jimjimbo Posted July 26, 2015 Share Posted July 26, 2015 Keep the excellent comments coming guys! I know there are a lot of forum members lurking in the background who are enjoying their Klipsch speakers with restored vintage Scott, Fisher, Mac, and other tube amps (as well as Craig's and Justin's amps). I would be one of them, Scott LK-150, LC-21 and a Justin Stereo 15 SE So, let's hear from you with your thoughts on this question! And to answer Schu and Don, if there's a separate tubes section you certainly don't have to look at it! Just like everything else Its presence should not bother you in any way and should not detract from your participation in, or enjoyment of, those sections of which you do approve. I have no interest in home theater, subs, pro audio, headphones , or personal music systems and could care less that we have those sections. Me either, and I don't bother reading them Yet, I would not suggest that those sections not be available. I could also make the claim for not having a headphone section since that could be included in 2 channel as well. I had also suggested a separate Heritage section some time ago, and that was shot down as well. Sure, there are other websites that have tube sections (which I frequent, and read), but there are also other websites that discuss Oxycontin and other powerful drugs, the subject of which has been at the top of the heap here for some time. One other thing....I hope I'm wrong about this, but I would be very, very disappointed if the "No Bullshit" section for those over 5K posts was in any fashion created to accommodate a member who had been recently banned from the regular forum, and had made "demands" regarding his content, etc.... I would like to hear a truthful, honest answer to this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tsakiridis Posted July 26, 2015 Share Posted July 26, 2015 I have for my self Tsakiridis Devices, 1 Tube Preamplifier and 2 Tube Mono Amplifier. Tsakiridis Devices & Klipsch is a good marriage. http://www.tsakiridis-devices.com Jonas Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
willland Posted July 26, 2015 Share Posted July 26, 2015 One other thing....I hope I'm wrong about this, but I would be very, very disappointed if the "No Bullshit" section for those over 5K posts was in any fashion created to accommodate a member who had been recently banned from the regular forum, and had made "demands" regarding his content, etc.... I would like to hear a truthful, honest answer to this. No worries here. The No BS section was created to accommodate those who were part of the old BS section that Chad did away with. No "demands" from any forum member, current or past, were the reason for the No BS section's creation. The old BS section was one in which you had to be invited in or "sponsored" by a current member pending "approval" from our beloved Amy. At least that was the way I was able to enter. Bill Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LarryC Posted July 26, 2015 Share Posted July 26, 2015 I see no downside, but think 2 Channel section is adequate. If you still need votes, why not do a poll? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thaddeus Smith Posted July 26, 2015 Share Posted July 26, 2015 The old BS section was killed by corporate. The new one was created to appease existing members that felt betrayed by the decision, albeit with some fresh rules and parameters for participation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigStewMan Posted July 26, 2015 Share Posted July 26, 2015 blasted corporate intervention. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T2K Posted July 26, 2015 Share Posted July 26, 2015 Keith, I changed my statement about the exclusive section to reflect what you stated. Of course, now I'm even more confused. Why would the company reward inappropriate forum behavior by giving those individuals their own place to hang out? That makes even less sense than the current requirement of 5k posts! Having the tube related stuff buried within the 2 channel section is exactly why it should be separated. I've tried searching for specific tube related threads to no avail. Wouldn't it be better if a Google search for tubes/Klipsch took a person directly to a forum category for that? If you look at other forums, tube discussions are always kept as a separate category (in fact, AA as one example, even splits SETs out from other types of tube amps). Here we have a company whose products, for the most part, sound exquisite with tube electronics making no mention of that fact to the public! That, too, makes no sense. Look at advertising by Zu Audio, Tekton Design, and myriad other speaker companies and you will find all kinds of information about suitable amplifiers for their products. Klipsch is missing out on a free marketing opportunity here! If you search for speakers suitable for use with tube amps you will rarely see any mention of Klipsch; and when it is mentioned it is usually in the context of their having some suitable speakers which are "dinosaurs." We all know that's a load of garbage. I've "sold" many pairs of Reference and Heritage series speakers by simply demonstrating what they can do with tube amps. Wdecho also makes good points. I disagree however regarding the cost of quality SET sound. It does not have to cost a fortune to achieve this, and that mode of operation is perfect for beginners interested in DIY projects. I will not gain anything by having the separate forum section other than not boring those who are disinterested by posting tube related threads in the 2 channel section. There are many tube guys on here who are willing to share their knowledge for no other gain than to help others who want to give that mode of listening a try. That's my view of the situation. Maynard I don't know why the thing was set up the way it was Maynard. But if you think that the section that you are advocating would have merit then maybe there are members who see value in the forum that you criticize. Being critical of the other forum will not advance your wishes. I have no feelings about a tube forum one way or the other. I have read some of your posts here and found them interesting and informative. I