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Forte III


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6 hours ago, Marvel said:

 

But they are JBL L100s in the photo. You don't see the tape...

 

Bruce

 

Only a audio/speaker nut from the 70s would know that.  Weren't those blue grills the coolest?

 

I was wrong, it wasn't a Martini, it was a glass of wine.  My memory must be failing, or it must be close to Martini Corner in AR. with @CECAA850

 

 

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^^^^My room mate in 1974-76 had those JBLs with glass tops and all. At the time they were called California speakers due to the bass heavy sound. I didn't care for them and I am mortified that I found the guy across the hall's B-901's to sound better.

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8 hours ago, dwilawyer said:

Only a audio/speaker nut from the 70s would know that.  Weren't those blue grills the coolest?

 

I was wrong, it wasn't a Martini, it was a glass of wine.  My memory must be failing, or it must be close to Martini Corner in AR. with @CECAA850

 

 

Yes.  It IS right around the corner.

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10 hours ago, dwilawyer said:

Only a audio/speaker nut from the 70s would know that.  Weren't those blue grills the coolest?

 

I was wrong, it wasn't a Martini, it was a glass of wine.  My memory must be failing, or it must be close to Martini Corner in AR. with @CECAA850

 

 

Heck it DOES state 1983 in the top of the picture! I got particulars wrong too. For the life of me, in the 1980s could you ever have imagined the behavior of some in our USA like lately?

Forget that, F that.

 

My countdown for these Forte IIIs started last week. Can't wait for ANY more info from the Chief and the finalizing of the build. Are the crossovers ok to Roy? The components starting to pile up in Hope? Surely the passive radiator on the back will be a little different than in the CES video. If and when I get an "E" about pre-ordering That trigger will get pressed a tenth of a second later. 

 

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It's only because I have the Pro version of the L100s, the 4311s. Mine are Walnut with original fabric grills. They were not bass heavy at all.

 

I thought the California sound had to do with a rising mid response ad had nothing to do with the bass. Like all speakers, there is a real interaction between all the equipment and the room.

 

The Forte IIIs are beautiful!

Bruce

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On ‎4‎/‎12‎/‎2017 at 11:02 PM, USNRET said:

^^^^My room mate in 1974-76 had those JBLs with glass tops and all. At the time they were called California speakers due to the bass heavy sound. I didn't care for them and I am mortified that I found the guy across the hall's B-901's to sound better.

 

On ‎4‎/‎14‎/‎2017 at 8:34 AM, Marvel said:

It's only because I have the Pro version of the L100s, the 4311s. Mine are Walnut with original fabric grills. They were not bass heavy at all.

 

I thought the California sound had to do with a rising mid response ad had nothing to do with the bass. Like all speakers, there is a real interaction between all the equipment and the room.

 

The Forte IIIs are beautiful!

Bruce

 

 

 

Thanks guys for the short “Wayback Machine” trip, which took me back to the early 1970’s; and just where is it that you have actually gone, Joe DiMaggio?

It has been a really long time since I’ve heard anyone reference “California speaker" or "California sound,” and I’m sure you both know most of the following, since I suspect you both were buying stereo gear in the 1970’s, but it may be of interest to those that were too young, not born yet or just happened to start buying audio gear later in life.

If we consider the time-period USNRET referenced of 1974 - 76 and the “definitions” describing sound of that time-period, it was both that upper midrange peak (L100 had ~ 6dB at 9Khz) and the thumping, more punchy bass, which was different than most any of the retail consumer speaker choices before it (e.g., Acoustic Research acoustic suspension designs or sealed box designs), which actually set the JBL L100 apart and tended to define the “California sound” or “West coast sound” for the general retail consumers. 

It seems that, in general, with technological advances, distribution changes eliminating regional barriers and introducing wide-scale distribution that now includes international brands, marketing changes, life style changes, among other changes have blurred the lines these days where, Jolting Joe has left and gone away.

Generally, in 1970's America, I remember that there tended to be “two main camps” for loudspeaker design and sound characterizations.  While I’ve heard it called Boston-sound and California-sound in relation to the different approaches with certain “high-level design criteria” for loudspeakers, where I grew up in the Northern part of the mid-West, we tended to characterize it more by the very general geographical manufacturing locations of the companies building the speakers and called it the “East coast sound” vs. “West coast sound.” 

Of course, living in the Northern part of the mid-West, in many instances we tried to “spurn” both the East coast and West coast in our decision making process, hence choosing the designs of a certain Southern mid-West manufacturer located in Arkansas that was building Klipsch loudspeakers.

