Tim_in_Norfolk Posted April 21, 2015 Share Posted April 21, 2015 (edited) Hello everyone, I like listening to my Heresy loudspeakers off the floor and I'm considering buying some loudspeaker stands but I wonder if it is worth it. I'd like to hear from anyone who had their speakers on cinder blocks or furniture and now has them on stands. Was there an improvement in the sound quality? Do these speakers work best on low mass open frame type stands or high mass loaded stands, or should I just put them on some cinder blocks and save the money? Any help would be welcome. Regards, Tim Edited April 21, 2015 by Tim_in_Norfolk 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
willland Posted April 21, 2015 Share Posted April 21, 2015 Tim, First, let me welcome you to the forum. I have my Heresys on stands in a 13L x 13W x 10H spare bedroom and the sound quality is incredible. The room is carpeted with drapes and a queen size bed(thick comforter, large fluffy pillows) as my listening "chair". Great imaging with plenty of punch and detail. Now as a contrast, I have my Heresy II's on my dresser in my larger master bedroom. Same sound quality as mentioned above. Bill 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sancho Panza Posted April 21, 2015 Share Posted April 21, 2015 I have all 5 of mine on tables; puts them at ear Level for ht use... 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators dtel's wife Posted April 21, 2015 Moderators Share Posted April 21, 2015 (edited) I would definitely consider stands! Edited April 23, 2015 by dtel's wife 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thaddeus Smith Posted April 21, 2015 Share Posted April 21, 2015 i have mine on ikea lack tables, but I also have them paired with a very capable sub so I'm not too worried about squeezing every ounce of bass out of them. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tim_in_Norfolk Posted April 21, 2015 Author Share Posted April 21, 2015 Bill, Thanks for the welcome. That is an impressive list of audio equipment you have got. I can see why you have the tag, 'Klipsch Fanatic'. I am just hoping to get two systems together! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
willland Posted April 22, 2015 Share Posted April 22, 2015 Bill, Thanks for the welcome. That is an impressive list of audio equipment you have got. I can see why you have the tag, 'Klipsch Fanatic'. I am just hoping to get two systems together! Tim, Thanks for the kind words. Half the fun is the journey. I love this hobby. I started my Klipsch journey seeking an awesome HT experience but some great music, speakers and gear got in the way. Bill 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
finallygotmyheresies Posted April 22, 2015 Share Posted April 22, 2015 This thread may help you https://community.klipsch.com/index.php?/topic/147132-speaker-stands-for-klipsch-heresys/?hl=%2Bskylan+%2Bstand#entry1681316 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
garyrc Posted April 22, 2015 Share Posted April 22, 2015 (edited) On one hand, I think Paul Klipsch, designer of the Heresy I, warned about cavities under speakers, including the Heresy, saying that cavities "degraded the lower octaves." He based that statement on tests he ran, and made it into one of his cardinal rules. With typical speaker stands, you would have one BIG cavity under each Heresy. So, It would probably be better to use your cinder blocks, oriented so there are no holes facing front. Klipsch liked speakers close to walls, or better yet in a corner. He pointed out that moving a speaker from a position out in a room to pushed all the way into a corner was about the equivalent of multiplying your amplifier power by 4 (mostly in the bass, due to the corner increasing the bass). Moderns who put a speaker in a corner often put absorbant materials on the right and left walls, slightly in front of the speaker, to prevent midrange reflections. On the other hand, if you are going to use a subwoofer with them, having them a little out in the room might not hurt, since the sub would be taking over the low bass. I still like solid faced cinder blocks the best. They look good painted black. In my Home Theater, I use Heresy IIs for surrounds, and they crossover to the sub at 80 Hz, and they are on homemade stands. They sound good, but surrounds are not as critically important as front speakers. Edited April 22, 2015 by garyrc 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tim_in_Norfolk Posted April 22, 2015 Author Share Posted April 22, 2015 garyrc, The bass extension is somewhat limited but I do like the 'speed' and quality of the bass off the floor and out of the corners. At a later date I hope to get a subwoofer. A local dealer (London) was recently selling a new P-312W for £1250 (exchange rate is approx. £1 = $1.50) which is an excellent price but my pockets were empty. I think that is going to be one of those purchases I wish I could have made. By the way, congratulations on a fine collection of Klipsch. I just love that horn loaded bass. