Plywood

[dirtmudd]

What plywood sizes did klipsch use..  Standard 4x8 or 5x12 ?

[HDBRbuilder]

From 1976 thru 1983 and later, 4x8 for the 3/4" panels...five inner plys with a thinner outer birch veneer on each side=7  plys total...normally Georgia Pacific was the supplier, and what they shipped was supposed to meet the requirements the company stated in the contract.

 

We also used Baltic birch in approximately 3/4" thickness (11 plys) and also approximately 1/2" thickness, (9 plys), and it was received in various panel dimensions...keep in mind that the vast majority of the Baltic birch was used for K-horn parts in sub-assemblies, for network boards, and such.  The Baltic birch was received from more than one supplier, and if the price was right, the company would buy a large volume of it in odd larger-than-norm panels, since it was always sawn into smaller panels anyway.

 

The fine veneered panels were poplar lumber-core plywood custom-matched panels which came in matched pairs.  Each panel was edge-veneered on the long-side edges, and were ripped to two matched panels for pairs for the mitered speaker cabinets (Heresy, Cornwall, etc).  Due to the Belle assembly requirements, complete matched pair panels were received, with the same thing happening for K-horns.  Most often Georgia-Pacific was also the supplier for these.   

[onemoretime]

When did Klipsch move from plywood to MDF construction for the Heritage series?

[HDBRbuilder]

9 hours ago, onemoretime said:

When did Klipsch move from plywood to MDF construction for the Heritage series?

The Klipschorn is only PARTLY MDF...the bass bin front panel and the two trapezoidal HF panels are MDF...and the rear enclosure panels are MDF (if it has the rear enclosed!)  MDF is used based solely upon its consistent density and the sonic qualities that entails. The advent of the Heresy II is what brought about the MDF in the Heresy cabinets.  The Cornwall followed suit.  The Klipschorn followed a few years later with its veneered panels.  The current LaScala version was a re-design to be made with mostly veneered MDF panels.  So, it all started in the original Heritage line in the latter half of the 1980's...but it took a number of years before its current use in all of those models was finalized.

 

Other speakers that Klipsch came out with beginning in the 1980's incorporated MDF construction into them as part of their design, although not ALL of those speakers used JUST MDF in their construction.

[dirtmudd]

1 hour ago, HDBRbuilder said:

The Klipschorn is only PARTLY MDF...the bass bin front panel and the two trapezoidal HF panels are MDF...and the rear enclosure panels are MDF (if it has the rear enclosed!)  MDF is used based solely upon its consistent density and the sonic qualities that entails. The advent of the Heresy II is what brought about the MDF in the Heresy cabinets.  The Cornwall followed suit.  The Klipschorn followed a few years later with its veneered panels.  The current LaScala version was a re-design to be made with mostly veneered MDF panels.  So, it all started in the original Heritage line in the latter half of the 1980's...but it took a number of years before its current use in all of those models was finalized.

 

Other speakers that Klipsch came out with beginning in the 1980's incorporated MDF construction into them as part of their design, although not ALL of those speakers used JUST MDF in their construction.

 

On 9/23/2016 at 6:26 PM, HDBRbuilder said:

From 1976 thru 1983 and later, 4x8 for the 3/4" panels...five inner plys with a thinner outer birch veneer on each side=7  plys total...normally Georgia Pacific was the supplier, and what they shipped was supposed to meet the requirements the company stated in the contract.

 

We also used Baltic birch in approximately 3/4" thickness (11 plys) and also approximately 1/2" thickness, (9 plys), and it was received in various panel dimensions...keep in mind that the vast majority of the Baltic birch was used for K-horn parts in sub-assemblies, for network boards, and such.  The Baltic birch was received from more than one supplier, and if the price was right, the company would buy a large volume of it in odd larger-than-norm panels, since it was always sawn into smaller panels anyway.

 

The fine veneered panels were poplar lumber-core plywood custom-matched panels which came in matched pairs.  Each panel was edge-veneered on the long-side edges, and were ripped to two matched panels for pairs for the mitered speaker cabinets (Heresy, Cornwall, etc).  Due to the Belle assembly requirements, complete matched pair panels were received, with the same thing happening for K-horns.  Most often Georgia-Pacific was also the supplier for these.   

How much material or plywood went to make the Klipschorn ?

[HDBRbuilder]

1 hour ago, dirtmudd said:

 

How much material or plywood went to make the Klipschorn ?

Easiest way to answer that question is for you to look up the plans and do the math.  The K-horn has numerous cuts and sub-assemblies, and varying material used.  So, just look up the plans and figure out all the dimensions and do the math for each type of wood used.  In doing so, you must remember that the cut lists were often for more than one assembly per sheet of material.  So, in order to figure out what material, the thickness used, and the other factors, it is MOST feasible to take a set of plans for one K-horn and do the math.  WARNING:  It has VERY MANY PARTS!

[WMcD]

The SK plans show their bass bin, just one, just the bass bin, uses two sheets of 4 x 8 plywood.  There is not a lot left over.  This is just to give you an idea of the real estate involved without going into the veneered pieces.

