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Using REW to Find Parametric Equalizer (PEQ) settings


Chris A

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10 minutes ago, Emile said:

Only unplugged mic and sound from PC

 

Jumping in here at the end so have not read all pages. Sorry if you answered this already. Is it possible you changed the volume on your PC? You are using the computer to make the sound for the sweeps, right? Any chance you upped the volume on the computer and you are making it louder that way not at the pre/amp end of things?

 

Like Chris I try to note the volume setting(s) and put them in the same position each time I sit down for a new session.

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26 minutes ago, rplace said:

Is it possible you changed the volume on your PC? You are using the computer to make the sound for the sweeps, right?

Thanks @rplace :) 

Interesting thought, but 99.9% sure I did NOT change the PC volume :)  (And ... happened twice.) Yes, sound comes from PC output to my preamp aux input.

Cheers, Emile

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18 minutes ago, Emile said:

Interesting thought, but 99.9% sure I did NOT change the PC volume

 

I've done it many times. Might depend on if you have a lap top or a tower. I use a laptop with mini-jack stuck in the computer's headphone out, that on the other end has RCA Left/Right to my preamp. Its not uncommon for me to do something with the laptop's volume and realize my next sweeps won't be where I left off.

 

Another things I've done about a zillion times and forgotten is that I've un-muted the other channel from the one I'm measuring. I'm assuming since you are using an Xillica and working with Chris (same for me on both fronts) is that you set the mic up in front of one speaker and use the Xillica to mute the other....both HF and LF. After a bit of REW/Xilica tweaking I'll unmute to give some music a listen keeping the microphone in place. If you go back to measure and forget to re-mute the non-mic channel you will get higher SPL measurements.

 

It's bee a while so this could be a faulty memory but I seem to remember every time I unplug the USB mic and headphone mini-jack for "sweep noises" REW needs to know the mic file. It also defaults the output for Left or Right or Both to what it wants not what you last had it set to. So if you have the output set to left and are measuring the left speaker and it goes back to Left + Right AND you don't have the right muted you might have a problem. Again that is from memory but I seem to recall that the output was always got-cha problem for me. Check the Left/Right/Both setting and see if it has changed.

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Since I haven't seen how you are connecting to your setup via your computer (output and input), I have to ask...

 

Are you using an analog output from your computer (like a soundcard) or are you using USB or HDMI?

 

If digital, what output driver are you using from your computer (ASIO, Java, etc.)?

 

Are you using a UMIK-1?

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7 minutes ago, Chris A said:

Since I haven't seen how you are connecting to your setup via your computer (output and input), I have to ask...

IBM Thinkpad, headphone out mini-jack with RCA splitter goes to preamp aux in. PC output is the standard Realtek High Definition Audio which I (think) is just analog.

 

Yes; using a UMIK-1. Haha, now set up as per your instructions :) 

 

Thanks, Emile

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34 minutes ago, rplace said:

I've done it many times. Might depend on if you have a lap top or a tower. I use a laptop with mini-jack stuck in the computer's headphone out, that on the other end has RCA Left/Right to my preamp.

Haha ... identical setup. :) 

Preamp goes to Yamaha M-45 amp (120wpc) which drives the JBL horns. Preamp also goes to Kenwood Basic M2A (220wpc) that drive CF-3's.

 

In REW I set the "make a measurement" to LEFT. Haha, have not gotten to RT yet :) 

 

Thanks, Emile

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1 hour ago, Chris A said:

Oh boy....analog out...🤢

Can you connect via a USB to a DAC?

OK; "old school." :)  Do not have an external DAC, but (think) I could connect to my Oppo BDP-83SE. Might need some help with that :( but not sure why we want to go analog to digital to analog.

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17 hours ago, Chris A said:

Do you have an HDMI out from your computer?  That is the preferred method if using an Oppo player.

Yes; do have (mini) HDMI out from laptop and should have a mini to standard connector (haha; "somewhere").. Unfortunately my Oppo (model BDP-83SE) does NOT have an HDMI "IN," only "OUT." :(  Add-on; checked my Oppo BVD-103 and that one DOES have HDMI "in," but really do not feel like switching the units (as they are in enclosed cabinets - taking hours to get in/out).

 Think my dumb problem is due to a "default to standard setup" when I unplug the mic/audio. Will just keep everything "on" and "plugged in" between my initial measurements and subsequent "after" check - and document all settings :( Then I'll unplug and run another test to see if there were any changes. Hope to try it later today.

