RottenPilot Posted June 23, 2015 Share Posted June 23, 2015 Hello to everyone! I have been out of the 2 channel stereo game for some time now. I have a multi-channel home theater setup that does a good job as a HT system, unfortunately, the room and equipment does not lend itself well for stereo listening. I have a friend that lives and dies by 2 channel and after finally listening to his system, I can hear why. On Father’s Day, my favorite wife surprised me with a new system for stereo listening. Klipsch RF-7 II Onkyo A-9070 Integrated Amp OPPO BDP 103 CD/DVD Player Pro-Ject Debut Carbon Esprit SB w/Ortofon 2M Blue I am very happy with the clarity and soundstage. What surprised me was the overall lack of bass. I do keep the tone controls bypassed in direct mode and this yields a very smooth sound. While the bass is there, (you can hear it) it is not overly present (feel it) at low to med volume levels. I would describe the bass as taunt, not booming. When I do crank the volume up the bass level does improve in that you can feel it more. Perhaps these speakers are better suited for loud listening levels? By the way, these speakers are really loud when you crank them up! The amount of bass or musical quality also appears to be very source material dependent. Many have commented that Klipsch speakers are often overly bright because of the horn. I do not feel that my RF-7 II’s are overly bright. I listen to classic rock but mostly jazz and blues. I feel that this system reproduces these genres well. Overall, I am happy with the system, it is very pleasant sounding but different in a smooth controlled way. I am considering the addition of a subwoofer to complement the bottom end at lower volume levels. Any opinions or recommendations would be greatly appreciated…. 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Steven1963 Posted June 23, 2015 Share Posted June 23, 2015 (edited) my favorite wife She'd be my favorite wife also after presenting me with those gifts. P.S. I want to move to your country. Edited June 23, 2015 by Steven1963 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sancho Panza Posted June 23, 2015 Share Posted June 23, 2015 Welcome to the Klipsch Forums; congratulations on your new 2 channel system! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Johnthang Posted June 23, 2015 Share Posted June 23, 2015 Welcome, and an awesome fathers day ! Can't go wrong with a subwoofer. Beamed off a reflector on the moon 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quiet_Hollow Posted June 23, 2015 Share Posted June 23, 2015 What surprised me was the overall lack of bass. Compared to your buddy's or your HT? Here's some plain facts about bass frequencies. If you can "feel" the bass, it is because it's plenty loud. If you can "feel" the bass, yet comfortably listen to everything else going in the mix, it's because the system is neither set, nor playing back "flat". Setting a system flat, or striving for "flatness" will not yield the sound experience you desire. A subwoofer with the RF-7II strictly for 2-ch, defeats the purpose of the design. At that point, you'd be better served by a much smaller cabinet, which of course is not an option here. Placement of the speakers in the room and lack of EQ are very likely the culprits in your scenario. 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rayok275 Posted June 23, 2015 Share Posted June 23, 2015 Rotten, I have a similar setup. I'm driving my RF 7ii's with an NAD c375bee integrated and have plenty of bass. I always rum mine flat and the bass is present and strong. Have you adjusted speaker placement? Ray 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MyOwn Posted June 23, 2015 Share Posted June 23, 2015 Welcome, I run mine flat, Depending on the recording these RF-7 II dig down low. I don't need a sub woofer. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Islander Posted June 23, 2015 Share Posted June 23, 2015 It's my opinion that almost all speakers need the help of a subwoofer to properly reproduce the full range of music. Even some purists at high end audio magazines have come around to this point of view. They notice that the benefits of having a sub extend into the lower midrange, giving a better impression of the size and shape of the room in which the recording was made. That may seem counter-intuitive, but the same effect has been noticed with supertweeters, which have an effect into the upper midrange, which is outside the frequency range of the supertweeters. Careful attention to speaker placement and direction is important to get the best out of your speakers, but can't fully compensate for the way most speakers' output diminishes when they get into the low bass range. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RottenPilot Posted June 23, 2015 Author Share Posted June 23, 2015 (edited) I should have stated "compared to my AV system." I have a couple of SVS PB-Ultra subs running my HT and the bass is ultra low and powerful. My friends system is smooth and open, not boom boom boom either. My HT system itself just doesn't work so well for stereo music. Multi channel music is ok but I prefer to listen to stereo music 100%. My 2 channel system sounds much better now. I just moved my speakers closer to the back wall and it helped tremendously. They were originally about 24" from the rear wall and are now about 10" from the wall with a slight toe in. It wasn't my idea, my buddy came over to play with my system. He also gave me a pair of 15' Audio Quest Rocket 44 cables. He said he upgraded a couple years ago because he wanted something different so Merry Christmas and Happy Birthday he said. I can't say if the cables improved the sound because we moved the speakers at the same time. Tonight I will do a comparison test just for my own sanity. Personally, I don't know I would ever spend $600 on speaker cables but it is nice to have them given to me LOL!!! I will say that the new cables look a zillion percent cooler than the