know that you help and have helped others here and I appreciate that you do that. That is what this place should really be about, and used to be about, audiophools helping other audiophools. As a backup plan you might consider a tube equipment section in the 2-channel forum, something like the 'alerts' in the 'garage sale' forum. Users could click 'tube' from the main page without wading thru 2-channel. Just a thought. Good luck. Hardheads usually prevail here so keep on swinging. Keith Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tube fanatic Posted July 26, 2015 Author Share Posted July 26, 2015 Larry, I decided to approach the tubes section this way since it gives members the opportunity to express their views instead of just casting a vote. And, Keith, I'm not being critical of the exclusive forum section. I view that in the same way I view the other forum sections in which I have no interest. Looking at it from a business standpoint, it makes no sense to me at all. And, the criterion about the required 5k posts also makes no sense to me as some who have achieved that did so with non-contributory posts like "+1s", " thumbs up", and all the other stuff which was pointed out by many during the previous discussions about it.As to having a hard head, yes, I guess I give that impression (although underneath I'm really a nice guy)! Between being old, and living in NJ (where nothing gets accomplished without extreme persistence), it comes naturally! Maynard Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SWL Posted July 26, 2015 Share Posted July 26, 2015 I see no downside, but think 2 Channel section is adequate. Dave That's the way I've always looked at it......but recently I've found the magic combination in my listening room combining tubes with digital so I'm all for finding more resources to learn about tubes. Either way we're fortunate to have some serious tube guys around here. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris A Posted July 26, 2015 Share Posted July 26, 2015 It seems that the admin's rationale/decision for not having a Heritage series subforum here (honoring the company founder) is being overlooked. That idea (Heritage) seems to be a much more appropriate subforum for Klipsch-if you advocate splitting forums--than a "tube" subforum, IMHO. If not one, why the other? Here are examples of tube amplifier forums that already have active participation. Why duplicate them with yet another forum here? http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/tubes-valves/ http://www.audioasylum.com/forums/tubediy/bbs.html http://www.audioasylum.com/forums/set/bbs.html http://www.audioasylum.com/forums/otl/bbs.html http://www.audiokarma.org/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=14 http://el34world.com/Forum/index.php http://diyaudioprojects.com/Forum/viewforum.php?f=9 http://www.whatsbestforum.com/forumdisplay.php?58-Vacuum-Tube-Audio-Forum http://www.tdpri.com/forum/glowing-bottle-tube-amp-forum/ http://bottlehead.com/smf/ Etc. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris A Posted July 26, 2015 Share Posted July 26, 2015 (edited) Perhaps a more constructive suggestion would be for you, Maynard, to put together a FAQ or series of well-written articles on the subject of tube electronics and high efficiency loudspeakers - such as Klipsch horn-loaded models (Khorn, La Scala, Belle, Jubilee), and perhaps those models that require more output (all other Klipsch models). Additionally, it would be constructive to have a discussion on the pros/cons of other amplifier types, such as SS class A, AB, D, etc. vs. tubes, and a discussion of the pros/cons of the different tube type amplifiers (i.e., push-pull, SE, triode, pentode, etc.). Those articles would be much more helpful to the readers here, IMHO, than yet another subforum. You can tag any thread that you start--even after you've created it by editing them later--something like "tubes" or "SET", or OTL, FAQ, etc. and assign multiple tags for a single thread. That makes it very easy for readers to collect threads together on those subjects of interest--the reason why we have tags. Also note that the Frazier Loudspeaker thread has served well for those owners. Why not have persistent threads for some tube electronics topics that can be reused again and again. This approach has worked well on other audio subjects here. Chris Edited July 26, 2015 by Chris A Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LarryC Posted July 26, 2015 Share Posted July 26, 2015 Larry, I decided to approach the tubes section this way since it gives members the opportunity to express their views instead of just casting a vote. That's fine, and you're getting that, but maybe you need some numbers to add to the viewpoints. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jimjimbo Posted July 26, 2015 Share Posted July 26, 2015 It seems that the admin's rationale/decision for not having a Heritage series subforum here (honoring the company founder) is being overlooked. That idea (Heritage) seems to be a much more appropriate subforum for Klipsch-if you advocate splitting forums--than a "tube" subforum, IMHO. If not one, why the other? Here are examples of tube amplifier forums that already have active participation. Why duplicate them with yet another forum here? http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/tubes-valves/ http://www.audioasylum.com/forums/tubediy/bbs.html http://www.audioasylum.com/forums/set/bbs.html http://www.audioasylum.com/forums/otl/bbs.html http://www.audiokarma.org/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=14 http://el34world.com/Forum/index.php http://diyaudioprojects.com/Forum/viewforum.php?f=9 http://www.whatsbestforum.com/forumdisplay.php?58-Vacuum-Tube-Audio-Forum http://www.tdpri.com/forum/glowing-bottle-tube-amp-forum/ http://bottlehead.com/smf/ Etc. The heritage section suggestion was not overlooked. I even ran a poll to go along with it. If I remember correctly the rationale for not doing it was because they were too busy and it would take too much time. However apparently they weren't too busy to create a new bullshit section… Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris A Posted July 26, 2015 Share Posted July 26, 2015 Reminds me of another quote: "I know the world isn’t fair, but why isn’t it ever unfair in my favor?" - Bill Watterson I believe it's better to let those who have trouble controlling their impulses to go their own way (i.e., the heritage-BS forum). It's like letting the guy tailgating you on the highway go around you. Oftentimes you drive past them again, this time touched by misfortune down the road. JMTC. Chris Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joshnich Posted July 26, 2015 Share Posted July 26, 2015 The only downside I see is that with more forum sections, you could end up having less activity. I think the two channel is adequate. Besides how could someone try to convince the other person that one topology is best when they are isolated in their own tribal section! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LarryC Posted July 26, 2015 Share Posted July 26, 2015 The only downside I see is that with more forum sections, you could end up having less activity. I think the two channel is adequate. I agree. I rescind my earlier suggestion for a poll, and also think 2-channel is just fine for this purpose. It gets confusing and extra work to have to guess which place you have to look for the subject areas you want to see. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tube fanatic Posted July 26, 2015 Author Share Posted July 26, 2015 Josh, I can't agree about the tubes section resulting in decreased activity. Yes, it may reduce the number of posts in the 2 channel section very slightly, but the total number of forum posts would remain unchanged. The purpose of the separate section is not to try to convince anyone that tubes are best, but rather to form a repository of information for those who are interested in that subject area. Chris, I'm very familiar with the other sites you linked above as I've participated in a bunch of them over the years (and still do on rare occasions). Sure, those are fine if one wants to discuss exotic tube amp circuitry which often borders on the lunatic fringe. That would not be the case on here unless there are forum members I'm not aware of who are into the arcane side of tube amp design.In any event, all comments above are appreciated. I'll keep this bumped up for a few days in case any interested parties are away this weekend. If there's no interest, so be it. I'll still be here to answer questions and offer assistance!Maynard Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
erik2A3 Posted July 26, 2015 Share Posted July 26, 2015 Maynard: Tubes and Klipsch is always a great topic, yet we have always discussed the two often on this forum, which has fulfilled the task just fine IMO. I first ventured here in 2002, and was up to many thousands of posts before I took a break to work on projects. The topic is always of interest to me, but the 2-channel forum has been just fine, actually. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jim Posted July 27, 2015 Share Posted July 27, 2015 The only downside I see is that with more forum sections, you could end up having less activity. I think the two channel is adequate. Besides how could someone try to convince the other person that one topology is best when they are isolated in their own tribal section! The only downside I see is that with more forum sections, you could end up having less activity. I think the two channel is adequate.I agree. I rescind my earlier suggestion for a poll, and also think 2-channel is just fine for this purpose. It gets confusing and extra work to have to guess which place you have to look for the subject areas you want to see. As opposed to a sugar thread? Or the Bullshit forum for "distinguished" members? I personally don't have anything against those types of posts or forums, but when I've had questions on tube amps and posted, I've had numerous "views" but only 3-4 responses if I'm lucky. With the tube section, those same questions can go to them directly, instead of having numerous people look at them only to not answer. On Heritage speaker questions I've asked the response has always been "just buy them because they are Heritage" and decide later. Really?? And none of them were in depth on differences of why they felt they were better,or even took the time to explain why they purchased theirs. On HT questions everyone has had including some of mine. When a question is asked about a particular series, the answer is always, get rid of those and buy this model (usually what they have), and the OP question is never answered. And when someone does try to answer the question, they get ganged up on as not knowing what is good or not. My very 1st port was asking to upgrade or not. And everyone said get rid of those and upgrade, those speakers are garbage,and what did they steer me to? Their speaker line with no explanation. I just think if we are going to have clicks,like this site does have, we should be able to choose where we want to go withing those clicks. Why should we have to go on several different forums, to jump back and forth from site to site when we can do it all here. I can honestly say there are very few on this site who actually take the time to explain things and educate others. I came to this site at the recommendation of Klipsch as I had questions that they said would be answered. Unfortunately there's a lot of bickering between clicks that spill over to the other forums. And a lot of the questions turn into attacks against each other because of differences of opinions. I again would like to see a tube section, as well as a Heritage section, Synergy section, Reference section, KG section, or any other sections that are following a particular line. They have it for some, but not others. How can anyone give an educated answer on a Synergy product if they've never owned one, but only own Heritage? The response is usually that line is not as good as this line, get rid of yours, upgrade and you'll be happy as I am. Just more of my 0.02 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mike stehr Posted July 27, 2015 Share Posted July 27, 2015 Clique Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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