Altec - Voice of the Theater

[Wolfbane]

I believe they are Model A7 and rated at ~97dB. Any experience on how these compare to the Klipsch sound?

[moray james]

had a pair of well used A7 with 811b horns way back in the seventies. Had them in a small bedroom til my mum stubbed her toe on them and said they had to go. I had only just turned 18 at the time. I like the bass bin but not the 811b though at the time I was impressed. Excellent bass tone in their range. Altec bass tone beats Klipsch.

Edited February 29, 2016 by moray james

[japosey]

I refinished a pair about 10 years ago. It had the 416 mid/sub and 511 horns. I loved the speakers and even purchased a pair of Valencias trying to put together a full 5.1. They were just too big for the space I was going to use them in. I wish I still had photos of the cabinets I refinished. They had a dark cherry vinyl and straw grill cloth. The horn was mounted inside the cabinet.

Edited March 1, 2016 by japosey

[garyrc]

I believe they are Model A7 and rated at ~97dB. Any experience on how these compare to the Klipsch sound?

 

The A7 was the smallest of those called The Voice of the Theater.  It had one woofer which was front horn loaded with a supplementary port. They were still gigantic for the home.  For real theaters of all but the smallest size, Altec made some other models of Voice of the Theater as large as 4 woofer per channel horn fronted loaded bass bins with the port as well..  Of these, there were models with the front loaded woofers arrayed horizontally, and in other models arrayed vertically.  Cinerama's 7 channel sound tended to use 5 big ones (20 woofers in all) behind the screen, and 2 much smaller surround channels with a few speakers on the sides and rear.  CinemaScope (4 channels) used 3 big ones behind the screen, with one switchable or automatically triggered surround channel using a few smaller speakers around the theater.  Despite all that, I preferred the JBL, equal sized, front horn loaded, 4 woofer boxes generally used in Todd-AO (70 mm with 6 channel sound), forming the 20 woofer, 5 channel, behind the screen system, again with smaller speakers for one switchable/auto triggered surround channel.  All of these systems had incredible dynamics and, even though the bass started to roll-off significantly below 40 Hz, great, punchy bass.

 

I did hear several A7s in audio shops and in the stereo recording studio at San Francisco State, as well as in Leo DeGar Kulka's studio in San Francisco.  They seemed good, but had rather "steely" upper midrange, and although they advertised their high frequency response as extending to 22K Hz (then 22K cycles per second), they seemed to lack extreme highs.  Comparatively, Klipschorns seemed warmer, with highs that seemed more extended and were, if you will, more "golden."  I'd pick a Klipschorn over an Altec A7 anytime!

Edited February 29, 2016 by garyrc

[Grizzog]

I've always wanted to hear the A7, but was able to get a set of 19s instead. 

 

The 19s are essentially the home version of the VOTT.  The earlier versions have the 416-8b and 802-8g both with Alnico magnets. They were labeled as studio monitors and have an optimized cabinet, and phase plug for the compression driver.  With the changes, the 19 ended up at ~100db, and can extend both lower (30hz) and higher (20khz) than the A7.  The crossover is set to 1200hz where the woofer and horn have the same dispersion characteristics.  Although not fully horn loaded, it's said that the 19s are much more balanced and a better speaker.

 

Everyone's tastes vary, but the point of that description is that if you are considering A7 for the home, you may want to check out the 19.

Edited February 29, 2016 by Grizzog

[Fjd]

 

I believe they are Model A7 and rated at ~97dB. Any experience on how these compare to the Klipsch sound?

 

The A7 was the smallest of those called The Voice of the Theater.  It had one woofer which was front horn loaded with a supplementary port. They were still gigantic for the home.  For real theaters of all but the smallest size, Altec made some other models of Voice of the Theater as large as 4 woofer per channel horn fronted loaded bass bins with the port as well..  Of these, there were models with the front loaded woofers arrayed horizontally, and in other models arrayed vertically.  Cinerama's 7 channel sound tended to use 5 big ones (20 woofers in all) behind the screen, and 2 much smaller surround channels with a few speakers on the sides and rear.  CinemaScope (4 channels) used 3 big ones behind the screen, with one switchable or automatically triggered surround channel using a few smaller speakers around the theater.  Despite all that, I preferred the JBL, equal sized, front horn loaded, 4 woofer boxes generally used in Todd-AO (70 mm with 6 channel sound), forming the 20 woofer, 5 channel, behind the screen system, again with smaller speakers for one switchable/auto triggered surround channel.  All of these systems had incredible dynamics and, even though the bass started to roll-off significantly below 40 Hz, great, punchy bass.

