Xilica XP-8040 processor

[NBPK402]

I just got my replacement for the balanced MiniDSP. It is quiet with absolutely zero hiss unlike the MiniDSP in my system (112db efficient horns).

 

I need to do this:

1: Set the crossovers to 500hz with a 24db LR crossover

2: Set the Low Pass Filter cutoff frequency to 500hz (bass bins)

3: Set the High Pass Filter cutoff frequency to 500hz (horns) 

3: Set a high shelf of 12000hz with a 12db gain, and a .5Q ( horns)

 

This is my adjustment screen for the Left Horn

 

Does anyone have any ideas on what I need to do to match my old settings to the Xilica?

 

tia,

Ron

[Chris A]

I need to do this: 1: Set the crossovers to 500hz with a 24db LR crossover 2: Set the Low Pass Filter cutoff frequency to 500hz (bass bins) 3: Set the High Pass Filter cutoff frequency to 500hz (horns) 3: Set a high shelf of 12000hz with a 12db gain, and a .5Q ( horns

 

The dark blue colored headings on the right are the crossover settings.  I'd select Linkwitz-Riley as a starting point and then set the low pass on channel 1 [assumed to be your bass bin channel) to 500, the hi-pass to 500 on channel 2 to L-R - 500 Hz.  Do the same thing for the right loudspeaker screen.

 

I'd try clicking on the PEQ1 heading to see if it changes to HISLV or something similar, then set the frequency to 12 kHz and the gain to 12 dB.  Shelf filters that I've seen don't have a "Q", but they typically do have a 6 or 12 dB/Octave setting. 

 

You probably have to manually set the input to channel 1 to be your left channel low, channel 2 to be your left channel high, channel 3 to be your right channel low, and channel 4 to be your right channel high. 

 

Let us know what happens.

 

Chris

Edited August 9, 2015 by Chris A

[NBPK402]

Hi Chris,

We got it programmed but we are getting very very low output...just low voice area. Here are some screen shots of our settings. Can you see a possible cause?

 

Center channel bass bin:

 

Center channel horn:

 

Center channel complete: On this one disregard the LPF being none as I am just selecting plots one and 2 to be displayed when it is actually only showing the LR part for the BB with the graph selecting both to see the crossover.

 

I have a feeling it is going to be some dumb thing we overlooked. We have double checked all the wiring and it is correct.

Edited August 9, 2015 by ellisr63

[Chris A]

You've probably set channel 1 to take the input from the bass bin, etc. but it could be set to another channel: you could check the channel assignments - I can't see that in the figures).  Inverting the channel assignments, low to high, or assigning the wrong channels to an input 1 or input 2 will produce what you're describing.

 

The PEQs probably need to be set to bypass (the buttons at the bottom of each column) if they haven't already been (I can't tell if they have or haven't been). 

 

I don't see the smoking gun setting currently, but I'll let you know if I see something.

 

Chris

[NBPK402]

I just set all the PEQs to bypass... no difference.

[Chris A]

Any progress?

 

I've still thinking that the assignment of input channels to output channels is likely an issue if you're still having trouble getting any sound out of the unit.

 

Chris

[NBPK402]

Last night I worked on it some more...

I believe I have the inputs assigned to the proper outputs (I also labeled them, but still not working properly. If I can't get this figured out by Monday I am going to see if I can get someone to config it for me (that has one and send me the file to upload). 

 

Here are the current screen shot.

 

This is with the outputs named, and assigned..

 

 

You can see that the inputs are labeled as Mixers, and assigned to the outputs correctly (appear to be). Crossover setting for the one output is also correct (center channel bass bin). What does the limit on the right mean? I also saw a setting for compression... not sure where that should be either.

 

If you want to look at the manual it is here...

 

http://www.starfelt.se/manualer/1110890033man.pdf

 

 

I have posted this in a few forums to see if someone can see what I am doing wrong or missing.

 

tia,

Ron

Edited August 9, 2015 by ellisr63

[NBPK402]

I have it working without the Dirac in place so it must be a setting or wiring problem with the Dirac. I still don't have the shelf in yet though.

 

Do I need to set the shelf or should I just let the Dirac handle it? The Xilica should be much cleaner (I am supposing since it is a Pro model).

