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Moved into a old house with crawl space - suggestions?


TheFiend1

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Hey guys!

 

I just moved out of an apartment and into a rental house and am trying to get speaker placement and everything situated. I was wondering if I could get some suggestions.

 

First, some details:

Entire living room is about 15.5'W x 23'L x 8'H (dining area is behind couch)

Listening Distance: 11'

Listening Height: 38" (49" super deep couch forces you to sit low. Ears are about 3" off the back cushion :unsure:)

Setup is a 5.0 set of Klipsch RF7ii, RC64ii, & RS62ii. Looking into getting a Klipsch 12" sub or SVS PB2000 (or SB2000... cant decide :wacko:)

 

Acoustics - im concerned about this... The house is very old and has wood flooring with a crawl space underneath... not very ideal obviously, but I was wondering if there is anything I can do to improve the acoustics for when I get a subwoofer. I have an 8x10 area rug that I just purchased and put down, as well as some curtains, and that seemed to dampen the room a bit. I was thinking I should probably isolate the subwoofer off of the ground with either a subdude from Auralex or those SVS risers if I go with SVS. Is there any other suggestions?

 

Surround placement is kind of an issue at the moment... I attached a photo of where they are placed right now. The center of the surround speakers are about 85° from my MLP and the center of the speaker is about 58" high. Its also about 13" away from my front door and there is a switch plate in the way. The left surround doesn't have the same spacial problems but I placed it the same as the right surround. Should I leave them as is or move them?

 

Sorry for the dark photos.. its night time :ph34r::) Crude layout drawing is approximate. 

 

Thanks in advance!

Ryan

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Edited by TheFiend1
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Yup, you want the high frequency echoes to die down before the low frequency echoes. The curtains, area rug and sofa help with that.

 

As for the SVS subs the PB's are a bigger and ported. The SB's are small and sealed. Either would be good for TF2.  :)

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You went the right way with the rug. Your surrounds look perfectly placed to me for a 5.1 setup. Your center looks perfectly placed as well. If you don't want your mains in front of your windows then they are also good. If you don't mind them then spread them out a bit further. As for subs, skip the Klipsch and get the Svs pb-2000. You need the ported as the sb-2000 would not provide enough spl to keep up with your setup. Unless you never let loose. Which I doubt, you did buy Klipsch :)

Crawl space is good. Means your not on a slab. Which can be boring. Forget all the crap you read about isolating your sub. Order that Svs and try it out. I prefer my floor shaking. It's like getting buttkickers for free with your sub purchase. Some say oh well I isolated it and it stopped my dishes from rattling 40 feet away. Cool good for you. I'd find another way to get my dishes to stop rattling and enjoy the tactile like sensation my subwoofer gives me.

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I agree with Scrappy.  My basement is poured concrete.  My two subs are sitting idle in the garage.  I'm nervous that when I bring them in the whole system will still have less tactile "life" in it than when I had just the two Jubilee's upstairs.

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You went the right way with the rug. Your surrounds look perfectly placed to me for a 5.1 setup. Your center looks perfectly placed as well. If you don't want your mains in front of your windows then they are also good. If you don't mind them then spread them out a bit further. As for subs, skip the Klipsch and get the Svs pb-2000. You need the ported as the sb-2000 would not provide enough spl to keep up with your setup. Unless you never let loose. Which I doubt, you did buy Klipsch :)

 

That makes a lot of sense. SVS doesn't make it easy to find information on db output, which is intentional. My guess is they add mass to the woofer on the sealed to get those low frequency numbers. The cost of that is lower efficiency.

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Yup, you want the high frequency echoes to die down before the low frequency echoes. The curtains, area rug and sofa help with that.

 

As for the SVS subs the PB's are a bigger and ported. The SB's are small and sealed. Either would be good for TF2.   :)

 

Good to know! I plan on making some acoustic panels for the room as soon as I have the time. Putting 2 - 24"x48" panels behind the tv to start and then I'll have to figure out where to go from there. Im a little annoyed that the room is not the same on each side so it throws off the design a bit (OCD problems haha). I plan on getting a 10" SB for my computer setup which should indeed work quite nicely with TF2 :lol:

 

 

You need the ported as the sb-2000 would not provide enough spl to keep up with your setup. Unless you never let loose. Which I doubt, you did buy Klipsch :)

You guessed correctly! Why do you think I moved out of an apartment? :D Ported it is then. I really want to feel that impact when I watch movies. Just wish it was a bit smaller which is why I was also attracted to the SB. But if its not going to give me that impact then forget it. Id rather make the correct decision the first time and not second guess myself a year down the road. Unless im deciding to get a second one!

