Help with Sub Setup

[01svtL]

OK, so I have a Marantz sr6004.  For now, I have a 3.1 setup with RF5's as mains, RC7 center and an Onix UFW-10 subwoofer.  

 

I just got around to setting everything up with this receiver, as I bought it used.  I have never used a subwoofer before, as I've never had a large enough living room to need one.  The way it is set up now, it sounds great watching Godzilla on HBO; plenty of bass.

 

My problem comes in when I use the AUX port in the front (automatically switches to 2.1) to play music through my iPhone 6.  It seems like the sub only wants to play the kick drums.  It doesn't play the low end of the bass guitar, or the bass drops that are often common in metal music.  I'm sure it is something to do with my setup.  My bedroom setup is a Yamaha receiver with a pair of Paradigm 9se MK1's (no sub), and when the drawn out bass guitar strums or bass drops hit, they will rattle things off the walls.  I know this sub and the RF5's should be able to do that to a greater extent, but I have no idea how to set it up.  I would even say the bass guitars sound flat and borderline non-existent, while bass guitars should be very prevalent in metal music.  Can someone walk me through it?  Attached is a pic of the back of my sub for reference on the controls.

 

 

[RockOn4Klipsch]

it looks like the crossover on the sub is cut at like 45HZ which is pretty low if you want "more" bass, turn it to th 12 oclock position or great if you desire. The other thing to check is where the crossover setting in the receiver is set. Last but not least would be to check the "size" setting in the receiver as well, you can choose either small, or large some offer a "summed" type setting.

 

I'm not familiar with your sub so I will give you the standard setting many will suggest to start with and you can play from there.

 

Set the crossover on the sub to "Max" (looks like 150Hz), In the receivers settings Locate the item for setting the size of the speakers to and set them to "Small" and next choose the crossover setting in the receiver to 80Hz.

[Scrappydue]

Just flip that crossover switch to out (LFE mofe) and when you calibrate everything with audyssey check and make sure mains are in small and crossed around 80 as said above. And also volume looks very high on sub. When you calibrate what does it set each individual channel at?

[01svtL]

Thanks for the help. Setting to small and crossing at 80 definitely helped. There still seems to be some midrange missing, and the sub seems to almost be slightly behind where it should be. As in the bass hits just barely after you hear a bass drum hit in the mains or something like a footstep in King Kong. I will try setting it up with Audyssey again. It tried to say the sub was 28 feet away the first time, yet it is closer to the mic than my mains are, and it put them at 15 feet.

[Scrappydue]

You can play with the distance setting manually.

[babadono]

Turn the the "EQ Controls" to 0dB (Level) and 1.0(Bandwidth) to get a baseline. You can then play with them later. With 0db set on the level the freq should have no effect.

[derrickdj1]

Let Auddysee set the sub distance since it is doing things in the time domain and maybe only slightly tweak it later. 

[01svtL]

Ok, here's how the dials are set now, before I run Audyssey again. Thoughts?

[01svtL]

Ran it again. Distances came out much different this time. However, with the dials shown above, Audyssey put my sub level at -7db, which was barely audible at all. I bumped it up to -3 and it sounds much better. Not wall shaking, but sounds better. I may bump it up another db or two, we'll see. As you can see in the pic, its already at 0 on the sub. Also, audyssey doesnt say what it is crossing at. So I dont know if it is crossing at 80hz or what. It just says "auto." Should I leave it there, or manually change it to 80?

Also, it set speaker size to "auto." Again, this is a 3.1, so it knows i don't have surrounds or anything.

Edited April 8, 2015 by 01svtL

[babadono]

Turn the the "EQ Controls" to 0dB (Level) and 1.0(Bandwidth) to get a baseline. You can then play with them later. With 0db set on the level the freq should have no effect.

[Scrappydue]

Ran it again. Distances came out much different this time. However, with the dials shown above, Audyssey put my sub level at -7db, which was barely audible at all. I bumped it up to -3 and it sounds much better. Not wall shaking, but sounds better. I may bump it up another db or two, we'll see. As you can see in the pic, its already at 0 on the sub. Also, audyssey doesnt say what it is crossing at. So I dont know if it is crossing at 80hz or what. It just says "auto." Should I leave it there, or manually change it to 80?

Also, it set speaker size to "auto." Again, this is a 3.1, so it knows i don't have surrounds or anything.

after you run audyssey, go into manual setup and then you can pick small and set crossovers to 80 hz. with the sub i like to turn mine up 6db total and that is about right since you don't have dynamic eq on that model. make you only EVER adjust the sub via the level settings in the menu. if you adjust on the sub itself you need to re run audyssey. 

