Klipsch Jubilee newbie seeking help please ....

[jwc]

Yes, you would need the screens "official" THX.  I would call Klipsch Pro about it.

 

I wasn't aware of similar material.

[Chris A]

...Or you could simply apply a little attenuation to the loudspeakers that looks like the attenuation of the screen, with typical values vs. frequency that look like the following blue trace (which isn't much at all), or perhaps as bad as the red trace for screens with wide "scrims".  REW and a calibration microphone are your friends:

[Travis In Austin]

If the horns are designed for use behind a screen and you don't plan to put them behind a screen, can't you just get some acoustically-similar material and put it it front of the horns? A lot of people want to build grills for these speakers anyway.

I guess I am not understanding the 2 or 3 resp9nses ti this post by JMON. Both responses gave the correct approach in what you need to do if running behind a screen.

Are you planning on running yours behind a screen? Are you asking if you need to change settings if you are not running behind a screen?

The basic settings Roy did are without a screen.

Your question assumes that the KPT-KHJ-LF and 402 horn were designed to go behind a screen. I do not think that is the case at all. The bass bin was originally designed for the home, to fit within same footprint of a Khorn.

I have never heard that the 402 was designed to go behind a screen, but I know most do. But, as I mentioned, the basic setting are gor no screen.

If you are going to put them behind a screen it will sepend on the screen. Bill ran his behind a screen, the screen was tested, and the reccomendation was no changes be made to the settings, it was that acoustically transparent. If you are going behind the screen you can check with him.

Travis Travis

[Travis In Austin]

Is anyone aware of adjustments being necessary after installing grills on the KPT-KHJ-LF?

[PrestonTom]

Is anyone aware of adjustments being necessary after installing grills on the KPT-KHJ-LF?

I measured my bass bins with and without grills and there was no difference.

[Chris A]

Travis, 

 

If you look at the graph above, you'll see that the effect of screens all affect 1 kHz and above, and they really don't do a lot until you get up to about 10 kHz.

 

As far as the behind-the-screen settings for the Jubilee 535 (3-way) and similar cinema products: if they are behind-the-screen units (as a Jubilee 535 is), then the active settings that you'll find from Klipsch will include typical through-the-screen EQ, which you can estimate from the graph above, and dial out if you aren't using them behind a screen.

 

If you're using the settings for a 2-way (home version) Jub, then what you say is correct: you'll have to boost the settings that we use on the HF if you're set up behind a screen.

 

REW and a calibration microphone will take out the slack, in any case.

 

Chris

Edited December 13, 2015 by Chris A

[Travis In Austin]

I see what you are saying now. Those specs don't maKe any make any mention of having a projection screen in front of them, or what their reference screen would be and what would neednto be adjusted.

I do know that in the case of the screen sibmitted by Bill H there was enought of a measurable difference to make any corrections necessary.

From a Bill H post on the subject:

Call Chris Seymour

http://www.seymourav.com/

I have an AT screen in front of JubScala center and KPT-884 sub. Roy measured the screen and said it's one of the best he's seen.

Chris has about any configuration you like including DIY.

[J M O N]

I measured my bass bins with and without grills and there was no difference.

 

I believe it's only the high frequencies that would be impacted.

[PrestonTom]

 

I measured my bass bins with and without grills and there was no difference.

 

I believe it's only the high frequencies that would be impacted.

 

Absolutely correct.

The original post was specifically asking about the bass bin. The half power point of the bass bin will be a bit less that 500Hz. 

[J M O N]

 

 

I measured my bass bins with and without grills and there was no difference.

 

I believe it's only the high frequencies that would be impacted.

 

Absolutely correct.

The original post was specifically asking about the bass bin. The half power point of the bass bin will be a bit less that 500Hz. 

 

 

Gotcha -- I guess we were on different topics. My comment was related to the conversation about the 3-way version.

[Jujubee]

To my mind, applying what a person learns, to make a superior product, is what any Craft is all about.  I see there is still continuing envy, regarding Greg Roberts taking Hi-end audio by storm.  I for one, find his products to be outstanding, as do many of the people who used to dislike Horn loudspeakers.  I still assert that PWK would be tickled by what Greg is doing.  I am willing to bet, that PWK would have liked to be able to afford to this, and build this type of loudspeaker, using the truly best components available, and be able to make a profit, as Greg is.

[mikebse2a3]

I am willing to bet, that PWK would have liked to be able to afford to this, and build this type of loudspeaker, using the truly best components available, and be able to make a profit, as Greg is.

 

 

 

Poor ole PWK couldn't afford the best components for his beloved Klipschorn.....???? 

 

Or could it be he designed for the sound he wanted and the components he used met his expectations at the time he was designing ...???

 

miketn

Edited April 30, 2016 by mikebse2a3

[Marvel]

I don't know that Greg is taking the audio world by storm, but he copied a lot of peoples work and prettied them up very, very well. He also had another business to fund his work while he got started.

Bruce

[Grizzog]

Poor ole PWK couldn't afford the best components for his beloved Klipschorn.....????

Or could it be he designed for the sound he wanted and the components he used met his expectations at the time he was designing ...???

miketn

It wouldn't be the first time that I've read PWK was cheap when it came to drivers. The sky's the limit for driver price. I believe he chose drivers that got close enough to the specs he wanted and was able to make them work within his designs. The heritage models have had many different drivers through the years, so it's quite possible PWK would choose different components today. ...or maybe he would call b.s.

