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Sub, Hersey I's and two channel


vtpalmer

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I have a two channel Denon for my Denon turntable and CD player in my office. I currently have the RSW-12 Sub connected to speaker channel B. Because the amp doesn't have a sub out. I've set the crossover on the sub to 60hz. But I'm having a hard time getting a smooth transition from speakers to the sub. The sub sounds either too loud, too soft or too boomy. Any ideas?

Terry

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I have a two channel Denon for my Denon turntable and CD player in my office. I currently have the RSW-12 Sub connected to speaker channel B. Because the amp doesn't have a sub out. I've set the crossover on the sub to 60hz. But I'm having a hard time getting a smooth transition from speakers to the sub. The sub sounds either too loud, too soft or too boomy. Any ideas?

Terry

 

With your Denon amp not having a sub preout or stereo preouts, it is going to be tough to incorporate a subwoofer into the mix.

 

I owned many Denon integrated amps(PMA's) and was very pleased how they sounded with my Heresys, Quartets, and forte's but unless it was a near flagship model, without preouts I could not add a subwoofer.

 

Is your heart dead set on the Denon amp or could/would you consider another amp(Denon or ???) that does have preouts?

 

Bill

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What type of inputs does this sub have?  If it high level in and high level out,  I would run my speaker wires from speakers selector A to the high level input of the sub.  Then from the high level outputs of your sub to your main.  Trying crossing over a bit higher as well.  If you are able to do this, then next I would do the sub crawl.  Place the sub in your sitting area and crawl around until you hear feel the best bass.  That is about where you will want to put your sub.  Hope this helps.

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With my Heresy 3's, I've had two different powered subs connected via line-level pre-outs and I crossed them around 50hz or so.  I have to turn up the subs reasonably high (11-2 o'clock) to get good bass at the same level with the H3's.

 

A couple weeks ago, I did try connecting my powered sub via speaker-level connections to my La Scala 2's.  The problem I had was the LS2's are so sensitive that they would be playing loud buy I couldn't crank up the sub loud enough to match - very finicky.  This might be part of the problem you are having with the Heresy's and those speaker-level connections.

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Tape monitor out is a fixed line level out.  This shouldn't be used for a sub.

 

You can hook the speaker wires to either speaker A or B out.  The impedance of the sub, since it is powered, is so high it won't have any affect on the amp.  This is actually what many consider the best way to hook up a sub to have the exact same signal the speakers are getting.  REL does this type of connection. 

 

I'd imagine that you may have to work on placement/crossover to blend the sub.  The connection shouldn't be the issue.

 

EDIT: Is this the RSW-12 you have connected? Those do not have speaker cable inputs...

Edited by Grizzog
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I appreciate everyone's input. The RSW-12 has speaker wire inputs but no outputs. So it would be OK to run from my amp to the sub, then from the same connections run to the speakers?

 

Yes but it will be the same as what you have now.  I was ASSUMING (my bad) that you had speaker level "in" AND "out" on your sub amp.

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It looks like Heresies have a -3 dB point (assuming full space) of about 45-50 Hz.  Try running the crossover point down to 40 Hz, then you shouldn't get an in-room  hump in response from 40-80 Hz ("boom boom boom"). 

 

This is exactly the type of situation where using REW (Room EQ Wizard...freeware) and a laptop computer microphone will give you a much better visual on what's going on.

 

Chris

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I do this on a vintage amp (Pioneer SA7700) with a RW10, through speaker A hook up. And a Set of Vienna Acoustics (sorry) Bach Grands through the B channel. The Pioneer allows for A, B, or A+B to be used. Sounds is excellent and no blending issues.

That said, depending on what I'm playing, I might bump the sub volume in either direction based on the source material. Good example is some of the Flight of the Conchords stuff (#sorrynotsorry), which covers a different genre per song....but getting it right is worth getting off the couch for a tweak.

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If you have pre-outs, I would look to cross the sub a bit lower as Chris stated.  You could have a room mode or something that occurs at the overlap or the crossover overlap makes a large bump that will be hard to compensate for because when you lower it to remove the bump, everything under that bump will be too low on the sub-woofer.  A good frequency sweep will help.

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Sub placement and listening position is everything. You need to make the sub work in the room you are using it in. Lot's of people have sub problems all the time because of this. Once you find a placement that works, then mess with the low pass filter on the sub. 

 

Do you have a picture of the arrangement of the speakers and the sub in the room? Are the Heresy's on the floor or have you uncoupled them?

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