 

EDIT: i take that back after reading your manual further you do have audyssey dynamic eq. try turning that on and see if you still need the sub hot. i bet you won't. if i have that on i leave my sub right where audyssey sets them for movies. and i only turn them up for music. 

Edited April 8, 2015 by Scrappydue

[01svtL]

Turn the the "EQ Controls" to 0dB (Level) and 1.0(Bandwidth) to get a baseline. You can then play with them later. With 0db set on the level the freq should have no effect.

Ah, missed the bandwidth adjustment. I'll have to rerun it after i set it to 1.0 huh? What does bandwidth do? I dont feel I know enough to know that I'd need to adjust that after the "baseline" setup, if it did indeed need to be adjusted.

Also, I went back in to manual and my fronts were set to large while the center was set to small. Wonder why Audyssey did this? What does having them set to large with a sub do?

Scrappy- it looks like dynamic eq was already turned on.

[derrickdj1]

On the EQ of the amp set the Frequency to 20 Hz and not 60 Hz.  Most sub will need help in the lower frequencies.  The Q or bandwidth, try 0.7 and not 0.1.  The 0.1 will cover and huge portion of the frequencies.  Most sub will roll off between 30-40 Hz.  The 0.7 is still pretty board.  The last portion is the gain.  Start and 0 and it can be increased up to six db.  Any more boost and the sub amp will be under tremendous stress.  Further tuning can be done after a FR graph.  Do all this prior to running Auddysee except leave the gain at 0 for the Auddysee run.

[babadono]

The bandwidth control allows you to set the width (the range of frequencies the filter will operate on) of the EQ. I am assuming it is calibrated to 'octaves' but this ain't necessarily so, the numbers on the dial maybe arbitrary. In any case I suggest setting it to 1(its widest setting) to begin with. This is a 'parametric' type EQ. If you want more info google 'parametric EQ'.

Edited April 8, 2015 by babadono

[wvu80]

Regarding the "distance" setup that Audyssey does on the sub:  Audyssey measures not only the sub, but the way the sub interacts with the room.  Don't think about distance that Audyssey is measuring, but time.  It is aligning the time to the mic position and coordinates ALL the speakers.  It also is calibrating to sound that way at reference level, so if you boost the sub at lower levels, it may sound better, but it will likely be hot at reference levels.

 

Parts-Express has a nice video explaining how to set up a sub by ear.

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=imc2zDzuzeo#t=81

Edited April 8, 2015 by wvu80

[garyrc]

 It tried to say the sub was 28 feet away the first time, yet it is closer to the mic than my mains are, and it put them at 15 feet.

 

Many subs incorporate a delay (due to the built in amp, other circuitry, a  limiter to keep you from blowing the sub up ... although it can be done!) which is just like moving them farther away.   Delay = distance.  The 28 foot distance Audyssey set the sub at is probably correct.  My sub is 13.75 feet away, and Audyssey sets it at 28.2 feet, which is probably correct.  It sounds great.

[01svtL]

Ok so I made the recommended adjustments on the sub amp and ran it again. I understand distance is more of a function of delay, but Audyssey actually placed the speakers within 6-8" of how far away they really are from the listening position this time, so I'm not sure what the difference was. Here's the configurations it came up with on speaker size:

Subwoofer: Yes

Front: Large

Center: Small

LPF/HPF: 40hz

Bass Mix: Mix

So should I change the fronts to small and change the lpf/hpf to 80 hz?

What is that Bass Mix function? I think i had it on Both before instead of Mix

[derrickdj1]

It is generally recommended to set the speakers to small and XO at 80 Hz unless using small satellite speakers that may only have a low frequency extension down to 100-150 Hz.  What is the sub trim and how do things sound?

Edited April 8, 2015 by derrickdj1

[01svtL]

Ok I'll make the change.

So if I want to turn the sub up a little, is it best to turn it up on the sub or in the manual setup settings on the receiver? It's set at 0db on the sub amp, and Audyssey put it at -8db during auto setup.

[Scrappydue]

Ok I'll make the change.

So if I want to turn the sub up a little, is it best to turn it up on the sub or in the manual setup settings on the receiver? It's set at 0db on the sub amp, and Audyssey put it at -8db during auto setup.

turn the level up in the avr menu.