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Klipschorn Update Opinion Requested


rickriley

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5 minutes ago, babadono said:

So the KHorns will be flanking the "screen" in the middle room? Not in the "studio"? Just curious. 

 

Correct. The studio is done. Khorns are not appropriate for 'producing' sound. Steve Miller tried that once at Kaye-Smith studios, one of my former employers. Found they were mixing forever as the Khorns were colored in their own way, as the should be, and extremely critical. Khorns are for listening, not producing. Khorns will be on either side of the projection screen, whatever that turns out to be.

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6 minutes ago, babadono said:

 You are blessed. In many ways. A wife that makes her own wool, Wow.

 

You are correct in that, and thank you! I met her when I did an afternoon radio talk show on WIOD, Miami, the station that broadcast the Miami Dolphins. I would have players as guests throughout the season, but once a year on the season opener, we'd take the show on the road to the stadium. It was then that we'd talk to a number of guests involved with the game, including a couple of the cheerleaders from the new squad. One year, she was one of them. That was 25 years ago. 

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3 hours ago, rickriley said:

To say that craft room has a lot of unused space may just get you an unsolicited phone call in order to reassess your opinion. Or as she says, ‘Would you please call him and give him a piece of my mind’. So bottom line, there will be NO unused space and that wall will not move an inch in any direction that would cause that space to diminish.

OMG that is hilarious!  :lol:  Your wife sounds like a lovely, lovely woman. 

 

The daughters too, and of course Dumpling, Rose, Peabody and the 60+ chickens.  Remember, I'm from West Virginia so we know all about having critters in the house.

 

So, hows about taking out that second wall so she and the sheep can better enjoy those Khorns?  :D

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"is there an update issued since 1989 that would be worth the cost and effort for my new application? "


We have established that these are stock K-Horns with AK-3 crossovers, metal K400 horn and K77 tweeters in a medium sized room with perfect corners about 17 feet apart and you "listen to all kinds of music, vary rarely do I listen to anything that's not forefront in its volume.  In the past my neighbors have been able to identify the artist." You have also indicated that you do not want to go too hi-tech with active crossovers and room equalization, which leaves two areas for enhancing - the drivers and the crossovers.


What follows is a personal opinion based on extensive reading of this forum and personal experience.


Driver upgrade.
The squaker and tweeter are the only drivers that people upgrade. The decision to be made is "Am I happy to change the woodwork in the top hat ?"
If the answer is Yes, then the elliptical midrange horns and tweeters are the way to go, see http://www.fastlaneaudio.com/eliptrac.html .
If you don't want to rebuild the top hat, then bolt in replacement drivers can spruce things up, see http://www.critesspeakers.com/. (I went with Bob Crites CT120 tweeters and A-55G mids).

 

Crossovers.
For your room size and listening levels, I recommend an Extreme Slope network from ALK Engineering - http://www.alkeng.com/klipsch . Better soundstage, more precise positioning of instruments and clearer sound.

 

While you are cogitating all this, plug them there K-Horns in, crank 'em up and enjoy some music !

 

Addendum: Al Klappenberger of ALK Engineering is banned from posting on these forums so I posted my upgrade story here https://www.stereo.net.au/forums/topic/118361-k-horn-crossovers-from-ak-3-to-universal-to-es/ , Al responded and was polite, courteous and most helpful.

 

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9 hours ago, John Albright said:

I like your design and I did similarly in a basement I finished.  Can you straighten the angled wall with the craft room?  You'll get fewer standing waves in the "listening" portion of the room.  A K-horn only needs 4 feet from the corner, go 6 for over-kill. 

 

I heard an AK-4 K-horn in Indy several years ago.  I was impressed.  Since I have La Scalas, I paid more attention to the AL-4 La Scala.  It sounded good and that crossover is similar the the AK-4.  Now I believe they are up to an AK-5 and sadly I know little about it.  The big differences between the older crossovers and the -4/-5 variants is the crossover slopes are steeper in the new ones, but there is a difference in the eq.   

 

I love AK4.

