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Klipsch vs Cerwin Vega?

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1 st day listening to the CV's....only 1 thing to say "Wow" Mids, highs, and bass are truly impressive. Speakers are well balanced. All you CV haters out there you must take a listen to these superbly sounding speakers prior to judging. These monsters shake the house and my neighbors house to a new level. And they are not even broken in yet....Hate to say it... but these XLS 215's may sound better than my cornwall 3's. Must keep in mind that the Mark Levinsion 532h will make any speaker sound good. I will post more comments in the weeks ahead.

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13 minutes ago, Carey said:

 Must keep in mind that the Mark Levinsion 532h will make any speaker sound good.

 

never heard that before!

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On 4/8/2018 at 8:45 AM, MerkinMuffley said:

 

never heard that before!

MerkinMuffley...are you referring to that you have never listened to ML amplifiers? In any case both speakers have there strengths and weaknesses. Very close battle brewing here between these foundation shakers  :D

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On 4/7/2018 at 6:29 PM, rebuy said:

While they probably are decent speakers, I'd be bothered by the

thin cabinet. The review said they're probably 1/2 inch.

I have a set of entry level Klipsch with cabinets just like this.

For a big speaker--even for mine, the cabinets really need to be thicker

to stop all the resonance from any frequency played through them.

I have another set of large speakers from another major manufacturer 

and the cabinets are much better that on my Klipsch thus the sound is better

especially for controlling unwanted resonance.

If you are going to build a big speaker, don't cheap out on the cabinet.

 

Cabinet is 3/4....cheers

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43 minutes ago, Carey said:

MerkinMuffley...are you referring to that you have never listened to ML amplifiers? In any case both speakers have there strengths and weaknesses. Very close battle brewing here between these foundation shakers  :D

 

I never heard that an amplifier can make any speaker sound good.   Yes, I've heard ML amps back in the 70s and 80s. None since then. 

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A good amplifier should be neutral as in add nothing to the source material other than amplify it.

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7 hours ago, MerkinMuffley said:

 

I never heard that an amplifier can make any speaker sound good.   Yes, I've heard ML amps back in the 70s and 80s. None since then. 

I have had many different amps in the past such as Citation, Rotel RB908bx, Bryston 4B SST, Mcintosh tube Mc275 mark 4, and now final ML :D...I am stating ML is by far one of the best sounding amps I have ever heard. Don't get me wrong.. I love my cornwall 3's. But the CV's for the price are hard to beat. I am using the CV's for 6 hours a day in order to get them broken in properly before the true test starts....Cheers  

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7 hours ago, Frzninvt said:

A good amplifier should be neutral as in add nothing to the source material other than amplify it.

Yes it may be hard for us Klipsch lovers to believe but the CV XLS215 is a great sounding speaker .:emotion-22: 

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8 hours ago, Frzninvt said:

A good amplifier should be neutral as in add nothing to the source material other than amplify it.

You must be referring to a pair of Hypex Nc400's!

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10 hours ago, Frzninvt said:

A good amplifier should be neutral as in add nothing to the source material other than amplify it.

I disagree but then this is what forums are for, disagreements. No system in a home is going to truly replicate a live performance. What we all have is an entertainment system. Making and selling amplifiers is an entertainment endeavor. In theory you are correct, straight wire with gain is what it has been called but that will not make it sound good or entertaining. Nelson Pass of Passlabs and Firstwatt said it best. "All my life I have been designing amplifiers with impressive numbers now with my own companies I make amplifiers that sound good to me and hope enough people will buy them." And from all accounts he has been extremely successful. Jean Hiraga theorized many years ago that the best sounding amplifiers have some 2nd harmonic and a touch of 3rd harmonic. Many say no improvements on his hypothesis have been stated. The fact is there is not a perfect active device that produces sound. If it were the circuit would be just the active device, tube or transistor, and the power supply. Any other component is there to correct some fault of the active part. 

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1 hour ago, ClaudeJ1 said:

You must be referring to a pair of Hypex Nc400's!

Claude I am sure your are correct that the Hypex Nc400's are amazing amplifiers but I would love to see a screenshot of the amplifier on a distortion analyzer. Something like the Arta software works extremely well. I did a screenshot of the Texas Instruments TPA3255 using the Arta software and found an extremely low distortion signal but with just a touch of 2nd harmonic. Not much but a touch. I am going to guess it was intentional by Texas Instruments. Without some 2nd harmonic the sound is very analytical and dry sounding, no soul. I have observed this on some Firstwatt clones that have a pot to adjust the amount of 2nd harmonic. You can null it out or add a little or a lot and I have found the sound is much better with a touch of 2nd harmonic. Without some 2nd harmonic the sound is quicker and maybe more dynamic but just does not possess any "soul". Probably the reason tube amplifiers are still going strong in the market even though there are not the cleanest form of amplification. 

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I bought my trusted CV 380 SE's in 1991 and I've travelled with them through 12 moves and used them indoors, outdoors, on the back of pickups, from rooftops, in the rain and generally abused them in almost every way that a speaker could be abused.  In fact, I installed cut-off bolts in the rear where the fuses used to go because I was tired of blowing fuses when I was rocking along.  That was 27 years ago.  They have always been powered by a Hafler XL600 (I had to replace the fuses with screws in the amplifier too), and have consistently produced a well balanced sound for me.  That being said, in a side-by-side, my La Scalas are more accurate and do produce more bass.  Not sure how the La Scalas sound from a rooftop or a beach on Spring Break because those days have temporarily passed, but I'm glad to read this discussion on the XLS 215's because I thought that CV had been relegated to mediocre and was comfortable in that space.  