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tim_in_Norfolk Posted April 22, 2015 Author Share Posted April 22, 2015 Hi Sancho Panza, Thanks for taking the time to respond and 'liking' a post or two. I just had a look at your membership profile and I hope I'm fortunate enough to enjoy my Klipsch into my 90s. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tim_in_Norfolk Posted April 22, 2015 Author Share Posted April 22, 2015 Bill, Thanks for the welcome. That is an impressive list of audio equipment you have got. I can see why you have the tag, 'Klipsch Fanatic'. I am just hoping to get two systems together! Tim, Thanks for the kind words. Half the fun is the journey. I love this hobby. I started my Klipsch journey seeking an awesome HT experience but some great music, speakers and gear got in the way. Bill Bill, I have to agree with you about half the fun being the journey. Last year I made my first ever foray onto ebay and I noticed someone was listing a pair of NIB Heresy IIs so on the basis of that I joined ebay and contacted the seller. The listing was auction only and I was so concerned the price would be bid beyond my price limit. I worried over that listing for four days but as luck would have it nobody placed a bid except me. When I went to pick up the speakers the seller turned out to be a former importer of Klipsch into the UK. He was a great guy and I even got to hear a story or two about how he got involved with Klipsch and his meeting with Paul. I spent a good part of the afternoon there and would have stayed longer had the wife not looked so bored. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris A Posted April 22, 2015 Share Posted April 22, 2015 (edited) The bass extension is somewhat limited but I do like the 'speed' and quality of the bass off the floor and out of the corners. At a later date I hope to get a subwoofer. See point "V" (five) on page 4: https://community.klipsch.com/forums/storage/3/442564/Eight%20Cardinal%20Points%20by%20PWK4.pdf Clearly, there are a few people that really don't care for bass performance (or that don't correct for in-room bass peaks using EQ below the room's Schroeder frequency). A loudspeaker's bass performance is the most valued discriminator between loudspeaker types in Floyd Toole's studies, and is mentioned in his book. If you run a REW sweep of a loudspeaker on thin stands or stands with legs, you'll see the bass FR suck-outs vs. placing the loudspeaker on the floor, or on solid stands that are the size of the loudspeaker box (or larger) all the way to the floor. Chris Edited April 22, 2015 by Chris A 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mdross1 Posted April 22, 2015 Share Posted April 22, 2015 As the Fanatic stated half the fun is the journey we have several systems mostly all played through Klipsch speakers. Our Heresey's are presently stored but when used were on stands helped out in the bass with a Sunfire which is also now stored. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tim_in_Norfolk Posted April 22, 2015 Author Share Posted April 22, 2015 The bass extension is somewhat limited but I do like the 'speed' and quality of the bass off the floor and out of the corners. At a later date I hope to get a subwoofer. See point "V" (five) on page 4: https://community.klipsch.com/forums/storage/3/442564/Eight%20Cardinal%20Points%20by%20PWK4.pdf Clearly, there are a few people that really don't care for bass performance (or that don't correct for in-room bass peaks using EQ below the room's Schroeder frequency). A loudspeaker's bass performance is the most valued discriminator between loudspeaker types in Floyd Toole's studies, and is mentioned in his book. If you run a REW sweep of a loudspeaker on thin stands or stands with legs, you'll see the bass FR suck-outs vs. placing the loudspeaker on the floor, or on solid stands that are the size of the loudspeaker box (or larger) all the way to the floor. Chris Chris, Thanks for that link. I'll have a read through the whole article later today. This is the great thing about this forum - so many people with so much information and knowledge. It's like going to school only really enjoyable. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