 

I'm sure that the factory will have planned on some batches of K-Horns and have their own layouts for cutting to minimize waste and making the cuts which require the most accuracy. 

 

The jigs Hope uses are probably top, top secret!  We see pictures sometimes of K-Horns being assembled but not the cutting process.

 

WMcD

 

 

[HDBRbuilder]

15 hours ago, WMcD said:

The SK plans show their bass bin, just one, just the bass bin, uses two sheets of 4 x 8 plywood.  There is not a lot left over.  This is just to give you an idea of the real estate involved without going into the veneered pieces.

 

I'm sure that the factory will have planned on some batches of K-Horns and have their own layouts for cutting to minimize waste and making the cuts which require the most accuracy.

 

The jigs Hope uses are probably top, top secret!  We see pictures sometimes of K-Horns being assembled but not the cutting process.

 

WMcD

 

 

It is all CNC now-a-days at the plant...jigs are a thing of the past.

[WMcD]

On ‎10‎/‎4‎/‎2016 at 10:16 AM, HDBRbuilder said:

It is all CNC now-a-days at the plant...jigs are a thing of the past.

I feel rather sheepish about making a statement about jigs.

 

It arose from a rather romantic notion that K-Horn parts were cut in a secret room, at the dark of the moon, by one of the adept sworn to secrecy. 

 

Of course the photos from the recent pilgrimage show at least some parts of the K-Horn which are obviously CNC.

 

Excuse me.

 

WMcD

[HDBRbuilder]

On Tuesday, October 11, 2016 at 7:00 PM, WMcD said:

I feel rather sheepish about making a statement about jigs.

 

It arose from a rather romantic notion that K-Horn parts were cut in a secret room, at the dark of the moon, by one of the adept sworn to secrecy.

 

Of course the photos from the recent pilgrimage show at least some parts of the K-Horn which are obviously CNC.

 

Excuse me.

 

WMcD

OK, now...I have a guilt trip syndrome...ha! Back in my day, many K-horn parts were cut on jigs which were either sleds themselves, or attached to sleds...with those sleds being used on a standard Delta Unisaw for the cutting of the materials.  Then the sub-assemblies were built up, and stacked on pallets nearby the K-horn assembly tables.  While, over in LaScala-land, the builders would knock out the doghouse assemblies before quitting time, so that they would be ready for final assembly into completed LaScala cabinets the next day.  I found that I could make a better LaScala doghouse than what we made back in those days by designing a "glue up and clamp" jig to make the "roof " portion in, then waiting until the next day to finish up the doghouse assemblies, using no fasteners in the "roof" portion of the assembly, thus no nail holes showing in the "roof" part.  It is not labor-cost effective, but it makes for a nicer aesthetically-pleasing doghouse...especially if the "roof" is to be a veneer book-match of parts.

[Thaddeus Smith]

On 10/11/2016 at 7:00 PM, WMcD said:

I feel rather sheepish about making a statement about jigs.

 

 

They still use jigs for some of the assembly

 

[HDBRbuilder]

On Monday, October 24, 2016 at 9:09 PM, Thaddeus Smith said:

 

They still use jigs for some of the assembly

 

Some assembly guides are used, but no jigs for cutting/routing are used now that CNC is doing it.  The most complex jig I ever made for LaScala parts was for the use of a 10" (NOT COMPOUND!) miter saw in making the long bevel cut for the wing assembly parts when I was building the LaScalas a few years back.  It had to really be precise so that those long bevels would line up perfectly for the wing assemblies to mount perfectly to the rear panel and the woofer motorboard of the doghouse  Two of those assemblies are used to make the first flare(s) of the bass horn at the back of the LaScala Bass bin, with the splitter between the short bevel joints of each wing assembly (on the rear panel of the cabinet).  That is the point either side of the splitter where the bass horn lens becomes bifurcated.  The splitter is the centerline of the bifurcated bass horn lens.  Back in the day the splitter was cut flat at each end with a bit of "slop" to allow for variances in its fitting...for speed/ease of assembly of the doghouse to the rear panel incorporating the wing assemblies.  But I wanted the splitter "V"-notched at each end so that no gaps were there and it was a relatively tight fit between the two wing assemblies in order to improve the soundpathway of the bass horn lens.  Whether it really made any MEASURABLE improvement or not, is beyond me, since I never had the speakers tested to see if it made any difference, but I did it anyway...I did lots of things to those bass bins that are certainly Labor-cost prohibitive for normal production, but everybody who ever heard them always said they were the best sounding LaScalas they ever heard...up to that time...so measurable or not....ego-stroking or not...I still tend to do things MY way if I see a possibility it can make a difference or be an improvement.  Most woodworkers tend to do that too, especially if they are having to completely re-design the assembly to begin with.

[WMcD]

HDRB.  

 

I was very much taken at your "guilt trip" comment 

 

As I see it, you were practicing your art at a high level and lesser men thought it not cost effective.  Criticism for not being sloppy. You should feel guilty for making the extra effort.

I got a comment at work from a nice fellow, and friend, who said of one project coming on line, "Don't make it a work of art."

 

Okay, I understand commercial realities.  But this is my craft and my name goes on it.  

 

We really appreciate your craft.

 

WMcD