 

I did hear several A7s in audio shops and in the stereo recording studio at San Francisco State, as well as in Leo DeGar Kulka's studio in San Francisco.  They seemed good, but had rather "steely" upper midrange, and although they advertised their high frequency response as extending to 22K Hz (then 22K cycles per second), they seemed to lack extreme highs.  Comparatively, Klipschorns seemed warmer, with highs that seemed more extended and were, if you will, more "golden."  I'd pick a Klipschorn over an Altec A7 anytime!

 

 

 

 

To add, there is a reason they were named "Voice of the Theater."  Funny, but there are some that think that too much “modding” of Klipschorns is done on this forum; however, in my view the Altec A7 is one of those speakers that requires much more modification to get them ready for home use.  A friend had a pair of A7s, but that has been a long time ago now and given various logistics issues we could not really directly compare them with my Klipschorns in a similar listening space. 

 

Even today, it seems that the A7 continues to have a strong following and have become an "iconic" part of a long-trodden path where many had found their first taste of a great example of a speaker with “dynamics.”  In addition, I find that it can be a fun and a fairly inexpensive DIY exercise to resurrect this old equipment.

 

If looking for a DIY project for that spare cash, it can be fun and I say go for it; although, similar to Garyrc’s view, if it were me, I wouldn’t be in any hurry to sell your Belles for a pair of A7 VOTTs.  Now, if you have the corners, I agree that Klipschorns would seem to be the ticket.

 

Don McRitchie over on the Lansing Heritage forum indicated that a former head of Altec's professional division told him that “the A7 had a specific design goal that compromises its use in other applications. That design goal was to deliver good sound reproduction (with an emphasis on dialog) for cinemas when placed behind a screen. The design purposely had what he called a "haystack" frequency response. Visualize a haystack with its sloping sides and peak in the middle, and you visualize the frequency response of an A7. As this person said "what did you expect for a speaker that is intended to be separated from its listeners by a screen that is 60% acoustically opaque".

 

Overall, I believe that in stock form, it seems that the A7 is primarily just another example of something being very good for its intended purpose, but not necessarily the best design when pulled from that environment and placed in a living room of the typical home environment.   There again, I give the edge to the Khorn.

 

Although, the A7 can be characterized as having great dynamics, unmodified, you will have a system that is often characterized as “forward” and all midrange.  The A7s with the old Altec 806/811 driver/horn combination tends to roll off quickly and you will not find too much above 10 kHz.  I’m not sure about other combinations.  To me, it sure gives “living in the midrange” additional meaning other than just high frequency hearing loss. 

 

The A7 will lack bass compared to the Khorn as I believe the horn actually loads down somewhere around 150 Hz to 200 Hz and any lower response down to about 50 Hz is due to the bass-reflex porting. The bass-reflex porting is not necessarily a bad thing and many have done the bass-reflex type port modification to the La Scala bass bins and seem pleased with the results; however, still not the bass extension of the Khorns in proper corners. 

 

Now if you are still interested, you can find good modification threads over on the Altec user forum over at Hoastboard.  It has been a while since I’ve done a lot of reading over on the Altec user forum; however, I believe I remember that a member over there has a thread on the A5, for which many modifications should translate well to the A7.  You can find threads with modifications on bracing and damping, including damping the bass horn flares since they are thin and were often not braced.  There are also modifications where the ports can be made smaller for extended bass; and of course, crossover modifications.

 

Another good Altec resource can be found in the summer 1993 issue of Sound Practices (the easy way would be to buy the archive CD that can still be found on eBay) and read the article by Jeff Markwart and John Tucker on "Altec 'Voice of the Theater' Speakers for Hi-Fi."  The article was written when Altec was still in business and provides good coverage of the various issues with the speakers and offers solutions.  

 

On a side note, one of my future projects, for an outdoor system (when I have outdoor space again), involves a pair of Altec 817B cabinets that use dual 15” drivers in a front-loading enclosure that loads the bass driver down to 150 Hz, with the bass reflex porting extending useful response to 50 Hz similar to the A7 porting.  I picked up four of the Altec 515-8 GHP woofer drivers for these cabinets.  For midrange, I have a pair of old Altec 1003B multi-cell horns with a pair of Altec 288-16K compression drivers.  I’ll most likely use an EV Dx38 DSP for the crossover where I will have more flexibility to work with the overall frequency response.  These are certainly overwhelming in size for the home and certainly not even close to the good looks of my Khorns (or your Belles), but the price was right and I’m hoping they perform well outdoors.

