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Forte III listening fatigue


Speedy6963

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^^^^^

And when will those beauties be pulled apart?!

Nice - Tannoy? The ginormous Westminsters have intrigued me but at $40-50K I just email intrigued. 

So how do you like these? I had Zu Audio at one time and while the construction is nothing in comparison it gave me a sample of single drivers. 

Sold the F3??

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On 12/14/2017 at 6:18 AM, Skelt said:

I'm surprised the chief lets that schematic stay up. I thought that would be proprietary info.

You might be right and I could certainly understand if Klipsch wanted to keep that info confidential.  From my admittedly ignorant position, I don't see what difference it would make if it were public or not.  Those values in that combination would only work on that particular sized box, with those particular drivers.

 

Just a thought.

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I need to correct my post regarding the Tannoy and my previous Zu as being "single driver". The Zu were a 1.5 with a 10 inch wind bander coupled with a ribbon tweet. The Tannoy are also a 1.5 / 2 way in a concentric, single speaker design. I also owned a concentric 1.5 by Rhrapsody using a hi-end Radian driver(s). Sorry to thread crap ---

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4 minutes ago, richieb said:

I need to correct my post regarding the Tannoy and my previous Zu as being "single driver". The Zu were a 1.5 with a 10 inch wide bander coupled with a ribbon tweet. The Tannoy are also a 1.5 / 2 way in a concentric, single speaker design. I also owned a concentric 1.5 by Rhrapsody using a hi-end Radian driver(s).

 

Sorry to thread crap ---

"...and I don't have listening fatigue..."

 

There.  Fixed it for you. B)

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On 11/25/2017 at 1:03 PM, wvu80 said:

That sound you hear is more likely the sound of @Chief bonehead's head exploding as people continue to think they can improve on his brand-new design.  :lol:

I'm pretty sure the Chief is too busy making "bigger stuff" to worry about Forte III's which, I suspect are done by other Klipsch Engineers...........just sayin', don't assume either way.

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It's part of that Klipsch sound to keep things overly bright....

 

While you're at it, why not drop the HF altogether? And replace the MF with a full range compression driver and just go 2-way instead? Might need active xovers to pull this off properly though. Maybe if you're lucky you could do a passive shelf filter to compensate for the constant directivity rolloff?

 

I'm also a huge fan of Tannoy - although don't crank it up too loud, or the highs get modulated by the cone movement, which is not a very pleasant sound at all.

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30 minutes ago, CECAA850 said:

I was under the impression that these were his babies, especially with the mump horns.

He resides in Hope, where they build the Pro Stuff, not in Indy, where other Engineers develop products. While he's responsible for the "mumps" in the Pro Tweeter horn, the K510, it may be that other horns gained this feature as well, using his technique, but not by his hand directly. But that doesn't necessarily mean it's his complete design on the Forte III. There are other Engineers who primarily make the consumer products, as well as the Palladium line, which is built in Hope, but designed in Indy. I don't know for sure either.

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3 hours ago, CECAA850 said:

I was under the impression that these were his babies, especially with the mump horns.

I'm pretty sure you are correct.  I believe EDIT Kerry Geist  in Indy is in charge of coming up with Heritage products to bring back or do Anniversary/Special Editions,   He was responsible for the idea of a Forte III and he tapped Roy to do it.  I believe Roy was main person on HIII.  

 

He's always cookin' up sometime.

 

Maybe @Chief bonehead will find time to clarify it.

 

Carl @CECAA850, you got.his 396's right?  He said the voicing/sound was very similar on the two.

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On 11/24/2017 at 6:57 PM, garyrc said:

 

 

Welcome Speedy!

 

It seems to me that we are talking about two things that may be different. 

 

First, the graph you presented.  Compared to the response around 4 K, the curve about 8K can be described as about 4 to 5 dB elevated.  Compared to the response at about 2.5K,  the extreme highs are only about 1 to 3 dB elevated.  Further questions are what is the floating central tendency of the whole graph, 20 to 20K, or, what is the curve like relative to the conventional 1 K point. 

 

Second, what caused it to sound bright and fatiguing?  Merely elevated high frequencies?  Or high frequency distortion earlier in the chain revealed by the Forte III, that would be veiled by most speakers?  Or a lack of balance that makes the sound harsh?

 

IMO, psycho-acoustically, whether a speaker sounds like it has a hot tweeter or not may depend on the level of the bass.   The so called Harman Curve (humorously referred to as "The Curve"),  preferred by most listeners in Harman's trials, has about a 9 dB, smooth, downward slope from the highest in the  bass (@~~ 20 Hz) to the lowest in the treble (@~~ 20K hz).  My preferred house curve has the bass about like that, with the midrange  lower (almost flat), and the treble flat.

 

It may not be a coincidence the Harman folk have found that people like the downward facing dog curve and that Chris and others have found that there is a pre-emphasis above 1K Hz and attenuation below about 200 Hz in many commercial recordings(!

 

See J. Gordon Holt's article "Down with Flat" in the Stereophile archives.

I think the data and articles support your opinion that the bass has a significant impact on how people perceive the high end in the mix.

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16 minutes ago, dwilawyer said:

I'm pretty sure you are correct.  I believe Rob Stanley is Indy is in charge of coming up with Heritage products to bring back or do Anniversary/Special editions and he tapped Roy on FIII.  I believe Roy was main person on HIII.  

 

He's always cookin' up sometime.

 

Maybe @Chief bonehead will find time to clarify it.

 

Carl @CECAA850, you got.his 396's right?  He said the voicing/sound was very similar on the two.

Yes, I have the 396's and feel that the voicing is similar as well.  Odd when you consider the configuration of the 2 different speakers.

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