Orange Peel Posted September 5, 2002 Share Posted September 5, 2002 Bernard - Sorry to hear this man, there's plenty of good people here to outweigh the bad, so don't lose faith. Skonopa - I agree with you on the good people here! Wes and I have talked over the phone many times, he has kept me updated to the second as to what UPS is doing, and I have done the same. UPS has agreed to pay us for the speaker. Wes insured the RF-3's for $240 a piece, and UPS is giving us $300 plus the shipping charges. They haven't asked for the speaker back either, so that's a double bonus! The check is in the mail to Wes from UPS, and once he get's it he will be sending it to me. So this whole thing has turned out well, Wes is a GREAT guy, I would buy something from him again in a heartbeat. None of this was his fault, all UPS, he packed those speakers like crazy, it's hard to believe that they got damaged, UPS must really beat stuff up. This board is wonderful, I've never learned so much about HT in my life, and without this board, I would be missing out big time! Thanks guys! ------------------ Scottc>s> Goldsmithc>s> Home Theatre:s> Klipsch RF-3's (Front Mains)c> Klipsch RC-3 (Center)c> Klipsch RS-3's (Rear Surrounds)c> Polk Audio PSW650 subc> Harman Kardon AVR-125c> Mitsubishi 60" Big Screen VS-60609c> Sony DVD DVP-S530Dc> Sony VCR SLV-N77c> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CatManFever Posted September 5, 2002 Share Posted September 5, 2002 I also bought a speaker on Ebay. A Klipsch Forte and the guy shipped it to me via UPS. It arrived DAMAGED, with a broken 9 lb woofer rattling all over inside and a corner of it SMASHED in! BUT the funny thing was there was no damage to the speaker box it came in!!! Well, the guy I bought it from swears it was in perfect condition when he packed it, but he was real good about it and refunded me every penny! I talked to another guy who used to work for UPS and he said these guys are real ROUGH on stuff. And he gave me a demonstration of how it could of been dropped without damaging the box. BUT that still doesn't explained how the corner got smashed in! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skonopa Posted September 5, 2002 Share Posted September 5, 2002 Orange Peel said: UPS has agreed to pay us for the speaker. Wes insured the RF-3's for $240 a piece, and UPS is giving us $300 plus the shipping charges. They haven't asked for the speaker back either, so that's a double bonus! The check is in the mail to Wes from UPS, and once he get's it he will be sending it to me. Excellent! Glad to hear you guys got it resolved! Also glad you were able to get some serious Klipsch goodness at a decent price. I did see your pics and I will say you got yourself a nice little setup there. I also saw/heard you also scored yourself a set of RS-3s to complete the package. ------------------ Steven Konopa Fredericksburg, VA Denon AVR3802 (Receiver) RF-7 (Fronts) RC-7 (Center) RC-7 (Rear) RS-7 (A Surrounds) Infinity RS2000.5 (B Surrounds - recycled) REL Storm III (Subwoofer 1) Yamaha YST-SW40 (Subwoofer 2 - Recycled) JVC XV-S65GD (DVD) Sharp DX-200 (CD - ancient) RCA DWD490RE (DirecTV/Ultimate TV receiver) Sharp 32 inch (TV) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
myram Posted September 5, 2002 Share Posted September 5, 2002 Well I guess it is time for my side of the story, since Ivan has taken advantage of his side already and rallied the troops against me. The speaker was wrapped in 3 layers of bubble wrap all around it. It was then placed in a thick cardboard box, and taped up very well. It was shipped on January 31, 2002 with $700 worth of insurance on it at a total cost of $175.60.....reciept is sitting in front of me. Ivan contacted me and sent me pictures of the speaker with 7 of 8 corners broken on it and asked for my help. I went to my post office and filed the insurance claim on Feb. 14, 2002. My local post office informed me it would take some time since it was an international shipment, and the Australian Post Office would need to confirm the damage and work with the USPS for this claim to go thru. So I filled out all the paperwork and he sent it on it's way, and I checked the box to have them send the insurance money to Ivan and told him to keep the speaker and do whatever he wanted with it. Time went by, and I never heard anything about it. Then Ivan called me saying he had never recieved any money and if I knew what was going on. I said I had assumed that the money had been sent to him and that the claim was a done deal. I told him I would contact the USPS and try to find out what was going on. I called the 1-800 numbers listed on the claim forms and they were of little help, so it was back to the post office to see what they could find out. The post