Many thanks, Emile

 

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I had nothing but problems using analog output from a PC using REW more than a decade ago (version 4.11), i.e., analog output from a sound card.  It actually delayed my use of REW 5-6 years until I got an AVP that had HDMI input (my first AVP only had DVI video inputs and S/PDIF audio inputs).  Once I made the shift to HDMI input from a laptop via HDMI output, all those problems ceased--problems like you're having now.

 

I have to say that some sort of digital output to a DAC, player, or AVP/AVR is highly recommended, even if you have to buy a DAC. DACs with USB inputs can be had for not a lot of money (there are good ones  available at less than $150 USD), and will likely improve your sound quality a little bit if you buy a better quality one.  I'd recommend taking a look at Topping in their lower price ranges if the price is within your budget.  The figure below from Audio Science Review: any DAC not in the "red" group is probably good enough. I've found that it's just not worth the headaches to mess with a PC soundcard.

 

best-usb-dac-png.111627

 

Chris

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2 hours ago, Chris A said:

I had nothing but problems using analog output from a PC using REW

How to switch PC analog audio to USB audio on a laptop?

 

@Chris A Haha, glad I am not the only one :) Yes, looks like some of those Topping ones might work. (And at about $100-150 who cares :) ). But they are all USB input types. Looked at switching my (older) laptop (Lenovo T450) from analog to USB audio out and have not found a way to do it yet. Worked with PC's for about a hundred years, but never with their audio sections. Maybe the PC is too old? (Have newer ones but of course "everything audio" is loaded on my old laptop.)

 

There are also some cheap Chinese HDMI to analog converters on fleaBay ... but guess they are junk.

 

Thanks, Emile

 

Add-on; Looks like most devices are plug and play, maybe needing an additional driver. Never had any USB audio on my laptop, so there never was a dropdown option for it :) 

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27 minutes ago, Emile said:

How to switch PC analog audio to USB audio on a laptop?

 

In the preferences menu, when you connect an external digital device that can handle audio, it shows up in the "Output Device" drop-down menu:

 

image.png.5962859a9ee57dff01993a9f6e1fb195.png

 

Chris

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On 9/8/2021 at 11:18 AM, Chris A said:

nothing but problems using analog output from a PC using REW

OK; reran measurements keeping PC plugged in (1st pic; psycho'd). Averaged them and ran REW to find filters. Input them into my Xilica (4 filters) and results are in pic 2. No clue why I am getting 130db's in the lower freqs, certainly does NOT sound that loud :( Haha; will try another measurement AFTER my laptop was disconnected.

 

Per your recommendations, purchased a DAC. Was going to get a Topping E30, but found a Lavaudio DS600 which has bluetooth ... should be here Saturday and I'll try again :) 

 

Cheers, Emile

0909-3 initial.jpg

0909-adjusted.jpg

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  • 2 months later...
  • 3 months later...

I have read through most of this thread and I am having a problem retuning my K402MEHs for my woofer change. I went from a pair of 4Ohm Kappa 15Cs, to a pair of Celestion ftr-3070Es and the bass response between these woofers and the change from a Yamaha CXA5100 to a Marantz AV8805A are a pretty big difference. What is now happening is the Xilica is clipping on low frequency notes and Chris appears to not be around any more. Can someone please help me?

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4 hours ago, NBPK402 said:

I have read through most of this thread and I am having a problem retuning my K402MEHs for my woofer change. I went from a pair of 4Ohm Kappa 15Cs, to a pair of Celestion ftr-3070Es and the bass response between these woofers and the change from a Yamaha CXA5100 to a Marantz AV8805A are a pretty big difference. What is now happening is the Xilica is clipping on low frequency notes and Chris appears to not be around any more. Can someone please help me?

 

I can't offer specific help with that, but I've done it enough times that it takes an hour or so...no longer days. General rules:

  • Make sure the HF section is muted on Xilica or the amp is off
  • Start with a clean, empty preset in Xilica so there are no PEQs set (this way you have your old ones saved)
  • Level match the LF with amp or Xilica gain controls
  • Set up REW to sweep from 20 to above your XO crossover point probably something like 20-500 to 20-1100
  • iteratively run sweeps and let REW tell you the PEQ values, enter them - try to lower not boost whenever possible. Try to get to +/-5 better yet +/-3
  • If he HF is fine and you have your old sweeps look for a place near the XO spot you want where the phase is close to each other. make that your XO point. Or perhaps a better way find the place the phase is close and let it tell you what the XO point is.
  • Combine HF and LF, take sweeps with REW and repeat the PEQ entering process from REW to Xilica but this time on the input as a whole not the LF output side.
  • Have a beer, listen a bit, repeat sweeps with both fine tuning the PEQs on input side until you are happy
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