, but this may be better AND good enough of an improvement for the budget conscious.

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21 hours ago, TFR1 said:

Claude,

Your instructions are very clear. 

After hearing the Super Heresy's that Jimjimbo has, there seems no reason to "reinvent the wheel".

 

Tfr1

 

@ClaudeJ1

 

Claude, you should have seen the look of amazement on Jerry's face when I switched in the Super Heresy's at my place a few weeks ago.  Granted, they were playing from an HK730, which certainly doesn't hurt.....

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8 minutes ago, jimjimbo said:

@ClaudeJ1

 

Claude, you should have seen the look of amazement on Jerry's face when I switched in the Super Heresy's at my place a few weeks ago.  Granted, they were playing from an HK730, which certainly doesn't hurt.....

Always good to read this kind of stuff. I have owned many pairs of Heresy's over the years. Now trying to see if adding twin 5" ports on KP-250's will extend the bass a tad more, but I still think the best mod I ever did, YOU OWN.

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