Some basic Scott 299C Questions

[derrickdj1]

I have the RF 7 II's and my tube amp is usually under 2 or 3 watts for my normal listening level.  The 2 ch system does not use a sub. No problem with bass heavy music.  I sit around 18 ft. from the speakers.  Jim brought his 22 watts Ampsound tube amp to my gtg last Oct. and it was plenty loud for everyone.

[robert_kc]

In an average size room, listening at reasonable sound levels, 20wpc of tube power is ample for the RF-7II.   You can see in my post above the list of tube amps that I use with my RF-7II.   Even my 8wpc Inspire “Fire Bottle” SE Stereo Tube Amplifier delivers satisfying volume levels.

 

OTOH, I have no experience with huge rooms, or listening at “ear-bleed” levels.

[tube fanatic]

There's no need to speculate about power needs in a given system.  It can be measured fairly accurately in less than 2 minutes with a cheap multimeter: 

 

 https://community.klipsch.com/index.php?/topic/170414-who-wants-to-measure-how-much-power-voltage-is-really-needed/

 

 

Maynard

[NOSValves]

Severe cosmetic flaws can not be easily, inexpensively and in many cases fixed at all... I've rebuilt thousands of vintages pieces and rarely have to replace controls and switches to achieve great results.....

[ksquared]

On 10/4/2017 at 8:05 PM, tube fanatic said:

 

Now can we get back to the OP's question and help him to choose an appropriate tube amp?

 

 

Maynard 

 

Actually, everybody has helped a huge amount!  And I appreciate the patience and information from everybody, it did factor into my decision.  Hopefully I did OK.

 

First, it was interesting from dirtmudd about the calculations of the Scott amps in today's dollars, I hadn't really thought about that aspect.

 

There was another problem I kept thinking about, and that is how so many of the tube amps are <10 watts, some even at 2 watts.  I saw the thread from Maynard:  https://community.klipsch.com/index.php?/topic/170414-who-wants-to-measure-how-much-power-voltage-is-really-needed/&

Now, of course, I don't understand 95% of it, but derrickdj1's comment too, "I have the RF 7 II's and my tube amp is usually under 2 or 3 watts for my normal listening level."  Also, and of course I don't understand it, some say watts from a tube amp are more efficient at actually driving the speaker than the solid state amp.  And many are saying that the first watt is the most important.  So I did finally accept that I didn't need 100 or more wpc, especially with the efficient Klipsch speakers.  The weird thing though is I thought somewhere somebody had said if the speaker is underpowered it could be damaged, so maybe somebody could clarify that at some point.

 

And, the debate about older but rebuilt vs. new with the warranty was also factored in.  In the end, it is interesting that but for a few seconds, I might have ended up with that 299C which was several decades old, but restored.

 

So it turned out that I found a used Decware SE34I.5 (Rachael model) within the price range and bought that.  Before I got it he let me listen to it with his system, and it sounded excellent.  Of course, I'm thinking the rest of his setup didn't hurt, as he had everything top of the line and in perfect condition.  I'm not sure about the brand of speakers, but they're supposed to be mighty expensive ones.  He turned out to be a great guy too, either he took pity on a non-expert like me, or he's just happy to help everybody.  One of the factors too is that Decware gives a lifetime warranty, although I'll have to pay a bit to transfer it to me, which I'm waiting on until it becomes necessary.  The guy I bought it from said he didn't worry about any warranty, since the quality was so spectacular.

 

So I hope I made a good choice, I hope I didn't pay too much, and I hope it will last a mighty long time.

 

[muel]

21 hours ago, ksquared said:

 

Actually, everybody has helped a huge amount!  And I appreciate the patience and information from everybody, it did factor into my decision.  Hopefully I did OK.

 

First, it was interesting from dirtmudd about the calculations of the Scott amps in today's dollars, I hadn't really thought about that aspect.

 

There was another problem I kept thinking about, and that is how so many of the tube amps are <10 watts, some even at 2 watts.  I saw the thread from Maynard:  https://community.klipsch.com/index.php?/topic/170414-who-wants-to-measure-how-much-power-voltage-is-really-needed/&

Now, of course, I don't understand 95% of it, but derrickdj1's comment too, "I have the RF 7 II's and my tube amp is usually under 2 or 3 watts for my normal listening level."  Also, and of course I don't understand it, some say watts from a tube amp are more efficient at actually driving the speaker than the solid state amp.  And many are saying that the first watt is the most important.  So I did finally accept that I didn't need 100 or more wpc, especially with the efficient Klipsch speakers.  The weird thing though is I thought somewhere somebody had said if the speaker is underpowered it could be damaged, so maybe somebody could clarify that at some point.