 

tia,

Ron

[Chris A]

I'm not sure what "Dirac" actually is - it appears to be software room correction that runs on a PC/Mac.  If so, I'm surprised that it caused you issues.

 

I'd put the shelf filters into the Xilica, but that's just me.

 

Some ideas to try:

 

1) it looks as if you've got a low pass filter on input1 and 3, and also on outputs 1, 3, 5, 7, 8.  You might try turning the input LP filters to "bypass"--if that is possible.

 

2) The output gains on output s 2,4, 6 are at -18 dB.  Is that correct?  That's a fair amount of attenuation. 

 

3) The Danley DTS-10s probably have around 21-23 feet of path length in addition to the distance from the mouth to your listening position.  That's an additional 18+ ms of delay on the loudspeakers relative to the DTS-10s.  I'm assuming that your Dirac is taking care of that?

 

3) I'll let you know...

 

Good to hear that you've got sound.  I was beginning to get a little worried...

 

 

Chris

[NBPK402]

I'm not sure what "Dirac" actually is - it appears to be software room correction that runs on a PC/Mac.  If so, I'm surprised that it caused you issues.

 

I'd put the shelf filters into the Xilica, but that's just me.

 

Some ideas to try:

 

1) it looks as if you've got a low pass filter on input1 and 3, and also on outputs 1, 3, 5, 7, 8.  You might try turning the input LP filters to "bypass"--if that is possible.

 

2) The output gains on output s 2,4, 6 are at -18 dB.  Is that correct?  That's a fair amount of attenuation. 

 

3) The Danley DTS-10s probably have around 21-23 feet of path length in addition to the distance from the mouth to your listening position.  That's an additional 18+ ms of delay on the loudspeakers relative to the DTS-10s.  I'm assuming that your Dirac is taking care of that?

 

3) I'll let you know...

 

Good to hear that you've got sound.  I was beginning to get a little worried...

 

 

Chris

The Dirac is a box that does room tuning supposedly better than Audyssey. One of the great features is you can save 4 settings in the unit to select from, plus you can save even more to your HDD. If they are saved to the HDD you need to delete the ones saved to the unit, and load the ones you want. Once you have the ones you want all you do is select the tune you want from the front panel.

 

1: 1,3, and 5 are my bass bins, and 7, and 8 are my subs.

 

2: On 2,4,6 I have them turned down 18db due to the efficiency difference of the 1/4 pie bass bins vs the horns... I originally did this because Audyssey would crossover my bass bins at 250Hz to the subs. I figured it might be the efficiency variation, and slowly raised the bass bin gain, and lowered the gain on the horns until I got a 80hz crossover to the subs with Audyssey.

 

3:  The Dirac will take care of that if i want it to, but I will have to find out exactly what the path length is and I think it will be better in the Xilica.

[Chris A]

What I'm wondering is whether you are applying a low pass filter twice - once on the input side and once on the outputs, mentioned above. 

 

My crossovers will do this, too, but you only need one low pass for driver, otherwise you might have some interesting results.  Recommend LP only on the outputs.

Edited August 9, 2015 by Chris A

[NBPK402]

Thanks Chris,

  I see the LP on the input, and I am trying to get it removed. I also have sound now. I still need to put the High Shelf in, and figure out the delay for the subs.

[NBPK402]

I have the LP removed now from the input. I also now have some hiss again. It is not as bad as before but it is def there again. I am wondering if I should try flipping the jumpers on the Dirac down from 8V to 4V. I am thinking that might make it better, but maybe it will get worse?? Any ideas on how to track it down to zero again? 

[mark1101]

How are things connected?  With XLR cables?  Do the upstream components have an impedance mismatch that is creating noise and low output?

 

Now this is just me.........so don't take it wrong, but I don't "DO" room correction toys like Audessey.  I would immediately remove those form the system and use the new tool you have to adjust and optimize your setup.  Then, when it works correctly you can add these other components as desired.

 

You really are asking a lot to integrate a unit like a speaker processor into all that you have.

 

I would go Preamp, processor, amps until you get it all the way you want it.

 

I have a home audio preamp that simply will not interface correctly with pro audio devices.  Just isn't compatible.

 

You need to get past all that first.

[mark1101]

The -18db on the processor output doesn't sound right at all.  You need to get full resolution through that processor and instead turn down the gains on the amps to compensate for big differences in efficiencies.