office said they would look into it and get back to me....and again he said this could take time since it is an international shipment. All this time Ivan is calling daily at all hours of the day and night, and repeatedly I told him I was working on it and I would let him know as soon as I found anything out. The call intercept wasn't put on the line to keep Ivan from calling me.....it was done to stop telemarketers from getting thru to us. It plays a rejection message anytime a private or anonymous number calls....Ivan's apparently is one of those two since none of his calls have been getting thru. The last info I had from the USPS is that the Australian PS hadn't gotten in contact with the USPS about the damage and the claim was considered dead. I was going to refile the claim, but was informed that I couldn't since I already had filed one before......this is all from the local post office. In my opinion, I believe the speaker was damaged in customs. I am assuming they removed the speaker to examine it, and when they repackaged it they didn't do such a great job. I have done everything I could do in this situation, the USPS is a painintheass to deal with and they give you the complete runaround every chance they can. That is my side of the story.....think of it as you will. At this point, I could care less what any of you think of me....and I will no longer be posting to this board since I am already considered guilty by everyone of you....even ones that I have dealt with favorably in the past. Steve Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Audio Flynn Posted September 5, 2002 Share Posted September 5, 2002 Let this be a lesson to all. Commercial carriers only!s> Even UPS ans FEDEX are a little scary on items larger than a pouch of 1 kilo. DHL and others that specialize in international are the best bet. Sharing in a % of Ivans financial pain would be the gentlemannly response. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skonopa Posted September 5, 2002 Share Posted September 5, 2002 myram said: That is my side of the story.....think of it as you will. At this point, I could care less what any of you think of me....and I will no longer be posting to this board since I am already considered guilty by everyone of you....even ones that I have dealt with favorably in the past. I'll be first to apologize. I may have jumped the gun and deamed you guilty before allowing you to tell your side of the story. It is a shame this had to happen though. Dealing with the USPS and such can be a pain in the ***. I hope that ProMedia control pod I just sent up to Canada gets there in one piece and working order. I guess the only other option I could think of is try to get a hold of your local Post Master. If that does not work, go up the chain of command. Hell, talk to the Post Master General if you have to. ------------------ Steven Konopa Fredericksburg, VA Denon AVR3802 (Receiver) RF-7 (Fronts) RC-7 (Center) RC-7 (Rear) RS-7 (A Surrounds) Infinity RS2000.5 (B Surrounds - recycled) REL Storm III (Subwoofer 1) Yamaha YST-SW40 (Subwoofer 2 - Recycled) JVC XV-S65GD (DVD) Sharp DX-200 (CD - ancient) RCA DWD490RE (DirecTV/Ultimate TV receiver) Sharp 32 inch (TV) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Orange Peel Posted September 5, 2002 Share Posted September 5, 2002 Skonopa - quote: Excellent! Glad to hear you guys got it resolved! Also glad you were able to get some serious Klipsch goodness at a decent price. I did see your pics and I will say you got yourself a nice little setup there. I also saw/heard you also scored yourself a set of RS-3s to complete the package. Thanks!! My setup isn't finished, is it ever really? I should be getting my HK AVR 520 tomorrow, and then later on, maybe a few months, I will be adding another set of RF-3's for side surrounds. So that would make me a RF-3 fronts, RC-3 center, RS-3 surrounds and RF-3 sides, should be a nice 7.1 setup I hope. I did get some RS-3's from jtkinney on this board, and they are excellent, I'm still messing with the settings, placement, etc. I want to get the best sound out of them, but it's pretty hard to get them setup right, practice makes perfect I guess I still need to get a SPL meter to get it perfect. I can't stand how addicting this stuff is, I'm still DYING for a SVS sub, probably the PCi 16-46, but we'll see, for now my Polk Audio PSW650 is belting out the lows just fine ------------------ Scottc>s> Goldsmithc>s> Home Theatre:s> Klipsch RF-3's (Front Mains)c> Klipsch RC-3 (Center)c> Klipsch RS-3's (Rear Surrounds)c> Polk Audio PSW650 subc> Harman Kardon AVR-125c> Mitsubishi 60" Big Screen VS-60609c> Sony DVD DVP-S530Dc> Sony VCR SLV-N77c> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheEAR Posted September 5, 2002 Share Posted September 5, 2002 Jumping to conclusions,very very smart. Lets just burn the sender because of some customs bastards. A few times when I ordered from the States from mail order stores.I ordered several heatsinks(Alpha and Swiftech)and VideoLogic speakers, a few items arrived damaged...repacked!The box looked open and taped back and the product was repacked with almost hating care. Some customs agents are plain dogs.No respect for what does not belong to them. I am glad to see some jumped to a fast and furious conclusion.Just shows who is who Before burning someone learn to listen and think Ignorants TheEAR(s) Now theears Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
