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RSVRMAN

Jubilee advice needed.

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53 minutes ago, Deano1974 said:

Hi fella, these are for 2 channel, I'm upgrading from fully active La Scala II's 

 

Dont know Cory I'm sure he is in the U.S I'm in New Zealand 

 

Deano 

You can get Jubilees in 2 Way

 

1 hour ago, Deano1974 said:

KPT-402-MF
KPT-KHJ-LF

That is the way 95% of home users get it. Be sure your dealer specifies that they want the 402-MF with the K-691 driver, if he doesn't say anything it will come with the Std. 1132(I believe].

 

The photo you posted is the 3 way version. Very few have preferred that in a home setting.

 

Travis

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I think they got you most of your answers (???)

 

Here's what the "home" (2-way) version would look like.  As Tom said above, the "HF" horn is dropped and the midrange DRIVER is dropped.  The Tweeter DRIVER is then moved to the "midrange" HORN and off you go.

 

For most people this is already wayyyyyyyyyyyyyyy over kill however, I think I recall at least one, perhaps two people say they preferred the 3-way option as you have it pictured.

 

One nice thing....if you DID get the 3-way version as you pictured, you could try moving the parts around and try it as a 2-way and compare that to the 3-way and come to your own conclusions.

 

I think there is one for sure, possibly two pair in  Australia.  I am trying to recall his name and I'm thinking it was 'RedRocket" and he lived in Sydney.

 

I'd bet you could get an audition if you were ever in that part of the woods.  

 

 

3.JPG

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Thanks guys, all question answered, damn I love this forum

 

You guys are epic 

 

Cheers 

Deano 

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There was a post on just this a while back by a guy from Australia I believe. 

 

  At the end of the day Roy's recommendation to this buyer was get the 1132 for a two way. If you do get this remember to fiddle with aiming your 402's and that will yield big dividends.

 

 

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2 hours ago, Deano1974 said:

KPT-402-MF
KPT-KHJ-LF

Deano,

 

Mine say KPT-402-HF on the tag...not "MF".  If you order K-402-MF, you might wind up getting a K-1133 driver instead of a K-691 (what 80-90% of the guys get on this forum for home use).  It's okay, but the K-1133 doesn't go all the way to 17-20 kHz since it's really a midrange driver.  You'd wind up having to immediately replace the K-1133s (IIRC). 

 

I disagree that the advice that  three-way pro cinema Jubilee is the way to go for home hi-fi.  If you want a three-way, you can go with the K-402-HF and then sell off the K-691s (apparently these are really B&C DE75s with a modified phase plug), then buy a pair of BMS 4592NDs--which have dual ring radiator diaphragms, thus making the Jubilee a three-way (and they sound very, very good, too).

 

I've posted the Xilica settings for the BMS 4592ND on a K-402 horn on this forum. Then you'd have much better three-way Jubilees (IMO) without the issues of a loudspeaker that's too tall for home use, and that loses time alignment when you move from a sitting position to a standing position in a home-sized listening room.

 

JMTC.

 

Chris

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@Deano1974 @Ziggurat is in New Zealand also I believe. I think he got the K1132 (1133?)driver instead of the K691 IIRC

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Thanks guys, my supplier is liaising with Roy, as to the correct configuration for home jubilee, 

 

appreciate all your help, 

 

Cheers

 

Deano 

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1 hour ago, Deano1974 said:

Thanks guys, my supplier is liaising with Roy, as to the correct configuration for home jubilee,

Fantastic - you are going to have the best advice -

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On 7/23/2020 at 6:38 PM, Deano1974 said:

Thanks guys, my supplier is liaising with Roy, as to the correct configuration for home jubilee, 

 

appreciate all your help, 

 

Cheers

 

Deano 

Sooooo did you order them? All 3 👍

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2 minutes ago, RSVRMAN said:

Sooooo did you order them? All 3 👍

klipsch is closed ------

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On 7/23/2020 at 5:44 PM, Dave A said:

There was a post on just this a while back by a guy from Australia I believe. 

 

  At the end of the day Roy's recommendation to this buyer was get the 1132 for a two way. If you do get this remember to fiddle with aiming your 402's and that will yield big dividends.