 

Please tell me your amps have gain controls. 

[Chris A]

I also now have some hiss again. It is not as bad as before but it is def there again. I am wondering if I should try flipping the jumpers on the Dirac down from 8V to 4V. I am thinking that might make it better, but maybe it will get worse?? Any ideas on how to track it down to zero again?

 

The hiss can be from several sources, so if you can systematically remove the upstream components to the XIlica, then the XIlica itself (i.e., no connections to the amplifiers) until the hiss disappears, then you'll have isolated the piece that you need to work on.  If it is the amplifiers, then that tells to something, too.

 

I'd set the Dirac to the 2V (i.e., the least sensitive input).  I'd also check any unbalanced connectors/cables (RCA, etc.) by swapping out with new or unused cables.

 

I wouldn't be terribly surprised if it were the Dirac (miniDSP) that is giving you the issues, since everything I've read and found from others say that the Xilica should be pretty much dead quiet.

 

Chris

Edited August 11, 2015 by Chris A

[NBPK402]

The -18db on the processor output doesn't sound right at all.  You need to get full resolution through that processor and instead turn down the gains on the amps to compensate for big differences in efficiencies.

 

Please tell me your amps have gain controls. 

My amps are the Lexicon NT-512 (Bryston 9B), and Sherbourn 5/1500...both of which have no gain controls. That is why I am cutting the gain on the horns. I have the crossovers setup properly now (except for a high shelf), and now I have the gain at -10db.

[NBPK402]

 

I also now have some hiss again. It is not as bad as before but it is def there again. I am wondering if I should try flipping the jumpers on the Dirac down from 8V to 4V. I am thinking that might make it better, but maybe it will get worse?? Any ideas on how to track it down to zero again?

 

The hiss can be from several sources, so if you can systematically remove the upstream components to the XIlica, then the XIlica itself (i.e., no connections to the amplifiers) until the hiss disappears, then you'll have isolated the piece that you need to work on.  If it is the amplifiers, then that tells to something, too.

 

I'd set the Dirac to the 2V (i.e., the least sensitive input).  I'd also check any unbalanced connectors/cables (RCA, etc.) by swapping out with new or unused cables.

 

I wouldn't be terribly surprised if it were the Dirac (miniDSP) that is giving you the issues, since everything I've read and found from others say that the Xilica should be pretty much dead quiet.

 

Chris

 

I will have to check again on that. When I checked last week:

The Bryston had no hiss with the inputs removed, same with the Sherbourn, and also the Xilica. I will check them all again to see where the hiss is coming from. I will also try changing the settings on the Dirac to the lowest settings. I am running full balanced... XLRs from the Krell preamp to phoenix connectors on the Dirac (still balanced), Phoenix (balanced to the Xilica XLRs, and Xilica XLRs to the amps. I hope that it is a setting vs being the MiniDSP Dirac as no one else is having hiss problems with it as far as I have researched.

[NBPK402]

I just put balanced xlr to unbalanced RCA cables going from the Dirac to the Xilica, and the hiss is gone...this reduced the output of the Dirac by 12db without doing any internal jumper changes. I am debating on doing the same for the surrounds (as they are way to hot now, or flip the jumpers to the lower setting too. Cables are the easiest, and will reduce everything the same so that is most likely the best way to go (IMO). With the jumpers I will most likely have some imbalance but the Dirac can electronically adjust the little variance. I will post up how this works out.

[mark1101]

Honestly, this doesn't sound good.  Since you can't back your amps down to reduce the gain and hiss, you are forced to reduce the gain of the processor.  That is not good at all because you are reducing the signal/noise ration significantly and also reducing the resolution through the system.

 

You should not really attempt an active system with amps that have no gain controls.  Honestly, that is fundamental.

 

The only recourse is attenuate your preamp, inputs to the processor.............both of which reduce signal/noise significantly, or reduce the output of your processor which reduces its resolution.

 

The proper way to operate such a system is to hit the processor with the required signal level...........the goal should be to take a good amount of gain "up front".

 

Us the processor as a "gain even" device.........no gain, no attenuation.

 

Then, open the gains of your amps only enough as required to listen to the music as loud as you ever would..........and to aid in balancing the channels.

 

This should leave you with the amps turned up only slightly..........and a very quiet and clean sounding system.