erdric Posted September 5, 2002 Share Posted September 5, 2002 I am one of the people that has had favorable dealings with Steve. I was very pleased with the KV-3 transaction. I even defended him in that Academy thread. This is why I was very surprised to hear about this from Ivan. Steve, Ivan contacted me months ago about this because he found my posts about the KV-3. At that time I emailed you to find out your side of the story before I replied to Ivan. No response. I emailed you again about giving Ivan your phone number and said I would if I didn't hear from you. No response. Ivan found the number on his own so it didn't matter anyway. I backed out of the situation at that point because I didn't want to get involved. I believe I explained my reluctance to get involved in my orignal email to you. Either you didn't get it or you ignored it. I didn't get a non-deliverable message so I can only assume it went through. I have no way of knowing. So, on one hand I'm getting emails and photos from Ivan and silence from you. I can certainly understand if you have the viewpoint that I shouldn't have been involved in the first place. I agree completely but Ivan seemed sincere and I always try to help out other BB members when I can. I gave him advice to follow up the insurance claim himself. When he did he was told there was no insurance on the package and subsequently no claim. Your side of the story seems to be a very likely scenario and I have no reason not to believe it but I still don't understand why you stopped answering emails. All you had to do was either keep updating Ivan or send him the info for him to follow up on his own. Can you understand how that looks? It wasn't just me that came to that conclusion so I don't think I was way out of line, especially since I tried to contact you about it and found silence. FWIW, Ivan emailed me 2 weeks ago with this recent info and was asking me about initiating legal proceedings and/or police involvement with you. I talked him out of that. I imagine sending a package to Ivan with all of the paperwork you have would allow him to deal with this himself. I apologize if I misrepresented you in any way. I do wish you had gotten back to me so I could have backed completely out of this. Even a "stay out of it" email would have been enough. It's not like we hadn't exchanged email in the past. I feel bad for all the flames you're getting here but I also feel really bad for Ivan. He's out $600, regardless of whose fault it is. This message has been edited by erdric on 09-06-2002 at 10:01 PM Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boa12 Posted September 5, 2002 Share Posted September 5, 2002 hey ears. hope you're not talking to me. 1st he charges 50% over fair market then doesn't have the decency to keep in touch w/ the buyer on resolving the problem. & it seems highly suspect that insurance was ever bought. judgement to bernard for US$300. so says judge boa wapner. ------------------ My Home Systems Page Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
erdric Posted September 5, 2002 Share Posted September 5, 2002 >>Lets just burn the sender because of some customs bastards... Before burning someone learn to listen and think Ignorants << First, Steve GUESSED it was customs, he doesn't know. Second, you don't know the whole story so don't sit there and suggest all of us aren't thinking. That comment could easily turn back on you, couldn't it? I happen to know a lot about this situation and frankly, you don't. Just because you have a bad opinion about customs doesn't mean it's always customs. Maybe the USPS just dropped it a couple of times. Bubble wrap can only do so much and not a hell of a lot at the corners, which is exactly where the damage is. Would you like to see the pictures, I have them? Who the hell are you to call me or anyone else 'ignorants'? You seem to be guilty of jumping in without thinking as well. Why don't you quit with the condescending attitude and wait until you have some facts to go on as opposed to a guess of what happened half way around the world in some