monster XP cable I was using. Edited June 23, 2015 by RottenPilot 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thebes Posted June 23, 2015 Share Posted June 23, 2015 Welcome to the Forum, you'll like it here. Good for you on the cables. They are the last thing you need to play with. There is a distinct difference between two channel and surround systems. Most of the tracks cut for surround sound are envisioning a sub in the equation and are mastered accordingly. Movies, IMO , peddle an uneven, exaggerated presentation that cannot compare to the balanced presentation of a well-recorded stereo tune. In any event, that's somewhat irregardless of what you are experiencing. Placement is huge with direct radiators so continue to play around with toe-in, width of sound-field and back-and forth from the walls, and better yet corners. Also, give your ears a chance to adjust. Two days is not enough time to dial in a system. Multi-channel and 2 channel really are two different cats so settle back and contemplate your audio navel. What your wife gave you will not pale soon, and will outlast you and your children if taken care of. Great Father's day present. Your wife's a keeper, as if you already didn't know that. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
willland Posted June 24, 2015 Share Posted June 24, 2015 (edited) Onkyo A-9070 Integrated Amp How do you like your Onkyo A-9070? I went back and forth many times trying to decide between the Onkyo A-9070 and the Yamaha A-S1000 when I wanted something new(or newish) to drive my RB-75's. As you can see from my gear profile I decided on the Yamaha and am very pleased in every way but I do like that the 9070 has a built in DAC. vs With these guts it was quite a tough decision for me. Bill Edited June 24, 2015 by willland 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AllenTacey Posted June 24, 2015 Share Posted June 24, 2015 Rotten I am the same. I am back after about 15 years of no speakers My equipment is antique. Hafler Pre-amp Hafler Amp + Carver Amp Bi amped but also Bi wired. The Hafler is very conservative rated Damping Factor of 50 while the Carver is conservatively rated Damping Factor @150. The damping factor is a clue. I have the Hafler driving a conservative 100 watts per channel into the top connections and the Carver driving a conservative 200 watts per channel into the bottom connectors. What I really have is the Hafler driving tweets and mid with 200 watts per channel and the Carver 285 watts per channel. Using all of this in a 12' x 13' room all walls "live" (no carpet minimum furniture). I bring up Damping Factor because simply what that is amounts to the ability to return the woofers to what they are shut off. So the woofs with a high Damping Factor pushes the sound then pulls back very rapidly. A 30 Hz wave needs 30 feet to unfold so some speakers are configured with a folded horn design. Over the years these have been replaced with ports etc. What I see as your problem is one or two of three things things. Your room size, your setup or your equipment. My Hafler amp weights 23 pounds minimal electronics while the Carver weights like 10 pounds (feels like 2lbs) and is a stuff box. Both Bob Carver and David Hafler had opposing thoughts but both are right? Onkyo stuffs their boxes. I firmly believe in 2 speaker systems. If you could hear my system then consider I bought the Carver for $137 and the Hafler I built $200 you'd scratch you head. Close your eyes and you are transported by the highs the lows and everything in between right where they belong. Sax to French horns woohoo!! Bass give the Temptations a listen. Guitar Eric Clapton. Drums use Ringo Starr. Flugelhorn? Listen to Chuck Manglone. If you need real music listen to Dave Brubeck playing Take Five https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PHdU5sHigYQ 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cradeldorf Posted June 24, 2015 Share Posted June 24, 2015 Source is also a game changer, When you find good stuff it's amazing how good the bass sounds. other than that your standing there questioning your rig. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AllenTacey Posted June 24, 2015 Share Posted June 24, 2015 What does caveat mean? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daddy Dee Posted June 26, 2015 Share Posted June 26, 2015 welcome to this place. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Dude Posted June 26, 2015 Share Posted June 26, 2015 Rotten, seems like you have had some great advice. At this point I will just welcome you to the club. Stick around and enjoy, there is a lot to learn here. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fish Posted June 26, 2015 Share Posted June 26, 2015 (edited) Most Klipsch are weak in bass, get a sub, just my opinion Edited June 26, 2015 by Fish Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
willland Posted June 26, 2015 Share Posted June 26, 2015 (edited) Most Klipsch are weak in bass, get a sub, just my opinion I know you specified "most" but my RF-63's are definitely not lacking any tight, fast, punchy, articulate, accurate, deepish(couldn't think of any other good adjectives ) bass. With that said, I do have four subs running with them just in case. Bill Edited June 26, 2015 by willland Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thebes Posted June 26, 2015 Share Posted June 26, 2015 He must be a rotten pilot, he sure crashed this thread. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anotherforumname Posted June 27, 2015 Share Posted June 27, 2015 Congratulations and nice set up, welcome back to audio and welcome to the forum. Only a few speakers have done it for me without a sub especially in my living room. Polk SDA SRS 2 and some Infinity Quantum line source, everything else gets help from my Sunfire sub, even my Forte IIs. P.S. we do like pics on this forum. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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