moray james Posted June 20, 2014 Share Posted June 20, 2014 here is a suggestion you might like the sound of. This is a very old idea not mine but I was doing this more than 40 years ago and it has been a very useful tool at times. Get some F-11 Acoustical Felt 1/8" thick and cover the woofer with it. Low bass will slide right through like it was not even there but the acoustical felt will catch and damp the top end response of the woofer where it crosses to the horn. This helps to eliminate multiple physical sources at these frequencies on the woofer at the crossover point where you want your ears to only hear the mid horn. You woofer is very directional at those frequencies with multiple source points which is counter productive as far as good stage and image go. This simple acoustical filter works very well but you need to use the right material and Craft felt which is Acrylic is NOT the right material you need wool felt which had the highest damping coefficient in the desired frequency range of any material available. If you were to use Acrylic you would need so much to damp as effectively you would over damp the bass which is not what you want. Been there done that bought the F-11 and have the desired results now. I do this on my H3, KLF20, Forte ll and other speakers. Hope this is of some interest. Best regards Moray James. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cradeldorf Posted June 21, 2014 Author Share Posted June 21, 2014 Thanks for the Heads up Moray, I'll look into finding some and give it a try. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moray james Posted June 21, 2014 Share Posted June 21, 2014 Thanks for the Heads up Moray, I'll look into finding some and give it a try. F-11 is a excellent damping material ultra wide band absorption, it works wonders in woofers and inside compression drivers also. Best regards Moray James. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cradeldorf Posted July 4, 2014 Author Share Posted July 4, 2014 I promised you guys some music through them so I finally got around to putting something together. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gXi6vsUVpn4&feature=youtu.be Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cradeldorf Posted August 13, 2014 Author Share Posted August 13, 2014 (edited) Deleted Edited April 12, 2015 by cradeldorf Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cradeldorf Posted November 26, 2014 Author Share Posted November 26, 2014 Update: Still haven't touched them, Still loving every minute I get to spend with them. wouldn't trade them for any other speakers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SWL Posted February 9, 2015 Share Posted February 9, 2015 I've been tweaking my butt off lately with my KLF-30's. My hat goes off to you or anyone that has the ambition to try different things with their systems and not rely solely on measurements or what's on paper.....but I think that at least has to be a starting point for sure. Some of the mods you made I find pretty "interesting".....but hey, they're your ears and that's what matters. I suppose the biggest thing I learned with my 30's in my room is not to deaden the cabs in any way. I put mortite on the horns and the spokes of the woofers and it just took away the musicality of the speaker. Also, to basically keep acoustic felt the hell away from them as well. It just kills the sound, and most notably the fidelity. I've found a number of tweaks/upgrades that I thought were essential to making the 30's sound good. To leave them stock would mean moving on to another model for me. Glad to hear you're happy with what you did. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SWL Posted February 10, 2015 Share Posted February 10, 2015 EDIT I forgot that I still have a strip of F-11 (1/8" thick x 1/2" wide) on the top mounting flange of the mid-horn. I gave it a light coat of black spray paint so the grey didn't stick out like a sore thumb. This is the only spot that I could hear an advantage to using the acoustic felt on the front baffle. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cradeldorf Posted February 11, 2015 Author Share Posted February 11, 2015 (edited) Did you try the foam weatherstripping on the inside of the woofer spokes to keep the sound waves from traveling back through the cone? that's where it really made a difference. Glad to hear there is at least one other KLF owner that's trying to get them right. I just can't stop listening to mine. They are pitch perfect to me. BTW, what amp are you driving them with? Edited February 11, 2015 by cradeldorf Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SWL Posted February 11, 2015 Share Posted February 11, 2015 that's where it really made a difference What kind of a difference/improvement do you hear? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SWL Posted February 12, 2015 Share Posted February 12, 2015 http://www.decware.com/paper79.htm I've got plenty of F-11 acoustic felt left over......maybe I'll try this. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cradeldorf Posted February 12, 2015 Author Share Posted February 12, 2015 (edited) The difference went from that annoying shouty sound (which I found almost unlistenable and most klipsch owners complain about) to a nice smooth sound without slicing through you like a laser. I used the peel and stick 1" wide 1/4 thick weatherstripping foam and just put it on the insides of the spokes don't do the whole inside of the basket. Not sure if your felt is gonna give you the same results but since you already have it, It's worth a try as long as it's not impossible to get back off. At first I did the spokes and loved the sound, then took them out and did the whole inside of the basket only to have to tear them back apart and remove the excess. It was too much. I installed it across the spokes so it took 2 strips per spoke, fish it in, stick it down, peel off the white paper. Did you try the reversing of the mid horn wires yet? some said I was crazy but that really made them come alive to me. they went from flat as a 10yo to a soundstage deeper than the marianas trench. be sure to mark the wires before removing them because the mid drivers have vitually no markings on them. just reverse the yelow and black wires . Here is a picture of the stuff I used, got it at Menards by the storm doors. and a picture of it installed on the spokes. I was a Fostex man myself before finding my KLF's. Edited February 12, 2015 by cradeldorf Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SWL Posted February 12, 2015 Share Posted February 12, 2015 Did you try the reversing of the mid horn wires yet? some said I was crazy but that really made them come alive to me. When I first installed the titanium midrange diaphrams a couple of months ago, the sound was not right. The mids had a big sound that had a certain amount of clarity and depth but was overshadowed by the fact that it sounded totally out of whack. Any EQing I did with my digital EQ didn't help at all. I realized that I hooked up the polarity backwards...they were not labeled....hooked them up the right way and everything was cool. I can only assume that in your room with the other mods you did somehow it made this sound acceptable....and maybe it's a room thing. I don't know but I definitely won't be reversing the polarity of the mids in my room. I've heard KLF-30's sound horrible plenty of times but I don't think I'd ever describe them as "shouty". If anything, when the mids were hooked up backwards that IMO sounded "shouty" LOL. When you say "shouty" do you actually mean "shitty"? That I have definitely heard from them before modding. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SWL Posted February 13, 2015 Share Posted February 13, 2015 Put some mortite on the spokes today. Gave the bass a fuller sound but took away detail/clarity from the bass. Removed the mortite from the top woofers but left it intact on the bottom woofers. Sounds very nice. I also lined the bottom chamber of the cab with F-11 acoustic felt....not entirely, maybe 85% (of where there is no foam) so as to not deaden it completely. Now we're getting somewhere.....this sounds very good. Next, I think I'll try the F-11 on the woofer spokes on the top woofer......then if that sounds good I'll do the bottom woofs as well. I also put some F-11 on the magnet of the woofer. I'm finally getting some positive results from the F-11. Tweaking is my life. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cradeldorf Posted February 13, 2015 Author Share Posted February 13, 2015 (edited) Did you remove the port tubes? they just pull out. I put foam in the bottom but it was the factory 1" foam and after i removed the port tubes I slid it right to the bottom of the port tube holes in the back board. it extends about halfway to the front motorboard. Shouty might not be the right term but a sound that basically slices right through you, like fingernails on a chalkboard. It is possible that the first time you hooked up your mids you had them hooked up like the factory did. Mine sounded dead and lifeless wired that way. flat, depthless, and sounded like there was a part of frequency missing from the spectrum right between where the woofers pass off to the mid horns. Or maybe your right that it's the room making it sound right. your sure you didn't have them out of phase? That would be impossible to E.Q. out. that would really give you a horrible sound too, good straight on but the minute you move your head you only hear one speaker over the other. Also I have heard others on here say that they were not impressed with those titanium diaphragms... I haven't heard them myself but i know the factory ones sound just fine to me. And just a fyi, the mid drivers are marked, by one of the terminals there is a mark I think on the magnet that looks like it was made by a yellow highlighter and is virtually impossible to see. but it is there. I think that's the one I have the black wire hooked to. I've heard of people replacing the HF diaphragm with titanium but not the mid range.... How about swapping out those flat jumpers between the terminals for actual copper wire? that also gave me a better sound in my mind. I'm assuming your room is carpeted? if not and you have hardwood or tile I would try blocking off the cavity below the cabinets. sounds really trivial but it was a major improvement from the original sound. glad to hear some of the mods are working out for you eventually you could be very happy. I had to look up mortite, yeah that's not gonna do what you want which is give some dampening to the sound waves coming off the back of the cone striking the spoke and bouncing back to the cone. Your f11 would have be a better choice. Good luck with your mods and enjoy doing them because eventually your gonna hit utopia and the only fun you'll have with them is kicking back and enjoying the sound. oh and impressing your friends. Edited February 13, 2015 by cradeldorf Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cradeldorf Posted February 13, 2015 Author Share Posted February 13, 2015 Shot this vid this morning. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zXcZX_9kX34&feature=youtu.be Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cradeldorf Posted April 12, 2015 Author Share Posted April 12, 2015 I can't believe I'm getting ready to sell these, It was one of my funnest adventures and most rewarding. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wvu80 Posted April 12, 2015 Share Posted April 12, 2015 Why are you selling? And, what are you replacing them with? Usually you don't get rid of one relationship unless you already have a replacement in mind. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cradeldorf Posted April 12, 2015 Author Share Posted April 12, 2015 (edited) Why are you selling? And, what are you replacing them with? Usually you don't get rid of one relationship unless you already have a replacement in mind. I replaced them with RF 82's. Edit: Yeah that didn't work out so now the KLF's have little sisters. Edited June 21, 2015 by cradeldorf Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cradeldorf Posted May 24, 2015 Author Share Posted May 24, 2015 (edited) Okay this is about as good of integration of the two sets of speakers (KLF 30's + RF 82's) I could achieve. Shot this tonight. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b7zaVr_dIvk Edited May 24, 2015 by cradeldorf Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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