airport or point of entry? Steve is the one getting hammered and he responded intelligently and in an unemotional way. Too bad you couldn't keep to the same standard. I can't wait for your response. This message has been edited by erdric on 09-05-2002 at 11:53 PM Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HornEd Posted September 6, 2002 Share Posted September 6, 2002 Jumping to the conclusion that the Customs Officials are to blame doesn't seem to be the answer to this cunundrum. It is good to see Myram step up to the plate and take his cut. But it does not do him credit to bail from the Forum with so few Forum members making a comment. It would seem that if there was, indeed, insurance and there was, indeed, damage... that our Aussie Forum Friend would be duly compensated. Why would anyone spend the money to make that many long distance calls from Australia if he hadn't received less than he had paid for. My take is that the damage was real. The question becomes was there insurance... and why did it not resolve the issue. If insurance was purchased, one of the hazards insured against is careless customs officials. Usually, insurance pays the one who bought it... not the poor recipient who sent the money for the item to the sender. The sender did not deny he received money for the speaker. If the package was insured, why wasn't the recipient contacted to offer up proof of the damage? Sorry, Myram, but hearing your side of the story still puts your actions in question to this impartial observer. On this Forum, I think we owe an extra effort to one another to make our transactions fair to all concerned. Clearly, this is not what happened in this instance. -HornED Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike Lindsey Posted September 6, 2002 Share Posted September 6, 2002 Well, I guess I'm one of the people that lambasted Steve here and feel an apology is in order, since I jumped the gun before hearing his side of the story. However, I still feel this could have been resolved in a much better way. I'm not familiar with the Customs laws or shipping overseas, so I can't comment there. But, I think a prime example of how this could have been handled is the shipping exchange between Wes and Orange Peel. Communication is the key. Both being members of this board, I would expect nothing less. I guess my biggest gripe is all the oddball deals Steve is always trying to make on this BB. That and the fact that most of his posts revolve around buying and selling. There is certainly nothing wrong with that, however... Hey Ears, why don't you take your attitude to www.hometheaterforum. You'll fit right in there... Mike Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chickey Posted September 6, 2002 Share Posted September 6, 2002 Ignorants? I think not. Bernard, it appears, tried his best to contact Myram and resolve the situation amicably. When the lines of communication broke down, Bernard shared his plight publicly. I do not believe there was a summary rush to judgment. Rather, we saw the forum members indignant that one of our own apparently betrayed another, and a virtual community insisting on answers. It is interesting to observe that Myram ignored Bernards requests and Erdrics inquiries on his behalf, and chose only to respond once we as a group rallied to the cause of justice. And Ill hand it to Myram, he finally came back with a detailed response (and a grand adieu). That being said, I think HornEd has it right we hold each to a higher standard here than might be expected in other venues. Myram presented his argument, but I have a hard time believing he would have been satisfied with the outcome should the situation have been reversed. I have no doubt Myram attempted to resolve the situation on several occasions. Upon meeting resistance, however, he probably figured that Bernard wasnt about to book a round trip from Australia to Maine to collect his $600, so he quietly let the situation whither on the vine. Thats simply not acceptable, no matter who is at fault. I think Judge Boa has it right. At the very least, Myram should offer Bernard half his money back, while the two mutually pursue the insurance claim. Short of that, I think others will exercise discretion (ala Convict) next time Myram comes hunting for a good deal. As Dennis Miller says, thats just my opinion, I could be wrong. C ------------------ My System This message has been edited by chickey on 09-06-2002 at 08:44 AM Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bernard Posted September 6, 2002 Author Share Posted September 6, 2002 So what will happen now Steve seeing this is the only way I can contact you as you are not answering my calls or emails. I have given Steve alot of time to sort this out and this was my last resort