 

 

I think what the OZ guy said was that based on what Roy told him the differences were between the 2, that @Ziggurat felt the 1132 was going to be best for his listening preferences. Also, IIRC the 402s were going atop non-Jubilee bass bins. 

 

If I also recall, the 1132s already made their way to OZ. 

 

Two way home Jubilee has always come with the K-691 or predecessor. All of Roy's settings are for K-69/K-691 in two way.

 

Just don't want anyone confused home 2-way jibes have a 691.

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So I've been catching up on the forum, been absent for awhile and suddenly I come across this.......

shortened 2.jpg

shortened 4.JPG

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Been waiting on ncores to drop in price and potentially mature for 3 years. As it hasn’t happened, I’m moving on from the d75a.

 

I unplugged the Xilica that hasn’t been shutdown for a year and for some odd reason I lost all presets. I swore I saved the Xdat file, but I can’t find it anywhere. My big mistake that I won’t do again. I haven’t done this in a long while but I was using Roys settings.

 

I set it and let it be, funny as now I’m relearning again. Will be exciting to get the new crowns running. My bass bins have never seen anything more than 25 watts..... now they will have a lot more power. 
 

noise complaints in 3.... 2.... 1 

32748E57-2EF1-4E7F-B7B3-E330950A0F0B.jpeg

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And the journey continues......

 

So tonight I got the 3 crown XLS 1502 installed and up and running to power my LCR Jubilees and it was a bit of a letdown. However, it's probably something I need to do or didn't do. 

 

Random dialog with bits and pieces that will hopefully make a few pennies at the end. 

 

I have low power.... and/or I'm finally going deaf....

 

Where I'm at. I still have the Marantz 7703, it is a pre-pro, not amplified. It is designed for the 1.4V and I believe can max at 2.5V.  Volume goes from 1-98. There does not appear to be a switch, as the RCA is .775 and the XLR is 1.4V. I am using full XLR. This issue is found across the board from access my NAS, Movies, Airplay. 

 

Still using the Xilica, I've rechecked and have the channels at max DB on the presets (mixer column) with the correct PEQ, crossovers etc. I have not touched the GEQ inputs and they are all still at 0. (I did have to reprogram from the beginning a few days ago as I lost all of my settings and presets)

 

All amplifiers are set on the 1.4V. They are set as stereo for each channel and I'm sitting at 75% gain. I have not tried to play music at the .775 setting, however when I switched one over, the compression driver had snakes coming from it that were about 15' long. 

 

Wires all marked correctly triple checked. Nothing changed from before. Full XLR no RCA. Speaker wires standard 12awg. XLR Distances less than 6'. Speaker wire distances do not exceed 25'. 

 

So, I've been using D75a amps for a long time now and still love that little amp, but felt it was time to get a little more power. It seems that the Crown XLS1502 would fill that niche for awhile. I would run the D75a at 50 percent gain and I could get to about 60 on Marantz volume pot before the red lights said to back off. Now this was loud. If I could get 25% more out of these amps Id keep them and be happy, but I want a little more. With the new XLS 1502, it shouldn't even be a contest on how much more power is available. Something just doesn't add up though. I'm sitting at the gain I posted above and at 90 on the volume, it comparable to my previous D75a at 60. Also at that high of gain I have an audible airyness from the compression driver. No hum , but it is noticeable at 6'. At 10' it goes away. I've turned off both the Marantz and the Xilica and unfortunately, there is zero change on the audible airy hiss. This is evident on all 3 amps on all 3 Jubilees. Thankfully my listening position, you cannot hear it. If it was an upstream issue, a cleanbox could solve this and may still be needed if the voltage is the issue. It just seems like when I have them going, it feels like something is holding them back. Much like my first experience where one of my channels wasn't up and I got beamed by a horn. (Oh yes, for those that remember. When I turned the power on everything was turned way down and I was still weak in the knees) I wouldn't call it muffled sound, but it just feels that way. The D75a is not forward, but its just right there. Also has no hiss at all. 

 

There it is. I'm perplexed. But I've come to think it was possibly a setting in the xilica that I forgot to reprogram or that my Marantz couldn't adequately push the full 1.4v to these amps. Which a cleanbox can potentially do. Before I get into trouble I figured I'd post and see what other owners think. Maybe its an outlier I'm just not seeing. I was thinking of bumping up all the GEQ inputs as well, but I'm not sure if that layered approach would be good.  