 

I'd love to hear your XLS 215's, and I promise if you loan them to me for a week or two ... I won't replace the fuses with screws.  promise.  ;-)

 

moriceman

CV2.jpg

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On 4/8/2018 at 9:28 AM, Carey said:

1 st day listening to the CV's....only 1 thing to say "Wow" Mids, highs, and bass are truly impressive. Speakers are well balanced. All you CV haters out there you must take a listen to these superbly sounding speakers prior to judging. These monsters shake the house and my neighbors house to a new level. And they are not even broken in yet....Hate to say it... but these XLS 215's may sound better than my cornwall 3's. Must keep in mind that the Mark Levinsion 532h will make any speaker sound good. I will post more comments in the weeks ahead.

I am sure they are respectable speakers but your opinion may change after a few weeks of listening with them and then comparing them to your Cornwall's. A lot of time a new product can be so different sounding than what one is use to that at first you are very impressed maybe because it is just different. Not bashing your CV's I have an old 3 way pair myself and they do sound decent. But horns are what turn me on. Cleaner, more detail and more dynamic. 

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26 minutes ago, wdecho said:

I disagree but then this is what forums are for, disagreements. No system in a home is going to truly replicate a live performance. What we all have is an entertainment system. Making and selling amplifiers is an entertainment endeavor. In theory you are correct, straight wire with gain is what it has been called but that will not make it sound good or entertaining. Nelson Pass of Passlabs and Firstwatt said it best. "All my life I have been designing amplifiers with impressive numbers now with my own companies I make amplifiers that sound good to me and hope enough people will buy them." And from all accounts he has been extremely successful. Jean Hiraga theorized many years ago that the best sounding amplifiers have some 2nd harmonic and a touch of 3rd harmonic. Many say no improvements on his hypothesis have been stated. The fact is there is not a perfect active device that produces sound. If it were the circuit would be just the active device, tube or transistor, and the power supply. Any other component is there to correct some fault of the active part. 

 

I like what NP states in his brochures/manuals on his products -

---- "we build products with excessive output stages, huge heat sinks and massive power supplies. We use the highest quality components in simple linear topologies ----". "They measure well and sound great. They are heavy, reliable and expensive". 

I read an article where he was describing his views on Class A, tubes and Class D. He remarked that Class D was not and will not be where he has focused his expertise and said he thought those in the development of Class D have done a good job taking a technology that requires "massive amounts" of negative feedback to the circuit into a good sounding product. 

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21 minutes ago, moriceman said:

I bought my trusted CV 380 SE's in 1991 and I've travelled with them through 12 moves and used them indoors, outdoors, on the back of pickups, from rooftops, in the rain and generally abused them in almost every way that a speaker could be abused.  In fact, I installed cut-off bolts in the rear where the fuses used to go because I was tired of blowing fuses when I was rocking along.  That was 27 years ago.  They have always been powered by a Hafler XL600 (I had to replace the fuses with screws in the amplifier too), and have consistently produced a well balanced sound for me.  That being said, in a side-by-side, my La Scalas are more accurate and do produce more bass.  Not sure how the La Scalas sound from a rooftop or a beach on Spring Break because those days have temporarily passed, but I'm glad to read this discussion on the XLS 215's because I thought that CV had been relegated to mediocre and was comfortable in that space.  

 

I'd love to hear your XLS 215's, and I promise if you loan them to me for a week or two ... I won't replace the fuses with screws.  promise.  ;-)

 

moriceman

Might be a bit of a road trip for you to come borrow them. I am in Western Canada :o....No fuses blown yet....that's okay I bought a big box of spare fuses when I picked up the speakers :D

I never heard the CV series but I listened to the D9's and AT15's and have fond memories of those bad boys...wow that was a long time ago...getting old lol

  • Haha 1

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29 minutes ago, wdecho said:

I am sure they are respectable speakers but your opinion may change after a few weeks of listening with them and then comparing them to your Cornwall's. A lot of time a new product can be so different sounding than what one is use to that at first you are very impressed maybe because it is just different. Not bashing your CV's I have an old 3 way pair myself and they do sound decent. But horns are what turn me on. Cleaner, more detail and more dynamic. 

They are definitely a different sound from what I am used to. Been a klipsch guy for 25 years. First pair of klipsch's were a pair of epic cf4's back in 1994, then heresy 2's, then a pair of mid 70's lascalas and now the cornwall 3's. Love the horns as well...going to crank the %$#$% out of the CV's in an effort to get them broken in. Then an accurate comparison can be made.

 

Cheers

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I still have a pair of Infinity SM150 that won out in a head to head audition back in 88 with the AT-15 or DC-9. The CV were good rocking speakers but the Infinity were more detailed.

 

I have always felt that if you are looking at blasting out a party disc in the yard CV are great speakers, I just have not yet heard a CV speaker that seems clear and detailed. Regardless, I am glad you like them. After all, you are the one that needs to be happy with them!

 

That video posted on page one of this thread is pretty much my memory of CV speakers. Loud, deep bass and sort of muddy mids and highs. Maybe they have done something recently that would surprise me in that department but going from memory each time I have listened to CV for any duration of time they come across as loud and muffled. I would like to hear the new 215's just to get up to speed on them.

 

 

Tim

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10 hours ago, Carey said:

Yes it may be hard for us Klipsch lovers to believe but the CV XLS215 is a great sounding speaker .:emotion-22: 

I never said I didn't like CV speakers.  I absolutely do.  I had a pair D-8's in the late 80's and thought they were great, but I did end up replacing them with Klipsch Forte's in 1988.  I also had a pair of CV HED U12's as well.  They also made the best 6x9 speaker for cars ever in the late 70's through the late 80's with the CS line, the CS-18A's were amazing.

CV D-8.jpg

CV CS-18A Back.jpg

CV CS-18A Front.jpg

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