 

I was told [by Klipsch] that the difference between AK4 and AK5 is that AK5 was changed slightly to be appropriate with the newer, both vertical and horizontal wall seal.  That could be an important point; the network probably should match the drivers, mid horn, and wall seal you use.  I used pipe insulation as a vertical/horizontal wall seal, with instructions from Klipsch.  Klipsch told me that a single resistor change would convert AK4 into AK5, but I stayed with AK4 because I heard the change cut the bass a bit, and LarryC, who I heard has a good ear,  converted to the 5 and then went back to the 4.  The change may be fairly subtle.

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On 10/22/2017 at 10:31 PM, garyrc said:

I believe the big changes in the AK4 /AK5 upgrades of the Klipschorns c2004 were much steeper crossover slopes.  I have the AK4s, and think they sound great. 

 

Do you have the non-metalic (fiberglass-like) midrange horn (of 1987)?  And I presume your tweeters are front mounted (a 1983 change).  Those are the other two major changes, I believe. 

There may be a small EQ change or two, such as removing two peaks between 100 and 200 Hz.

 

 

I very much agree with your views of the AK-4/5, and front-mounting the tweeters if yours don't have that change.

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13 hours ago, Wirrunna said:

"is there an update issued since 1989 that would be worth the cost and effort for my new application? "...


...What follows is a personal opinion based on extensive reading of this forum and personal experience.

 

 

 

Great information. I will spend some time reading the links and digesting it. Thank you very much!!!

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11 hours ago, Marvel said:

 

Do you happen to know Larry Crane at Jackpot Recording?

 

Hi Bruce,

 

I do not. I believe they cater to musicians and I do voiceover.  With my new digs I never have the need to do anything outside my studio.  Before, on occasion, I used to work with Whitehorse here in Portland, but they're gone now. 

 

Tell you what though, if you know Larry, tell him he needs to have someone besides himself narrate the introduction on the website for his studio. Not necessarly, me, but someone other than him. A lot of my work is with the NFL. I've been the commercial / documentary voice for the Minnesota Vikings for the last seven years, narrate features for NFL Films and also do work for the Oakland Raiders as well as numerous college teams. Don't know if it will play, but I've attached a demo.

NFLPromo_RickRiley.mp3

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I only know him through the magazine he publishes, which is TapeOp, but I have a lot of respect for him because of his attitude and attention to all the little details that go into running a studio.

 

I'm curious what your setup is for your voice overs. I spent about 10 uears in TV news as a photographer, when 16mm film still ruled the day, but did jingle work on the side.

 

Bruce

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5 hours ago, Marvel said:

I'm curious what your setup is for your voice overs. I spent about 10 uears in TV news as a photographer, when 16mm film still ruled the day, but did jingle work on the side.

 

Bruce

 

Basically the same thing as a music studio but on smaller scale. Don't need as many tracks or as much room.  I use Pro Tools software. Outside of the hardware, everything is digital and with ISDN, I can be recorded in other studios from my studio as well, so if they want to produce off site, my voice can be there even if I can't. 

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Oh, ISDN.. I remember that. I was so happy to get cable as the ISDN was pretty slow. I haven't switched yet, but we can get gigabit fiber to the house here, provided by our local power utility. Comcast fought them putting it in, but it got approval. Anyone can also get 10G to there home through them if they want to pay (about $300 a month).

 

I mostly record for my own amusement, and have an ADAT sitting idle. I use a couple of different DAWs, but working a full time job doesn't leave me much time and I'm getting lazy in my old age.

Anyway, the Khorns should sound great in that space. Please share more pics when you get them in place.

 

Bruce

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10 minutes ago, Marvel said:

Oh, ISDN.. I remember that. I was so happy to get cable as the ISDN was pretty slow.

 

It remains the industry standard and is rock solid for Voice Recording from one studio to another. While 'digitally' it's slow, with two ISDN lines and an ISDN Codec, like the Telos Xstream that I use, voice is transmitted at 128k MP3 and is crystal clear. For internet, I have Comcast Cable with about 125 mb down. 

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