Given the above, the East coast loudspeaker manufacturers tended to be located around the Boston area and used acoustic suspension designs or sealed boxes such as the designs from Acoustic Research, Advent, Allison Acoustics, Boston Acoustics, KLH, etc.  The acoustic suspension designs were harder to drive, needed a lot more amplifier power, and were generally described as having smoother, more neutral, “accurate” sound with deep, clean bass; although even today, I realize that it is not unusual for 15 different people to often define “accurate” or the other sound characteristics in 15 different ways.

The West coast loudspeaker manufacturers, such as JBL, Altec Lansing, Bozak, Cerwin Vega, etc. tended to have the ported enclosures or bass reflex enclosures; and certain models used horns.  At the time, these designs generally were characterized as having higher sensitivity needing less amplifier power, “brighter” sound, and “punchy, thumping bass,” which seemed more suitable to many people for rock n’ roll and jazz music of that period. 

It’s 1974 and you just pick up Aerosmith's new second album, “Get Your Wings,” which just hit the record store shelves.  Drop the needle down on “Train kept a Rollin,” then sit back and take it all in through a pair of JBL L100s.  Who knew at the time, that it could possibly get any better than that?

The internet forums are full of anecdotal correlations and theories regarding the divergence in the West coast designs from the East coast designs.  Some of the more common appear to be related to the requirements and needs of the specific industries served by the West coast manufacturers, for which design goals tended to filter to the retail consumer products, where the commercial requirements were different than the perceived requirements and needs of the retail consumer customers served by the East coast manufacturers.  In addition, for similar reasons related to access, the actual commercial products were more accessible to those on the West coast. 

For example, Altec, JBL, and other West coast manufacturers had been designing for the requirements and needs of companies that did business in the recording industry and the movie film industry, where these commercial companies were also based in similar geographical locations at the time; and while we can see that certain design goals found their way into consumer retail products, there were various barriers at the time for more wide-scale acceptance, merchandising, marketing and distribution.

Some of the anecdotal correlations outline that the East coast manufacturers may have been more consumer retail products focused and more influenced by British designs and similar, smaller living situations in the big cities such as New York, Boston, and Philadelphia, which included much larger concentrations of apartment dwellers where physically smaller speakers were needed for the smaller living spaces.

Anyway, it can be fun to speculate about the reasons, and this little nostalgic trip down “memory lane” back to the early 1970’s has been a fun little diversion, as I procrastinate momentarily with the income tax filing deadlines fast approaching.

 

 

 

large.58f27b6c98968_Mr_Peabody_waybackmachine1972EastCoastSoundvsWestCoastSound.jpg.f567b051e2c57b791420559b2f26542b.jpg

 

 

 

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Thanks for reminding me... :blink:

 

Seriously though, I lived in central Illinois, and got my JBLs through Jerry Milam at Milam Audio in the little town of South Pekin, Ill. He used his Golden Voice Studio to demo equipment and record local talent. Dan Fogelberg, among others, recorded there in the '70s. While he was using Scully 1/2 inch 4track decks when I first went there, the last time I was in his studio he had 2 inch tape MCI machines.

 

Bruce

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Children, children, don't argue about West Coast sound versus New England sound.  Leave it to your elder -- 69 in November -- to point out the real debate prompted by those Maxell ads (the print and TV versions were similar, but not identical) is which cassette tape was the best?

 

Who can forget Memorex?  I know I've tried.  Poor Ella Fitzgerald sold her good name to peddle that junk.  It was my misfortune to briefly fall for their pitch.  The high frequencies recorded on Memorex cassettes disappeared quickly. 

 

image.jpeg

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Maxell, IMO, was superior to Memorex, but still not my tape of choice.  That honor belonged to TDK.  There seemed to be a direct reverse correlation between the amount spent on marketing and the quality of the products.  Memorex, the worst, seemed to spend the most on advertising.  Maxell's ads, although clever, were not as ubiquitous as Memorex, but more than TDK.

 

TDK seemed to spend more on product and less on marketing.  That said, even TDK was not above selling the sizzle over the steak.  In the attached TDK ad it was implied that good music would help one get lucky with the opposite sex.

 

image.jpeg

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13 hours ago, jwc said:

You guys are losing me........  Yall must be in your 50's?

 

Scully pretty much owned the cutting lathe market in the US, until Neumann made headway. In the '60s, Scully came out with a high quality 4-track recorder, with better features than Ampex. When the came out with their 8-track, they were ahead of everyone. The Scully decks had more compact electronics, with better transport controls. They eventually sold to Dictaphone, who moved manufacturing to California. It went downhill from there. Once MCI was bought by Sony, they just couldn't compete in the 16 and 24-track market.

 

Bruce

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