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Budget power for now


JAMINGRIZZ

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Hello everyone, I am Ben. I recently purchased a pair of vintage Belles and a pair of vintage Khorns. What would you think about running an 5.1 receiver@ 80w rms per channel to power the speakers? This would be a stop gap measure until I can round up the proper equipment. I have finally gotten the speakers I always wanted and they are just sitting there silent.

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Emo doesn't seem interested in getting into the integraded market, my guess is he's waiting on XPA Gen 3.

 

While it would be power unused, it'd still be dedicated power.  But what Ski Bum pointed out is true...80 watts is probably enough.  Those speakers can produce over 100 dB of acoustic power on 1 watt alone...so...

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I would actually encourage you to see about getting an XPA Gen 2.  I just saw one on the emo forums for $500.  So they can be had for a pretty reasonable amount.  You can use whatever AVR you have now as the pre for it too if it has pre-outs.  In the meantime, that 80 WPC will probably do you just fine.

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Emotiva's new XPA line will offer everything from two channel to 7 channel with easy add modules and 200 wpc each minimum.

 

Emotiva is actually coming out with a new integrated in the Emersa line as well. This was at the AXPONA release and has been posted in the Emotiva forum.

 

 

Emersa EPI-1 (MSRP: $799). An optional stereo integrated amplifier with digital audio inputs, the Emersa EPI-1 combines all of the features of the Emersa EPA-1 (including the slim chassis and optional digital input modules) with two channels of ICEpower Class-D power amplification delivering 100 watts RMS per channel.

 

 

 

Tim

Edited by teaman
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The XPA Gen 2 is one that I am considering with 4 channels. Have a shot at a McIntosh but it is a six channel amp. 

 

I own 4 XPA-2's right now and sold two more. Great amps with exceptional bang for the buck.

 

 

Tim

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The XPA Gen 2 is one that I am considering with 4 channels. Have a shot at a McIntosh but it is a six channel amp.

Just know that you'll be doing two XPA-2's or four XPA-1's. There's no XPA-4. Just want to be sure you're aware.

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http://www.ebay.com/itm/XPA-2-Power-Amplifier-/331838272684?hash=item4d431a34ac:g:x~sAAOSwDuJW15ZG

 

The Emotiva Ebay store has a Gen 2 XPA-2 right now with a one year warranty listed. They take pretty low ball offers so it may be worth a try if you can swing it now.

 

 

Tim

 

PS.....Michael, they soon will be offering a four channel XPA amp.

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I was always taught that an excess of wattage was a good thing to fill in the peaks. That and since some speakers are limited in frequency the extra wattage compensates for the lack of range. 

 

The "100 dB at 1 watt" that a earlier poster mentioned would be at a position fairly close to the speaker.   Klipschorns, in a corner, or in an artificial corner, have been measured at 105 dB at 1 Meter.  Some reviewers have measured with the Khorns out in a room without being pushed into a corner (pointless) or in an anechoic chamber.  These measurements hover around 98 dB at 1 watt at 1 Meter.  One well respected reviewer (Heyser) got 98 dB, but pointed out that they would be expected to produce 104 dB "in a room."  The only anechoic chamber that would be appropriate for Klipschorns would be one with a corner sitting in it, like Klipsch's revolving door anechoic at Hope.

 

You are correct in saying that, "an excess of wattage was a good thing to fill in the peaks."  As to your other point, reserve power won't create bass, but it may make it sound better, because the leading edge of peaks can be many times the average for loud passages.

 

30 x 40, and how high is the ceiling?   

 

How far from the speakers will you be sitting? 

 

30 x 40 with an 8 foot ceiling would be more than three times the size of the 3,000 cu ft room that PWK and Don Keele used to calculate estimated power needs.  In the 3K room, they say that 63 watts would provide 115 dB.  They don't specify listening position, but, in the past PWK had referred to 16 feet as "normal listening position."  I would guesstimate that in a greater than 9,000 cu. ft. room like yours the 63 watts would be about 4.5 db too low, so the amp power, for 115 dB (probably at about 16 feet) would need to be about 189 watts, or a little more.  Now, 115 dB is very, very loud.  PWK suggested that you "need 115 dB PEAKS at your ears" (somewhere in Dope from Hope).  But average power for loud music might be more like 105 dB, which for you, might mean more like 18.9 watts.  But, I like to have the continuous power available = the need at peaks, just to feel safe.  This is a quirk some Khorn owners have, because we can.  I'm happy with my 150 w.p.c. amps for my Klipschorns (the manufacturer rates them at 150 w.p.c. ... on the bench they are more like 120 w.p.c. RMS).  But I have a 4,000 + cu.ft. room, less than 1/2 the size of your room.  You might want 2x that, and if you have a high ceiling, you might conceivably want even more power.  High ceilings are favored for Khorns, although you have to have adequate reserve power.  It is possible to blow out a Khorn with too much power, but at an average, for very loud passages, of 105 dB, chugging along at about 20 watts, with very brief peaks much higher, you should be fine ... and you will have higher available SPL than with practically any other home speaker mated with a plausible power amp.  The Belles are just slightly less efficient.  The movie industry defines maximum power (full scale, or fs) as 105 dB max from each regular speaker, and 115 dB from a subwoofer.

Edited by garyrc
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Thanks, I have been keeping an eye on craigslist. That is how I came about my speakers, one owner, matching serial numbers, purchased in the first few hours of listing and had others waiting in the wings for them. Had cash and got a very good deal on them.

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Had to go back and measure room is 16' x 24' with an 8 foot ceiling. Listening position will be front center about 6' from khorns and 7' from belles. I used to compete in the crank it up contests  in car audio, was 3rd in the nation at one time.  Moved on to build systems in some of the clubs. I do not mind loud as long as it is clear and precise. Funny that I used 15'' JBL pro woofers and midranges and still have 6 Klipsch horn tweeters from the car system. Usually pretty casual listener but there are those times when you have to turn it up. 

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