Don Richard Posted October 2, 2014 Share Posted October 2, 2014 Funny thing is that those vinyl records will still have music on them 100 years from now while every other format mentioned for storage will be long gone. Sounds like Amish Audio to me. Soooo, how's your horse and buggy doing? (apologies to the Amish). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shakeydeal Posted October 2, 2014 Share Posted October 2, 2014 Funny thing is that those vinyl records will still have music on them 100 years from now while every other format mentioned for storage will be long gone. Sounds like Amish Audio to me. Soooo, how's your horse and buggy doing? (apologies to the Amish). I think my digital front end sounds good. But my vinyl rig is truly superior to it. Why don't you tell us what turntable, phono stage, cart, setup you heard that sounded inferior to digital. I can't wait to hear that.......... Shakey Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris A Posted October 2, 2014 Share Posted October 2, 2014 If you want to believe that what you're hearing on vinyl "sounds better", then I don't believe that many here will be successful in altering your perception of reality. For me, my ears told me the difference--a long, long time ago, i.e., the first time I heard CDs in 1984. Just like vinyl, I've heard a few badly done CDs (which I could list here...), but 98% of what I've heard sounds much better than their vinyl counterparts. http://www.npr.org/2012/02/10/146697658/why-vinyl-sounds-better-than-cd-or-not What you are listening to that "sounds better" on vinyl is noise and special types of distortion over what actually existed on the mastering engineer's computer before pressing the vinyl. The more money you put into turntables, arms, cartridge, and needles, the more you're chasing an elusive something that just doesn't exist. I really recommend putting your money into better loudspeakers than you currently own (whatever that happens to be). Doing that will make the sound better and more realistic. YMMV. http://productionadvice.co.uk/no-stair-steps-in-digital-audio/ Chris 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shakeydeal Posted October 2, 2014 Share Posted October 2, 2014 Yeah, I hear that all the time. Distortions from vinyl, distortions from tubes. It's all an illusion... blah, blah, blah.... I get it. If you think early 80s digital sounded better than vinyl, we probably have no conversation left to be had. Sure, newer digital is pretty darn good, and I am no digiphobe. I like it too. Finally, why would you ever pretend to rag on someone's speakers if you supposedly don't even know what they own? That is 3rd grade behaviour there. FWIW, my speakers are mentioned in my signature. You should investigate what they are, you might be surprised. Shakey Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris A Posted October 2, 2014 Share Posted October 2, 2014 (edited) I took the time to assemble the information for those that want to know more - and if you look closely, the people in these linked articles and video have something to say, dispassionately. I'd add that paying attention to the exact issue of recorded disc by using the DR Database is important if you want to get the least compressed music that is available for your listening pleasure on your loudspeaker array. Chris Edited October 2, 2014 by Chris A Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tromprof Posted October 2, 2014 Share Posted October 2, 2014 Analog hit the evolutionary brick wall, while digital is evolving and getting better. I am always amazed how good a well produced record can sound, but the limitations are there and can't be gotten around. There is a clarity on good digital recordings that no turntable will ever be able to produce. There is a lot of blasting of digital formats, but are MP3 files really inferior to 8 track tape? Both formats have their garbage versions. The standard for great digital sound is now 24/96 and 24/196. There are sounds present in those recording that will not come across on a record. I have no plans to sell my turntable and part with my records, and I am very willing to pick up used records. But to expect a new record to equal or best a digital version of the same recording in wishful and romantic thinking. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shakeydeal Posted October 2, 2014 Share Posted October 2, 2014 You are right. Digital is evolving and getting better all the time. Usually the limiting factor in sedees these days is the quality of the recording itself. If more time and care were taken in the process, there would be many more high quality digital recordings to chose from. Alas, the masses don't care, so recording engineers usually don't either. It is rare that I meet someone who is seriously into reproduced sound that touted early digital as being superior to analog. For the most part it was people that were buying rack systems from circuit city, or some such crap. People who really listened knew better. Shakey Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Don Richard Posted October 2, 2014 Share Posted October 2, 2014 Why don't you tell us what turntable, phono stage, cart, setup you heard that sounded inferior to digital. I can't wait to hear that.......... All of them. Empire TT, modified AR TT, Technics TT, Mitsubishi TT, Dynavector MC, Ortofon MM, B&O MM, Shure V15 Types III, IV, V. Mac C28, Yamaha C80. Equipment really doesn't matter, it's problems with the vinyl format. I have never heard any vinyl setup as clean and noise free as my digital gear. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shakeydeal Posted October 2, 2014 Share Posted October 2, 2014 Why don't you tell us what turntable, phono stage, cart, setup you heard that sounded inferior to digital. I can't wait to hear that.......... All of them. Empire TT, modified AR TT, Technics TT, Mitsubishi TT, Dynavector MC, Ortofon MM, B&O MM, Shure V15 Types III, IV, V. Mac C28, Yamaha C80. Equipment really doesn't matter, it's problems with the vinyl format. I have never heard any vinyl setup as clean and noise free as my digital gear. Thanks for claifying. That explains a lot..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