 

And, the debate about older but rebuilt vs. new with the warranty was also factored in.  In the end, it is interesting that but for a few seconds, I might have ended up with that 299C which was several decades old, but restored.

 

So it turned out that I found a used Decware SE34I.5 (Rachael model) within the price range and bought that.  Before I got it he let me listen to it with his system, and it sounded excellent.  Of course, I'm thinking the rest of his setup didn't hurt, as he had everything top of the line and in perfect condition.  I'm not sure about the brand of speakers, but they're supposed to be mighty expensive ones.  He turned out to be a great guy too, either he took pity on a non-expert like me, or he's just happy to help everybody.  One of the factors too is that Decware gives a lifetime warranty, although I'll have to pay a bit to transfer it to me, which I'm waiting on until it becomes necessary.  The guy I bought it from said he didn't worry about any warranty, since the quality was so spectacular.

 

So I hope I made a good choice, I hope I didn't pay too much, and I hope it will last a mighty long time.

 

 

That is a sharp amplifier... pictures are required here!

 

Have fun!

[SWL]

A few years ago myself and a couple of audio buddies went down to Steve's place in Peoria, IL. He was having a whole weekend long shindig showing off his stuff.

 

We were really impressed. I'd like to get one of his amps someday. I can't remember what he all did as far as speakers and subs but they were impressive as well.....as was his shop and listening rooms. Nice guy.

 

 

Sent from my SM-G920R4 using Tapatalk

 

 

 

 

[jvs1670]

On 10/18/2017 at 5:51 PM, ksquared said:

 

Actually, everybody has helped a huge amount!  And I appreciate the patience and information from everybody, it did factor into my decision.  Hopefully I did OK.

 

First, it was interesting from dirtmudd about the calculations of the Scott amps in today's dollars, I hadn't really thought about that aspect.

 

There was another problem I kept thinking about, and that is how so many of the tube amps are <10 watts, some even at 2 watts.  I saw the thread from Maynard:  https://community.klipsch.com/index.php?/topic/170414-who-wants-to-measure-how-much-power-voltage-is-really-needed/&

Now, of course, I don't understand 95% of it, but derrickdj1's comment too, "I have the RF 7 II's and my tube amp is usually under 2 or 3 watts for my normal listening level."  Also, and of course I don't understand it, some say watts from a tube amp are more efficient at actually driving the speaker than the solid state amp.  And many are saying that the first watt is the most important.  So I did finally accept that I didn't need 100 or more wpc, especially with the efficient Klipsch speakers.  The weird thing though is I thought somewhere somebody had said if the speaker is underpowered it could be damaged, so maybe somebody could clarify that at some point.

 

And, the debate about older but rebuilt vs. new with the warranty was also factored in.  In the end, it is interesting that but for a few seconds, I might have ended up with that 299C which was several decades old, but restored.

 

So it turned out that I found a used Decware SE34I.5 (Rachael model) within the price range and bought that.  Before I got it he let me listen to it with his system, and it sounded excellent.  Of course, I'm thinking the rest of his setup didn't hurt, as he had everything top of the line and in perfect condition.  I'm not sure about the brand of speakers, but they're supposed to be mighty expensive ones.  He turned out to be a great guy too, either he took pity on a non-expert like me, or he's just happy to help everybody.  One of the factors too is that Decware gives a lifetime warranty, although I'll have to pay a bit to transfer it to me, which I'm waiting on until it becomes necessary.  The guy I bought it from said he didn't worry about any warranty, since the quality was so spectacular.

 

So I hope I made a good choice, I hope I didn't pay too much, and I hope it will last a mighty long time.

 

I was looking at this exact model today, new they are about $1500 and he offers some customizing for not much more money.   I'm curious how you are liking the amp.   I'd be using mine to power my Khorns or Lascalas.   I'm unsure if I'll get the bottom end I love with so few watts.  What are your latest thoughts?

