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Steve(412)

Proper RF-7ii power

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First time posting, so apologies for mistakes or poor posting etiquette.

 

I purchased the RF-7ii speakers and matching RF-64 ii center channel a few months back, it was my first time "investing" in speakers.  I'm always owned klipsch speakers; towers, bookshelf, computer, earpods, etc. 

 

My current set-up is a sony STR-DN1070 AVR pushing about 165 watts per channel.  The RF's are bi-amped. 

 

I've been very happy with the sound and clarity of my set-up, I have a smaller apartment currently, and purchased the RF's to force me to buy a house...  :) 

 

With that said, would adding an Outlaw 5000 amp to the set-up make any difference?  I understand that adding an amp to anything will make it sound better, but is it a noticeable difference?  If so, could you share your experience?  The 5000 is currently $599.00 and from the reviews that I've read, it is a great amp for the money.

 

Thank you in advance for taking the time to read this.

 

Steve

 

 

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how are the speakers bi-amped with an AVR... are you using two zones to bi-amp? or do you mean bi-wire?

 

on a personal note, I do think there are gains to be had by going pre-out to a stand alone amplifier(s)...

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They are Bi-apmed.  I read that you can get greater sound using that method, but have also read that it doesn't really make that much of a difference.

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Again, I've also heard the same about adding an amp, and that I wouldn't benefit from the addition of the 5000.   The RF's are by far the best sounding speaker that i have ever heard/owned, I guess I want to see how if there is anything that I could do to make them even better. 

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Welcome to the forum Steve!

 

5 minutes ago, Steve(412) said:

I have a smaller apartment currently, and purchased the RF's to force me to buy a house...  :)

Now that's commitment right there.  LOL

 

6 minutes ago, Steve(412) said:

With that said, would adding an Outlaw 5000 amp to the set-up make any difference?  I understand that adding an amp to anything will make it sound better, but is it a noticeable difference?  If so, could you share your experience?  The 5000 is currently $599.00 and from the reviews that I've read, it is a great amp for the money.

I agree with Shu.  In my limited experience with amps, I previously had RF-83 / RC-64 which are in the same category as the RF-7 II.  Adding a Parasound HCA-2205a (220 x 5) amp added more bottom end (even at low volume), better separation of musical instruments and more headroom which allowed me to really crank them up without any distortion.  The amp developed a hum so I bought a B&K 200.7 (200 x 7) and was then given a Sherbourn 7/2100a (200 x 7) amp.  I did some A/B comparison in a 2ch setup between the three amps before selling any of them and did not hear an audible difference between the amps.

 

My overall conclusion for home theater is it did make a difference, however it was not a Night and Day difference.  I just wasn't like "Holy cow...what have I been missing all this time" kind of difference.  Hope that helps.

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3 minutes ago, Steve(412) said:

They are Bi-apmed.  I read that you can get greater sound using that method, but have also read that it doesn't really make that much of a difference.

I tried that once using the unused height channels (I believe that were the channels) and inside the receiver tell it that you are biamping and did not hear any difference at all.  Just ended up being more cables.  From what I've read over the years, the only benefit with biamp is if you can bypass the internal crossover and go with an active crossover which from what I hear is a bit complicated.

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Thanks Youthman.  Funny thing is that I haven't come close to full volume and I know the RF's will take anything that I throw at it.  BTW, Impressive list of audio equipment. 

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I can't answer your question but I had a similar one. I have rp-280's with a Denon x4400h 125 watts per channel bi-amped and I feel like it sounds great. So really same question do I need another amp...?

"Bi-amp not wired. Using rear channel and main channel amplifiers to drive your speaker."

Funny how you catch the bug and eventful it sounds great... Can it sounds better!


Sent from my SM-N950U1 using Tapatalk

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I don't bi-amp so can't speak to that.

 

I do have a Outlaw 5000, with a Yamaha 3070 AVR.  Whether the 3070 or the Outlaw is powering the RF-7II, I can't really tell a difference.  I know in theory, especially since I'm running multiple channels, there is more headroom with the Outlaw.  To be fair, for multi channel movie use, I have everything crossed at 80hz.