muel Posted October 2, 2014 Share Posted October 2, 2014 I think the bottom line for most of us, certainly me anyway, is that we want what we hear to "Sound Good" to us! I was addressing earlier the subject questioning the death of analog which implies a life span. Not just the life span in regards to how many people use a given format but life span concerning how long any given music is even available. More often than I'd like, I run into the issue of not being able to find an album in a digital format. I could try to find the record but that is not always easy. If it is never copied to new formats on new media it might eventually be lost... or at the least unavailable to most. Anyway, I feel bad for anyone who hasn't had the opportunity to hear an excellent recording on a good vinyl setup where they were totally immersed and mesmerized by great music. I've had this experience with digital as well. Isn't your enjoyment of the music what matters? 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shakeydeal Posted October 2, 2014 Share Posted October 2, 2014 Anyway, I feel bad for anyone who hasn't had the opportunity to hear an excellent recording on a good vinyl setup where they were totally immersed and mesmerized by great music. Hear, hear! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joshnich Posted October 2, 2014 Share Posted October 2, 2014 I go back to the question...Why do they sell digital as sounding analog and not the other way around? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
muel Posted October 2, 2014 Share Posted October 2, 2014 Good point! I'd say because digital sounded quite lousy in some ways for a long time (in some ways it did sound better). Great digital is not cheap though! Pushing past that last 2% or so costs a lot but is also where, it seems, a lot of the krap exists that drives the vinyl guys crazy. In the end, I don't give a shit where it came from if it has the desired effect! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kaiser SET say Posted October 2, 2014 Share Posted October 2, 2014 I go back to the question...Why do they sell digital as sounding analog and not the other way around? Oh you mean that warm sound with air around it and a little ambience instead of having a dead quite digtal copy knock you out of your seat because it has all that ambience taken away (along with a boatload of other musical information)? Some of us just prefer analog sound to digital because we realize digital is not true to how we hear which is in analog. I've always felt if digital was going to compress and cut information out that maybe they should put some pink noise back in to recover the ambience we have lost to the bits & bytes world:-( The only positive to digital for me is and always has been ease of use and nothing else, to the OP analog is not dead and a long shot from it because people have ears IMHO it is better to have any/all the sounds than be missing any! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shakeydeal Posted October 2, 2014 Share Posted October 2, 2014 Some of us just prefer analog sound to digital because we realize digital is not true to how we hear which is in analog. It helps to have a great turntable, such as yours, no? Shakey Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris A Posted October 2, 2014 Share Posted October 2, 2014 (edited) You guys have certainly helped me to form an opinion. Thanks... Edited October 2, 2014 by Chris A Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joshnich Posted October 2, 2014 Share Posted October 2, 2014 You guys have certainly helped me to form an opinion. Thanks... As the marketing guru Jack Trout once famously said " If your assigment is to change peoples minds, don't accept the assignment" 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
japosey Posted October 2, 2014 Share Posted October 2, 2014 Digital really is the superior format, especially if you look at the measurements. However, analog does have a realistic warmth. The problem I have with the digital format is not the format at all. It is the recording engineers who have compressed the the dynamic range of the digital recordings to the point they are no longer wider than analog. They increase the the levels across all frequencies to the point where they begin to distort. I just can't stand to listen to any newly issued popular music on a decent quality stereo at any real volume because of the poor sound quality. With that being said, there are countless benefits of the digital format. Convenience, portability, potential for superior sound quality, etc. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kaiser SET say Posted October 2, 2014 Share Posted October 2, 2014 That is a funny one Josh, Chris it's OK if we disagree on which format we prefer as long as we keep listening and enjoying Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shakeydeal Posted October 2, 2014 Share Posted October 2, 2014 Digital really is the superior format, especially if you look at the measurements Personally, I don't listen to measurements. I used to, but decided listening to music was much more enjoyable...... Shakey Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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