Phil_12345 Posted February 8, 2017 Author Share Posted February 8, 2017 (edited) 5 hours ago, Phil_12345 said: Hi, I must admit that I feel kind of stupid right now - you are absolutely correct !!! During the busy Christmas season and with the excitement of having the new sub, I just simply forgot to calibrate the new sub to the main speakers using receiver test tones - and just simply unplug the old sub, connect this new one and set the grain by ear. Thank you very much. Hi, This evening I did calibrate the speakers & sub. All speaker set to small in avr, xover at 80Hz for all speakers, speaker levels all at 0db. I don't have a sound meter hence did the test and make adjustment by ears. First I adjust that front/center/surround speaker all at same sound level - end up +1db for center speaker because I prefer dialog/voice a bit louder. For the sub, I play some music with grain at 0 and turn the grain adjustment up until the bass just start to fill in - play around 20 different songs and make tiny adjustment to the grain control. At the end, the grain control volume on the sub is still similar to what I had before between 9 and 10 o'clock position - still some chuffing noise but a bit less. Perhaps due to the choice of songs. AVR volume is at -20 db during adjustment (still pretty loud for me), But will try at -10db or 0db preference volume and more extensive testing of music this weekend when no one is home. Edited February 8, 2017 by Phil_12345 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RoboKlipsch Posted February 8, 2017 Share Posted February 8, 2017 A poor SPL meter would probably still help -- it's awful hard to guess what level a subwoofer is at least in my experience. Someone else here may know but I believe a test tone for a subwoofer is at 50hz, but don't quote me on that. I have 3 or 4 apps on my phone that are free SPL meters. With test tones you'll get a much better idea of how to match them all equally. if you don't go this route and just use your ear, my suggestion is this -- play whatever it is that causes the chuffing, and play it really loud. Turn down the sub until the sub is not chuffing. That is likely the "correct" level to set that sub. See if that setting will sound good at the lower volumes and with HT. Don't be concerned about exactly where the gain is, even if it's at 7 8 9 o'clock it's just a matter of getting the input voltage set correctly. A quote from the Audyssey creator: Chris KyriakakisMarch 11, 2012 15:49 Audyssey is setting the levels to the required 75 dB for a –30 dBFS narrowband pink noise (like the internal test signal). Are you sure your SPL meter is calibrated? ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------ (above he is saying, with the test tones in the AVR, the pink noise it creates should read out at 75db on your phone app (preferably a calibrated SPL meter) with the AVR at -30). This is the standard calibration level for home theater. Music does not have calibration standards but typically a HT calibration is a good starting point. You may not be able to calibrate this sub to this level and crank it all the way up, but from my experience you should be able to.... Good luck! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ACV92 Posted February 8, 2017 Share Posted February 8, 2017 If you test your system at -10 db to 0 at the current gain settings you may find the cone of your subwoofer across the room after a few good notes. A little sarcastic but do as RoboKlipsch says and get an SPL meter and a setup disc. I use a simple Radioshack meter mounted to my camera tripod. Here's a link to one, they're invaluable for system setup. http://www.ebay.com/itm/Radio-Shack-33-2050-Sound-Level-Meter-/192096599769 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wvu80 Posted February 8, 2017 Share Posted February 8, 2017 18 hours ago, Phil_12345 said: For the sub, I play some music with gain at 0 and turn the gain adjustment up until the bass just start to fill in - play around 20 different songs and make tiny adjustment to the gain control. Where did the gain end up? I know the technique you are using, and that is essentially what I do as well. After I set the gain manually I re-run Audyssey and let it do its magic to integrate it into the 5.2 mix. I am integrating a 15" DIY sealed sub w/500 wpc into my living room setup and I set the gain at about one quarter. Any more than that I get rumbling boomy bass. I know I am not the sub setup World Champion, but if I can locate sound coming out of the sub, it's too much. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wvu80 Posted February 8, 2017 Share Posted February 8, 2017 14 minutes ago, ACV92 said: I use a simple Radioshack meter mounted to my camera tripod. Here's a link to one, they're invaluable for system setup. There are also SPL meter apps for the various smartphones. I'm sure they aren't perfect but some are free and it would be a quick and easy tool to use if you don't have the Rat Shack meter available. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ACV92 Posted February 8, 2017 Share Posted February 8, 2017 18 hours ago, Phil_12345 said: At the end, the grain control volume on the sub is still similar to what I had before between 9 and 10 o'clock position - still some chuffing noise but a bit less. Perhaps due to the choice of songs. AVR volume is at -20 db during adjustment (still pretty loud for me), But will try at -10db or 0db preference volume and more extensive testing of music this weekend when no one is home. 23 minutes ago, ACV92 said: If you test your system at -10 db to 0 at the current gain settings you may find the cone of your subwoofer across the room after a few good notes. Just saying to make sure he turns the gain down before he dives in. After calibrating, I've always turned my sub out down to -6 or -7 for movies, -2 to -1 for music. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ACV92 Posted February 8, 2017 Share Posted February 8, 2017 22 minutes ago, wvu80 said: I am integrating a 15" DIY sealed sub w/500 wpc into my living room setup and I set the gain at about one quarter. Any more than that I get rumbling boomy bass. Not trying to jump the post here but what DIY kit are you using? I was looking at some ones on Parts Express that looked pretty good as far as I could tell. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wvu80 Posted February 9, 2017 Share Posted February 9, 2017 @ACV92 I had a used Yung SD500 w/boost plate amp in hand and I was trying to keep my budget to $350, so I used the Dayton Audio Reference 15. It's a sealed design (hence the bass boost) and I love it, it's a real chest thumper for music. Be aware the Yung SD models have a high pass filter at 30 Hz so it doesn't go sub-sonic. I would think the Ultimax 15 to be a better value, digs deeper, higher power handling. Since 18 is the new 15, the current best bang-for-buck is a couple of Umax 18's and a $400 Inuke 6000 w/dsp, $1200 total. +++ You might want to consult @Scrappydue as he has several (4 to 8?) of the Umax 18's I believe. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scrappydue Posted February 9, 2017 Share Posted February 9, 2017 1 hour ago, wvu80 said: @ACV92 I had a used Yung SD500 w/boost plate amp in hand and I was trying to keep my budget to $350, so I used the Dayton Audio Reference 15. It's a sealed design (hence the bass boost) and I love it, it's a real chest thumper for music. Be aware the Yung SD models have a high pass filter at 30 Hz so it doesn't go sub-sonic. I would think the Ultimax 15 to be a better value, digs deeper, higher power handling. Since 18 is the new 15, the current best bang-for-buck is a couple of Umax 18's and a $400 Inuke 6000 w/dsp, $1200 total. +++ You might want to consult @Scrappydue as he has several (4 to 8?) of the Umax 18's I believe. i dont run ultimax. i run stereo integrity 18's. 8 of them in sealed boxes. just like the 4cuft flat pack from parts express 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ACV92 Posted February 9, 2017 Share Posted February 9, 2017 You guys, and some others, got the wheels turning. Scrappydue is was looking at your sub thread and that is insanely cool. Looks like a fun project. Really dumb question but I have to ask, when you were nailing the panels together did you nail from the outside/in, or did you angle nail everything on the inside? How did you nail in the sides, or did you? What length brads did you use? The only reason I ask is in thinking of finishing the box I don't necessarily want to fill a bunch of nail holes. Not that it would be that hard. Anyway, thanks in advance. I've got a little more homework to do... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RoboKlipsch Posted February 9, 2017 Share Posted February 9, 2017 12 hours ago, ACV92 said: You guys, and some others, got the wheels turning. Scrappydue is was looking at your sub thread and that is insanely cool. Looks like a fun project. Really dumb question but I have to ask, when you were nailing the panels together did you nail from the outside/in, or did you angle nail everything on the inside? How did you nail in the sides, or did you? What length brads did you use? The only reason I ask is in thinking of finishing the box I don't necessarily want to fill a bunch of nail holes. Not that it would be that hard. Anyway, thanks in advance. I've got a little more homework to do... Start a thread of your own and we would all be happy to help with suggestions. Nails are completely unnecessary building the subs. Wood glue, when applied properly and dried, is stronger than the MDF itself, so once dried, it is as strong as nails, but seals better. The nails are only used by folks when they are looking to put it together really fast, as in a few hours. If you can wait, you'll only need glue and clamps. Technically could be done without clamps but they are cheap ($15-$20 each) and worth it. I recommend getting at least 4 clamps. but if you only do one sub maybe get away with 2, going slow. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jason str Posted February 9, 2017 Share Posted February 9, 2017 You will need either nails or screws to hold the cabinet together until the glue dries, screws can be removed easily once the glue has dried and nails can be countersunk. Either way you will need to fill holes. The other option is to make jigs but not going to work on every joint and more time consuming. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CECAA850 Posted February 9, 2017 Share Posted February 9, 2017 You can always use Kreg pocket screws. They won't leave any marks on the outside but are a little more work. Honestly, filling the holes is no biggie. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jason str Posted February 10, 2017 Share Posted February 10, 2017 Yep, pocket screws will work on some joint types as well. Just get a can of Bondo and use it to fill any holes, gaps, scratches or whatever and block sand smooth. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ACV92 Posted February 10, 2017 Share Posted February 10, 2017 Thanks. I'll jump to new post to continue this. "DIY Sub Questions" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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