Edited February 29, 2016 by Fjd

[JDJohnson]

I owned a very nice pair of Altec A7 and they did not come close to sounding as good as my Klipsch Klipschorns or Klipsch Chorus II speakers in any manner! They are called (The Voice Of The Theatre), because they were designed mainly to reproduce the (male voice in a theater) and lack any low bass or higher highs. I like their mids crossed at 800 Hz, but they're not a high fidelity speaker. Klipsch speakers are designed to reproduce all frequencies with high efficiency and do that well. I sold my A7 speakers quickly after comparing them to my Klipsch!

 

[Wardsweb]

I had a pair of A7-825 The Voice of the Theatre speakers that I modified somewhat. The 825 cabinets are actually upside down and the 511B horn is in the bass port. The cabinet was covered in walnut, solid walnut framed grills and a solid walnut pedestal base were made. The were magical in the midrange but with a bass fold of about 13-15 feet, they had no real bass in my small room. This even after a custom crossover was installed.

 

Edited February 29, 2016 by Wardsweb

[Wardsweb]

Here is a size comparison to Cornwalls in my old house about 15 years ago.

 

[wvu80]

 

I owned a very nice pair of Altec A7 and they did not come close to sounding as good as my Klipsch Klipschorns or Klipsch Chorus II speakers in any manner!

 

 

In my readings about those speakers over the years, I had read others say exactly the same thing you just testified to ^^^.

 

I didn't want to say anything because I have never heard them myself, and I didn't want to poo-poo on a potential purchase by somebody based on my second-hand readings.

[juniper]

Altec is old stuff. Not made now.

You may want to look at Great Plains audio.... Then look into what Jean Hiraga did at the Munich Hi End show... Then look at Serious Stereos, RMAF reviews... Lots of good info and reading.... All old or new speakers.....

[JDJohnson]

I wanted to like the A7 speakers and keep them, trust me, but they're more of a public address speaker than a high fidelity home audio speaker. They do what they were designed for well which is human voice firstly, than theater audio. They do have some highs, but at a low audio level compared to their mid range and they have great mid bass, but no low bass and it's more lacking because of the cabinet design than its woofer.

You asked about the A7 compared to Klipsch, so I did not mention the Altec19 which I like more than the A7, because its bass cabinet is designed for home audio and puts out lower bass than the A7, but I'd bet most Klipsch at the same price range will out do it too.

[Wolfbane]

Between the size and the huge 'Altec Voice of the Theater' sticker on both speakers of a local pair the WAF is negative. Even for the garage.

[garyrc]

The A7 will lack bass compared to the Khorn as I believe the horn actually loads down somewhere around 150 Hz to 200 Hz and any lower response down to about 50 Hz is due to the bass-reflex porting

 

Even the biggest Voice of the Theater models (4 woofers) only spec down to 40 Hz (at least according to info on Cinerama), BUT they will respond and make sounds significantly below that.  I don't know if they are subject to what used to be called "doubling" (producing the harmonics of a deep bass instrumental sound, while hardly producing the fundamental). 

 

In the same vein, the old High Fidelity magazine tests of the Klipschorn and the Cormwall (December 1963), said that, in the case of the Klipschorn, "the bass extended smoothly to well below 30 cycles, with doubling occurring at about 20 to 23 cycles, depending on how hard the system is driven ... At lower amplifier power levels (perfectly feasible with this speaker because of its very high efficiency), the bass response actually went below 20 cps."  In 1963, "cycles" and "cps" meant what we moderns refer to as "Hz."    

 

My Klipschorns, pressed tightly into the corners of a 4260 cu.ft. room, will produce bass down to 24 Hz, with attenuation.

[Marvel]

For a while, I was looking at building a split Altec 210, It would look similar to an MWMs on end. I used to have a pic of a pair someone had split and finished in cherry veneer.

 

 

[Marvel]

The A210 was a pretty large cabinet.

 

[J M O N]

I think a lot of it is personal taste and preference.  Altec guys seem to prefer Altec over Klipsch and Klipsch guys prefer Klipsch over Altec.

[japosey]

Here is a nice write-up on the Valencias. These speakers were home versions of the A7 and precursors to the Model 19's

http://www.stereophile.com/content/listening-125#zeRqCoLAEXdVQRkJ.97

Edited March 1, 2016 by japosey

[JBryan]

Straight out of the box, the A7 and its kin have the better midrange than the Khorn with more detail and good dispersion and while the bass is loud, it doesn't go as low, isn't as fast and lacks the weight of the Khorn. While neither excels on the top end, the Khorn's tweeter does provide higher frequencies. That said, with slight to extensive modifications, both speakers can be made to sound excellent and of course, I'm bias but I've had both and think the Khorn's bass bin tips the scales in its favor. 

[JDJohnson]

.

Edited March 2, 2016 by soundbound