[robert_kc]

Great thread!

 

Has anyone determined current pricing for the 2-way Jubilee?   Options for veneer?  Options for grill cloth, or other aesthetic treatment for the high-frequency horn?

 

Pricing for a recommended active crossover?  

 

 

 

 

[Marvel]

Klipsch has nothing for the K402 aesthetics, so that's totally left up to you... Only a veneer for the center panel.

 

Bruce

[jazzmessengers]

I did a bit of searching on the Jubilee after reading about them on another DIY forum. I am currently using Audiovero Acourate to generate room correction and digital crossover convolution filters. I see these have very good objective measured performance. A few questions regarding the home 2-way Jubilee

 

I currently don't have the ability to corner load speakers since I have massive bass traps in the corners which make a marked improvement in my low/mid bass room response. What is the rough frequency extension of the speakers if they aren't corner loaded? I am using a Geddes style subwoofer arrangement for smooth in room response.

 

I see many people have upgraded to TAD 4002 drivers. I have TAD 4001 drivers already, would these work in the K-402? They do not have the throat adapter like the TAD 4002.

 

What is the sensitivity of the bass horn alone? I could only find sensitivity of the 3 way Jubilee system. How would a 20 watt push pull tube amp fare on the bass horns? The subwoofers would be crossed with a fairly steep crossover at around 70-80 Hz, so the bass horn amp would not need to deliver a tremendous amount of power in the lowest frequencies.

 

Thank you.

Edited January 3, 2017 by jazzmessengers
added question on sensitivity and amps.

[dtel]

On 4/30/2016 at 1:19 AM, Jujubee said:

To my mind, applying what a person learns, to make a superior product, is what any Craft is all about.  I see there is still continuing envy, regarding Greg Roberts taking Hi-end audio by storm. " BS "  I for one, find his products to be outstanding, as do many of the people who used to dislike Horn loudspeakers. " He is a good woodworker " I still assert that PWK would be tickled by what Greg is doing.  " I highly doubt that" I am willing to bet, that PWK would have liked to be able to afford to this, and build this type of loudspeaker, using the truly best components available, and be able to make a profit, as Greg is. If PWK wanted to make a prettier copies of his own designs he could have, that's all that was done with more expensive parts and much higher prices. Don't really know the story from the beginning do you ? If this is GR you do know the truth and should be ashamed of yourself.

IMO.....and others 

 

[Edgar]

On 4/30/2016 at 1:22 PM, Marvel said:

I don't know that Greg is taking the audio world by storm, but he copied a lot of peoples work and prettied them up very, very well. He also had another business to fund his work while he got started.

Bruce

 

That's a bit of an oversimplification. I worked with Greg at a very early stage, when he just started his transition from rebuilding Klipschorns to designing his own speakers. We were attempting at that time to create a "better" corner horn, keeping the classic lines of the KHorn but improving the internal sound path, horn profile, and driver complement. But Greg soon realized that constraining the cabinet to a corner caused problems with the midrange and tweeter horns, so he opted for a freestanding cabinet that could be rotated to point in the direction of the listeners. By that time I was no longer in a position to participate in the design process, so Greg enlisted the aid of another designer. And I must say, he (they) appear to have done quite an excellent job of it.

 

One might say that at least one of their products bears a passing resemblance to the LaScala. But there are only a limited number of ways to design a freestanding folded horn, so that resemblance is probably more from physical constraints than actual emulation.

[Chris A]

On 12/29/2016 at 11:12 AM, jazzmessengers said:

What is the rough frequency extension of the speakers if they aren't corner loaded?

You'll lose about one octave (31 Hz --> 61 Hz) on the Jubilee bass bins if they're free standing.  The path length of the Jubilee bass bin is 55 inches (61 Hz).  Here is a measurement of one of my Jubilees in corner loading:

 

 

The dips in response are microphone-wall and microphone-floor cancellations.  The dip in response at 50 Hz is a room mode.

 

On 12/29/2016 at 11:12 AM, jazzmessengers said:

I have TAD 4001 drivers already, would these work in the K-402? They do not have the throat adapter like the TAD 4002.

You <edit: don't> need a 1.5"-->2" adapter that comes from TAD or from some other source.  The K-402 throat is 2 inches diameter.

 

On 12/29/2016 at 11:12 AM, jazzmessengers said:

What is the sensitivity of the bass horn alone?

The bass horn sensitivity is usually the lowest of any loudspeaker's horns/drivers.  In the case of the Jubilee KPT-KHJ-LF, it's about 106 dB at 1 metre/ 1 watt.

 

On 12/29/2016 at 11:12 AM, jazzmessengers said:

How would a 20 watt push pull tube amp fare on the bass horns?

Wonderfully.  I see no issues unless you're listening in a very large space (>500 m^3 or larger).

 

On 12/29/2016 at 11:12 AM, jazzmessengers said:

The subwoofers would be crossed with a fairly steep crossover at around 70-80 Hz, so the bass horn amp would not need to deliver a tremendous amount of power in the lowest frequencies.

I think that you'd be missing the clean bass of the Jubilee bass bins.  Subwoofers that are not horn loaded have high levels of distortion in comparison.  I recommend crossing at 40 Hz instead, which I currently use, and have experimented with the crossover frequency in my listening room.  YMMV.

 

Chris