 

Or am I finally going deaf? 

 

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Stupid question - have you touched two knobs on XLS1502 ?

Matched the volume between amps and preamp?

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46 minutes ago, parlophone1 said:

Stupid question - have you touched two knobs on XLS1502 ?

Matched the volume between amps and preamp?

Not stupid at all. I described that in my notes. They are at 75% as they are the gain controls. 

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If your problem is due to the input sensitivity, then you might find the following information helpful:

 

"Using an oscilloscope is the best method to set input sensitivity. A scope will detect the clipping point of the DSP or amplifier’s outputs when playing a frequency appropriate sine wave (50 Hz for subwoofer amplifiers and 1 kHz for full-range amplifiers).

The needed sine waves can be found on the FiX™ Calibration CD or downloaded from the Audio Files article.

Playing the correct sine wave, slowly adjust the input sensitivity until the sine wave is at it’s largest on the scope's display without showing any clipping. Clipping on an oscilloscope will be detectable by seeing flat spots at the peaks of the sine wave."

 

Taken form https://jlaudio.zendesk.com/hc/en-us/articles/115006392848-What-is-Input-Sensitivity-

 

 

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6 hours ago, RSVRMAN said:

If I could get 25% more out of these amps Id keep them and be happy, but I want a little more. With the new XLS 1502, it shouldn't even be a contest on how much more power is available. Something just doesn't add up though. I'm sitting at the gain I posted above and at 90 on the volume, it comparable to my previous D75a at 60.

This says that the gain of the newer amplifier is about the same as the D75As.  You need more preamp gain to get more out of the XLS amplifiers, apparently (i.e., look at your Marantz pre/pro).  Not all little amplifiers have low gain, and not all higher power amplifiers have higher-than-average gain. 

 

6 hours ago, RSVRMAN said:

Also at that high of gain I have an audible airyness from the compression driver. No hum , but it is noticeable at 6'. At 10' it goes away. I've turned off both the Marantz and the Xilica and unfortunately, there is zero change on the audible airy hiss.

That's the downside of higher power amplifiers, especially those that don't have as low a quiescent noise level (i.e., PA amplifiers typically trade off low noise floors for lower price overall of the amplifiers). I'd horizontally bi-amp your Jubilees with the D-75As on top and the higher power amplifiers on the bottom (bass bins). 

 

6 hours ago, RSVRMAN said:

Thankfully my listening position, you cannot hear it.

Then it is a tradeable characteristic--if if doesn't bother you when listening from farther away.  I'd ask your wife or a child if they can hear the hiss at the listening position.  Male hearing loss (presbycusis) is much more rapid that female, starting at about age 25.  If they can hear the quiescent hiss, then you might have a problem.

 

6 hours ago, RSVRMAN said:

It just seems like when I have them going, it feels like something is holding them back. Much like my first experience where one of my channels wasn't up and I got beamed by a horn. (Oh yes, for those that remember. When I turned the power on everything was turned way down and I was still weak in the knees) I wouldn't call it muffled sound, but it just feels that way. The D75a is not forward, but its just right there. Also has no hiss at all. 

This is in the fine print of amplifier performance.  My guess is that you'll eventually put the XLS amplifier(s) on the bass bins (or sub), and something much lower power and higher hi-fi on the compression drivers, where the performance of amplifiers can be easily distinguished.

 

It could easily be that you've chosen overall gain structures and PEQs that make the situation worse: that's happened to me more than once (or twice).  I would recommend going back to the dialing-in process and use about as much boosting PEQs and attenuating, on both the bass bin channels and the compression driver channels. Think in terms of balancing the boosts and attenuating PEQs to balance each other, but keep the individual PEQ boosts below 10 dB--or below 7 dB if you can.

 

If you need support, shoot me a PM with your Xilica .xdat file attached, and I can compare to others.

 

Chris

 

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9 hours ago, RSVRMAN said:

So, I've been using D75a amps for a long time now and still love that little amp, but felt it was time to get a little more power. It seems that the Crown XLS1502 would fill that niche

 

Have you operated your system with one D75a on a single speaker channel and one XLS1502 on the other speaker channel, for a direct comparison?

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