 

I was questioning the placement of the surrounds because both tweeters are either pointing behind me or in front of me and not directly - and since these are pretty directional surrounds I was thinking maybe It was going to sound 'off.' I guess the reason im worried about isolating the sub is to avoid the "boominess." I definitely like a good tactile response but if its at the cost of excess boominess id like to avoid it as best as possible.

Edited by TheFiend1
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Perhaps you could install 2 more speakers are rears, and then the ones on the sides would be side surrounds. IMO, directional speakers would be better for rears in your setup. Also, if you could move your sides back farther, it would help some.

 

If you put two subs, it would even out the response and reduce "boominess". It is important that you don't put the subs in the same place in the room and frankly, not on the same wall. Research the term "room modes". Perhaps the bottom right of the room and the top left of the room. If you are only going to use a single sub, then do a sub crawl.

 

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Boominess is a term usually only

Found in cheap sub. A pb-2000 isn't a cheap sub at all. Your looking at buying a very quality product. Your making the right choice. Go without isolators first. Bet you'll find you won't need them at all

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Boominess is a term usually only

Found in cheap sub. A pb-2000 isn't a cheap sub at all. Your looking at buying a very quality product. Your making the right choice. Go without isolators first. Bet you'll find you won't need them at all

No doubt about it, that is a good sub. I always thought boominess was a result of poor sub positioning when you were using a single sub.

 

For the OP: If a sub happens to be positioned in such a way that when sitting in the main listening position you have an strong axial or even a tangential peak of a certain frequency at that position it sounds boomy. To prove it, you can move a few feet in any direction and the boom will go away. This is why the sub crawl is so good. Although these peaks can be calculated and measured, there is nothing better than one's own ears to find what sounds good.

Edited by mustang guy
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You went the right way with the rug. Your surrounds look perfectly placed to me for a 5.1 setup. Your center looks perfectly placed as well. If you don't want your mains in front of your windows then they are also good. If you don't mind them then spread them out a bit further. As for subs, skip the Klipsch and get the Svs pb-2000. You need the ported as the sb-2000 would not provide enough spl to keep up with your setup. Unless you never let loose. Which I doubt, you did buy Klipsch :)

Crawl space is good. Means your not on a slab. Which can be boring. Forget all the crap you read about isolating your sub. Order that Svs and try it out. I prefer my floor shaking. It's like getting buttkickers for free with your sub purchase. Some say oh well I isolated it and it stopped my dishes from rattling 40 feet away. Cool good for you. I'd find another way to get my dishes to stop rattling and enjoy the tactile like sensation my subwoofer gives me.

Slightly OT: Crawl spaces are cool because speaker cable can be installed under floor.

tc

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Boominess is a term usually only

Found in cheap sub.

Or a Cornwall...
sounds like a placement issue there. My Cornwalls have great bass. Nothing boomy about them. Of course I don't have them in corners like reccomended to get the deepest notes from them.
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There is a trick for subs.     Put the sub where you sit and then go looking for the best spot in the room.    That spot becomes your spot for the sub.     Also I had my surrounds right where yours are.   When I moved them forward that wall of sound from the TV improved along with the stereo effect.   A bit less surround but a lot more stereo and my ears like that wall of sound effect.    I little trial and error experimenting on your part is the best way to go.    Let your ears be the judge.

 

:)

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There is a trick for subs. Put the sub where you sit and then go looking for the best spot in the room. That spot becomes your spot for the sub. Also I had my surrounds right where yours are. When I moved them forward that wall of sound from the TV improved along with the stereo effect. A bit less surround but a lot more stereo and my ears like that wall of sound effect. I little trial and error experimenting on your part is the best way to go. Let your ears be the judge.

:)

holy cow change your font. Can't read any of it hardly on my phone.
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Boominess is a term usually only

Found in cheap sub.

Or a Cornwall...
sounds like a placement issue there. My Cornwalls have great bass. Nothing boomy about them. Of course I don't have them in corners like reccomended to get the deepest notes from them.

 

 

It was at Klipsch HQ in Indy... I guess I just prefer horn loaded bass over direct radiators, but I didn't like it when I heard it, and I'm not the only one. Even the Klipsch personnel weren't happy with it and thought someone messed with the room eq.

 

Bruce

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There is a trick for subs.     Put the sub where you sit and then go looking for the best spot in the room.    That spot becomes your spot for the sub.     Also I had my surrounds right where yours are.   When I moved them forward that wall of sound from the TV improved along with the stereo effect.   A bit less surround but a lot more stereo and my ears like that wall of sound effect.    I little trial and error experimenting on your part is the best way to go.    Let your ears be the judge.

 

:)

You have just explained the sub crawl and I agree completely. See post 10 above.

Edited by mustang guy
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