geoffr Posted April 22, 2015 Share Posted April 22, 2015 Mine are on the hearth in the living room. So far my wife hasn't (too much) complained about the increase in cabinet size over the EPI 100's the Heresys replaced. They sound great. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris A Posted April 22, 2015 Share Posted April 22, 2015 (edited) Welcome Tim! That PWK article is one of the most obscure and controversial ones that he authored. I think that the bottom line that Mr. Klipsch was saying is that "a little attention to detail" is a big deal when integrating loudspeakers into rooms. Clearly, getting the midrange/tweeter up at ear level while sitting is also a big deal. What PWK was saying is "do it right if you are raising the loudspeakers off the floor", and why he advocated and provided slant risers for Heresies to be placed on the floor for most people, since in those days, people didn't have spectrum analyzers that were less than $100(US), i.e., the price of a calibration microphone and driving electronics. The software is free nowadays and most people that can afford these loudspeakers also own and use home computers. PWK was much less verbose about correcting for in-room bass FR peaks--something that I've found to be at least as important as getting the loudspeaker midrange/tweeter at ear level. Once you tame the bass FR to remove the peaks, I find that the loudspeaker's bass "speed" and overall bass quality improve significantly. Also coupled into this is having a sufficient level of early reflection acoustic absorption and bass trapping. If you are listening in a room with slap echos, it will degrade the listening experience significantly. Chris Edited April 22, 2015 by Chris A 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sancho Panza Posted April 22, 2015 Share Posted April 22, 2015 Yes, you & me both, LoL. Sancho Panza is not my real name; nor that my real birthday...June 3d is close... ;-) Hi Sancho Panza, Thanks for taking the time to respond and 'liking' a post or two. I just had a look at your membership profile and I hope I'm fortunate enough to enjoy my Klipsch into my 90s. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tim_in_Norfolk Posted April 22, 2015 Author Share Posted April 22, 2015 Welcome Tim! That PWK article is one of the most obscure and controversial ones that he authored. I think that the bottom line that Mr. Klipsch was saying is that "a little attention to detail" is a big deal when integrating loudspeakers into rooms. Clearly, getting the midrange/tweeter up at ear level while sitting is also a big deal. What PWK was saying is "do it right if you are raising the loudspeakers off the floor", and why he advocated and provided slant risers for Heresies to be placed on the floor for most people, since in those days, people didn't have spectrum analyzers that were less than $100(US), i.e., the price of a calibration microphone and driving electronics. The software is free nowadays and most people that can afford these loudspeakers also own and use home computers. PWK was much less verbose about correcting for in-room bass FR peaks--something that I've found to be at least as important as getting the loudspeaker midrange/tweeter at ear level. Once you tame the bass FR to remove the peaks, I find that the loudspeaker's bass "speed" and overall bass quality improve significantly. Also coupled into this is having a sufficient level of early reflection acoustic absorption and bass trapping. If you are listening in a room with slap echos, it will degrade the listening experience significantly. Chris Chris, Thanks for that link to Paul's article. It was an interesting read although I probably did not understand everything. I wonder if that 100 cs uplift mentioned is why many reviewers refer to the improved base response on certain stands. It looks like the way to go initially anyway is to ask the wife to select her choice of fabric to cover the cinder blocks. I might as well see if she wants to hang some heavy fabric on the walls too that should help the sound out too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moray james Posted April 22, 2015 Share Posted April 22, 2015 Hello everyone, I like listening to my Heresy loudspeakers off the floor and I'm considering buying some loudspeaker stands but I wonder if it is worth it. I'd like to hear from anyone who had their speakers on cinder blocks or furniture and now has them on stands. Was there an improvement in the sound quality? Do these speakers work best on low mass open frame type stands or high mass loaded stands, or should I just put them on some cinder blocks and save the money? Any help would be welcome. Regards, Tim I have mine very modified and up on 21 inch high four post Skylan Stands they look and sound excellent. The centre of the mid horn is at my seated ear height. The Skylan stans have mass loadable polymer tubes which can be filled with different materials depending upon your floor. I you have a suspended floor then you want to use less and lighter material like half full with rive. If you have a concrete pad you can fill them with sand. Good stands do make a difference. Best regards Moray James. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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