to end this. Its coming up to 7 months since he says he made the insurance claim and I don't think they are that slack. Ivan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maxg Posted September 6, 2002 Share Posted September 6, 2002 Any business transaction, with the best will in the world from both sides can go horribly wrong. When that transaction is carried out over the internet there is simply more scope for this to happen. When you further add in shipments between countries, irresponsible couriers, derranged customs officials, airport baggage handlers, security scares from one side of the globe to another, packaging mishaps, inadequate insurance with complex claiming procedures and a bunch of unnamed third parties you have a recipe for disaster. Frankly it amazes me that I get my goods when I buy. So far I have been lucky - but this will certainly put me off buying high value items over the net. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skonopa Posted September 6, 2002 Share Posted September 6, 2002 And it is situations like this that is why I bought my high priced gear from a local dealer. Yes, I had to pay more than I would have if I bought on-line, but the fact that if any problems arose (and they have), the dealer is right there, less than 2 miles from my place. The service I have gotten there has been exceptional. ------------------ Steven Konopa Fredericksburg, VA Denon AVR3802 (Receiver) RF-7 (Fronts) RC-7 (Center) RC-7 (Rear) RS-7 (A Surrounds) Infinity RS2000.5 (B Surrounds - recycled) REL Storm III (Subwoofer 1) Yamaha YST-SW40 (Subwoofer 2 - Recycled) JVC XV-S65GD (DVD) Sharp DX-200 (CD - ancient) RCA DWD490RE (DirecTV/Ultimate TV receiver) Sharp 32 inch (TV) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flason Posted September 6, 2002 Share Posted September 6, 2002 It is true that we should wait to hear both sides of the story before casting judgment, however, my post was informational and not judgmental. If it appeared to be the latter, for that I am sorry. You do have valid points, myram, but blocking calls seemed suspicious to me. Explained, it seems reasonable. Not posting anymore on the forum appears to be a knee jerk reaction. I think all members of this forum have value. In the great scheme of things, the sun will still rise tomorrow on the Klipsch forum if you no longer post. But life is still better to live when you have friends than to be alone. And like it or not, in a loosely connected internet type of way, we are all friends here. This message has been edited by Flason on 09-06-2002 at 12:56 PM Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
edwardre Posted September 6, 2002 Share Posted September 6, 2002 He said she said, I did this, I did that, this side of the story, that side of the story all points to one thing.....stories. The way one should conduct oneself in ANY business transaction is that it is the province of the SELLER to ensure that the item arrives whole and as described unless specifically stipulated upfront that the seller holds no liability and both parties agree. It is the province of the BUYER to ensure that the funds arrive in full, within an appropriate timeframe. This is basic accountability and ownership towards the foundation of any legitimate business deal, one's WORD. In this case, the bottom line is that Bernard has upheld his side of the business deal and myram has not. By agreeing to and following through with this deal, you gave your WORD Steve that Bernard would receive an Acadamy speaker in whatever condition originally agreed upon. HE DID NOT. Therefore it is YOUR RESPONSIBILITY to refund his money. To do anything less means your word holds zero value. Regardless of who damaged the item...customs, USPS, or what you regard as appropriate packaging, or what steps you've claimed you've taken to resolve the issue, fact is that Bernard upheld his responsibility as a buyer and you, as the seller, have not. So yes, tally me up as one of those who have indicted myram. Something happened BEFORE Bernard took possession of the Acadamy therefore ownership belongs to Steve. Keeping Bernards money quite frankly equates to theft. Prattling on about how "I did this, I did that, now it's a dead claim" is really a cheap deflectionary tactic to sway our thoughts away from the real issue.....that Steve has not taken responsibility and has thus exposed himself as lacking both character and integrity. ------------------ Ed Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cluless Posted September 6, 2002 Share Posted September 6, 2002 Well put edware! Especially since the buyer has absolutely no recourse. Myram - pony up the bucks! That should motivate you to pursue the insurance claim. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.