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Newbie looking to upgrade crossovers on my Reference RF-3 ii


ninjai18

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Hey guys/gals, looking to upgrade my RF-3 ii crossovers. I want to do something similar to the DeanG mods of the RF-7's. Any advice on what I'd need to buy or do to give a nice boost in sound quality to these? I want to apply the same mod to my to my matching RC-3 ii and RS-3 ii speakers as well.

 

Thanks in advance for any help! :D

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I've been here since 2002, just lost my old account, but thanks for the welcome! I emailed Bob, hope to hear back soon. In the mean time, does anyone know how big of an improvement it will be by doing big upgrades to all the crossovers in my speakers? I was also considering adding more internal bracing and doing the silk tweeter upgrade available on eBay. Any thoughts on this? http://www.ebay.com/itm/370789107592?_trksid=p2055119.m1438.l2649&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT

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Hey guys/gals, looking to upgrade my RF-3 ii crossovers. I want to do something similar to the DeanG mods of the RF-7's. Any advice on what I'd need to buy or do to give a nice boost in sound quality to these?

 

Contact DeanG then. :D

 

http://www.aletheiaaudio.com/

 

Bill

 

 

I contacted DeanG, waiting to hear back. :) Those Alethei upgrades look incredible, but a bit pricey.

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I really like the RF-3 series, make for a very nice theater setup, good luck with your quest for better sound! Interesting that I've never heard of or noticed these silk diaphragm replacements before as I'm on eBay all the time, I wonder how they compare to stock vs titanium etc?

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I would hold off on doing the tweeter mod.  The XO replacement may put you just where you want to be.  Unless there is a problem with the existing bracing, I would hold off on that also.  Sometimes the enemy of good is better.  If it is harness or shrill, the XO or a resistor mod may do the job.  I use the resistor mod which is the cheapest alternative.  It is not so much as what you will hear: it is what you will not hear.

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I would hold off on doing the tweeter mod.  The XO replacement may put you just where you want to be.  Unless there is a problem with the existing bracing, I would hold off on that also.  Sometimes the enemy of good is better.  If it is harness or shrill, the XO or a resistor mod may do the job.  I use the resistor mod which is the cheapest alternative.  It is not so much as what you will hear: it is what you will not hear.

 

Would doing all the mods be helpful? I can't imagine better bracing would hurt.

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The result of extra bracing if not needed will be nil.  You will not hear a difference.  Of course we all suffer the placebo effect, change something and immediately swear it sounds better.  When doing any mods, it is best to do one thing at a time to really be able to tell a difference between the before and after mod.  Doing multiple mods at the same time will confound matters.  You will not be certain that X,Y,Z or some combination resulted in the the perceived change in the sound.

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The result of extra bracing if not needed will be nil.  You will not hear a difference.  Of course we all suffer the placebo effect, change something and immediately swear it sounds better.  When doing any mods, it is best to do one thing at a time to really be able to tell a difference between the before and after mod.  Doing multiple mods at the same time will confound matters.  You will not be certain that X,Y,Z or some combination resulted in the the perceived change in the sound.

 

That makes sense. :) How do I know if I need added bracing?

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P1020359.jpg

 

Here is the RF-3 ii crossover, looks like a pretty small crossover network, I'd love to upgrade it to something much beefier. There's no cross bracing in the bottom half of the cabinets, I imagine it would help adding some...

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  • 6 months later...

I have nothing to add other than I'm watching this thread closely myself, as I have no desires to ditch my RF-3's for anything else right now but would be open to modding them.  I think the RF-3's are under-appreciated and don't seem to get the love they should.

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P1020359.jpg

Here is the RF-3 ii crossover, looks like a pretty small crossover network, I'd love to upgrade it to something much beefier. There's no cross bracing in the bottom half of the cabinets, I imagine it would help adding some...

Have you heard an RF-3II with a modded crossover? Did it sound better to your ears? If not, what do you expect to gain from a modded crossover? Since these speakers (and crossovers) are not very old, it's highly unlikely that they are out of spec from an electrical standpoint.

Regarding the bracing... You said "I imagine it would help adding some"?

Can you actually hear the cabinets vibrating while playing music? If you can't, or if you're just imagining it, then adding bracing probably won't make a difference.

At the end of the day, they're your speakers. And if you want to mod them, more power to you... But "change" for change sake, doesn't mean it will be "better", just different.

It seems like you're to the point of wanting a different speaker/sound. So instead of modding the RF-3II's, maybe spend the money on a new/different speaker. Just my $0.02...

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My approach is to try and keep the cost down around some number that makes sense for the loudspeaker. If you have a set of speakers that are worth around $600.00, do you really want a pair of $700.00 networks in them? Now, you can certainly do that, but it probably makes more sense to upgrade the loudspeaker.

I save the higher level upgrades for the big Heritage loudspeakers since they are more expensive and revealing. Also, since the Klipschorn, LaScala, and Belle Klipsch have networks that are exposed (not in the cabinet), the parts measure as bad or worse than they look. Replacing all of the parts with newer and better parts makes more sense with these guys.

With the PCB based networks, a popular alternative is to replace all of the inexpensive parts with a lot of other inexpensive parts, which doesn't make a lot of sense to me. Replacing a perfectly good coil with another coil of the same type is just paying for something you don't need. A truly better coil won't fit on the board, and if you move it to a different board, you change the modeled behavior of the circuit due to proximity effect. Most schematics state that all of the parts were measured while on the board. In other words, proximity effect, or mutual inductance - was factored in to determine the correct values for the coils. Moving them around to wherever you want probably isn't really ideal. This is more critical with the high pass, which uses more coils. Notice that on the Reference Series of loudspeakers, the coils are right next to each other, and on the double stacked boards, they are also right on top of each other.

There is nothing wrong with the original PCBs unless they are visibly damaged. There is also nothing wrong with the wiring. In fact, it's tin coated annealed copper wire, which is better than what most are replacing it with! In most cases, since the runs are shorter, there is less resistance.

There is nothing wrong with the coils, and replacing perfectly good coils with perfectly good coils is a waste of money.

Replacing grainy sounding resistors with grainy sounding resistors is also a waste of money (but they're so dirt cheap I guess it doesn't really matter).

In all cases, rather it be some Reference loudspeaker model, or any of the older Klipsch models - the only parts that really need attention are the capacitors and resistors. Money should go into the series capacitors in the high pass and the resistor(s). The low pass in the Reference speakers can be left as is, while electrolytics in the others should be replaced with the Bennics from Madisound. The values are high, and replacing a 68uF with a 65uF is perfectly fine (within 5% or pretty close).

I think the Dayton Audio capacitors net better results than some of the more expensive options - they are amazing for the money. I wouldn't use anything but Mills resistors. If you think all resistors sound the same, that's fine, but it has nothing to do with reality.

Replace the two orange/red oval capacitors. I believe they are a 12uF and a 5uF. The resistor values should be clearly marked, replace this with Mills non-inductives. All of these parts are available from www.partsexpress.com.

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