 

[P38-SHLD]

I just came into a Scott 799c and 333 gold stereomaster set of components and have some questions about how to clean, test, and possibly have them restored. I'm a complete novice when it comes to tubes and although I'm anxious to clean them up and test to see if I would like to keep and use them in my system, I don't want to damage them in the process. Any tips on what to use to clean the surfaces including handling the tubes, etc. I want to remove dust, fingerprints, foriegn substances, but not damage the gold tint, lettering, or surfaces. Also, any tips on testing with a meter or using some protection before powering up.

 

I hope to drive some very efficient 1990 vintage klipsch speakers if I can do it safely.

 

Thanks in advance for the helpfull advice. 

[captainbeefheart]

14 hours ago, P38-SHLD said:

I just came into a Scott 799c and 333 gold stereomaster set of components and have some questions about how to clean, test, and possibly have them restored. I'm a complete novice when it comes to tubes and although I'm anxious to clean them up and test to see if I would like to keep and use them in my system, I don't want to damage them in the process. Any tips on what to use to clean the surfaces including handling the tubes, etc. I want to remove dust, fingerprints, foriegn substances, but not damage the gold tint, lettering, or surfaces. Also, any tips on testing with a meter or using some protection before powering up.

 

I hope to drive some very efficient 1990 vintage klipsch speakers if I can do it safely.

 

Thanks in advance for the helpfull advice. 

 

I'm guessing you mean a 299c? Does it have 7591 power tubes?

 

If it hasn't been powered up in a while then I advise bringing it up slowly on a variac. I go a step further and remove the loads from each power supply node and current limit the capacitors with a series resistor in series with rectifier. I find it easiest to just remove the wire from the rectifier going to the cap can. Then I use a DC meter in series to power the cans while monitoring current. Once you get them up to rated voltage slowly I monitor leakage current. If it's above a specific amount I move onto finding which one is suspect and replace it. It's usually the one right after the rectifier as that sees the most ripple current. I'd say from the Scott if you have less than 1mA of DC leakage current for all the caps combined then it's fine to move forward. The point is to slowly reform the capacitors back into healthy operation. If it's been running in the last year then forget all of this.

 

The best way is to clean is to remove everything and send the chassis off to a have it cleaned in an ultrasonic bath. I'm not crazy picky and I find just a damp rag is adequate to clean. If it's really dirty dawn dish soap and a soft bristle brush, scrub in local areas then wipe dry with damp cloth. For corroded rusty parts of the chassis I use Naval Jelly, let sit for 15 minutes and rinse clean, I use a spray bottle of waterto squirt at the problem area then wipe off with towel. Do not use that stuff on decorative faceplates or on silk screened print. Only meant for the steel chassis where you have rust.

 

I believe the 299c uses a Selenium rectifier for the 150mA filament string and power tube bias supply. Replace with Silicon diodes, you'll most likely need to add some series resistance to get it down to -40v due to the lower forward voltage drop of Silicon. There is a string of RC filters to clean up the negative supply and drop the voltage down, all resistors are 18 ohms, try replacing the first one with 30 ohms I believe is the right value to get the desired drop back to normal. The 333 may also have a Selenium rectifier for it's B+, if so remove and replace with Silicon. Don't worry too . much about the voltage when switching over here, it's high voltage and a few extra volts is fine. With the 299c the filaments get powered by the negative supply and so it needs to be accurate. Too high a voltage for filaments will shorten the life substantially.

 

Great amp! Enjoy!!

 

 

[P38-SHLD]

Thanks captain for the kind and helpfull response. It is in fact a 299c model with 7591 power tubes. It will be a while before I can get to it, but will share some results when I'm able.

[DirtyErnie]

I'm not a huge fan of using the online inflation calculators to figure historical prices, different methods of calculating inflation have happened depending on political whims.  Usually (ignoring random market parabolic curves, finding the baselines) precious metals prices are a bit more insightful.

1959 Scott 299 = $199 
Silver in 1959 = .90/oz.  = 221oz
221oz at this morning's spot price of $19.90 = $4,400

 

Gold, $35/oz in 1959 = 5.69oz. = $9,550, but gold wasn't allowed to follow the market at the time, while the dollar began inflating.  Let's just go back to silver.  ~$4,500 doesn't seem too out of line for a hand-built, point-to-point wired vacuum tube stereo integrated hi-fi.   The vintage Scott and Fischer et.al integrated amps are a steal, even after having them professionally rebuilt.

End tangent, thank you for playing.