 

I think to possibly hear a  difference, you'd have to get a higher end, higher power amp.

 

As an experiment in the office with my Forte II, I bridged my NAD C372 and C272, to have 2 monoblock amps with something like 300-400watts per channel.  It's hard for me to describe the difference but it is tangible (before I was powering the Forte II with just the C372 which I believe is 150wpc normally).  Granted at lower volume settings, there shouldn't much if any difference right?  I mean, it takes the same amount of watts to achieve the same SPL so what gives?  Why am I hearing a difference?  It sounds more substantial, and just "better" to my ears even at low volumes.  I don't get it.  Maybe it's psychosomatic? 

 

I'd like to feed the RF-7II much more power, and listen to them in 2 channel only and see if I have the same experience.  I'll get around to it :D  

 

I wish it was a bit easier to A/B this, but it takes time to re-wire.

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I've fed my RF-7 IIs power from a few different amps/receivers and haven't heard any AVRs that can compete with the sound of separate amps. I've tested with a few different AVRs (Yamaha, Onkyo, and 2 different Pioneer Elite receivers) as well as testing bi-amping on them (couldn't tell any difference). Once I borrowed a friend's B&K 200.2 and tested them with the 7s, I never even gave another thought to having an AVR power them. I'm using an Emotiva XPR-2 to power the pair (600wpc) and XPA-5s (200wpc) powering the other 9 speakers in the theater and they definitely love the power and headroom. I definitely agree with Michael that they added more high and low end throughout. I don't regret spending the money on the separates at all. Hopefully that helps, let me know if you have any questions for me!

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Steve,

 

Welcome to the forum.

 

4 hours ago, Steve(412) said:

First time posting, so apologies for mistakes or poor posting etiquette.

No apologies needed.

 

4 hours ago, Steve(412) said:

I purchased the RF-7ii speakers and matching RF-64 ii center channel a few months back, it was my first time "investing" in speakers.  I'm always owned klipsch speakers; towers, bookshelf, computer, earpods, etc. 

Very nice speakers.

 

4 hours ago, Steve(412) said:

My current set-up is a sony STR-DN1070 AVR pushing about 165 watts per channel. 

From my research, your Sony is spec'd at 100w/channel with 2 channels driven at 8ohms.

 

4 hours ago, Steve(412) said:

The RF's are bi-amped

Well, not much improvement if any.

 

4 hours ago, Steve(412) said:

With that said, would adding an Outlaw 5000 amp to the set-up make any difference?

I would say definitely but your Sony AVR does not have stereo or multichannel preouts in zone 1.  Now if your AVR was a flagship model, it would not be a huge noticeable difference.

 

4 hours ago, Steve(412) said:

I understand that adding an amp to anything will make it sound better, but is it a noticeable difference?  If so, could you share your experience? 

From my experience, yes adding an amp/amps extracted much of what my RF-63 system can obtain in it's large room.  More punch, presence, detail, soundstage, and unstrained effortless headroom.

 

4 hours ago, Steve(412) said:

The 5000 is currently $599.00 and from the reviews that I've read, it is a great amp for the money.

A ton of bang for the buck.  Better amps than whats in 98%(just speculation) of AVRs you can buy or in the past.

 

 

 

Bill

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I bought an Acurus 100x3 around 1994/1995 to use with a top of the line Sony ES receiver to power KG 5.5's and a KLF-C7. I assigned the front L/R amps to surrounds and otherwise never used the receiver alone. It sits in my rack unused for the last 15 years or so.

 

Then I bought a Denon 3801 and an Acurus 125x5 which I still occasionally use today. I've never used the amps in the Denon receiver. I've grown tired of the bickering and varied opinions about audio to add further but my advice to you would be to buy a used Acurus 200x3 for your front channels. Try to buy from someone like me that rarely uses their equipment and from someone that you can trust, if someone fitting that description stills exists these days. Your speakers need and can handle the power and you will hear a difference and have plenty of headroom.

 

BTW, if you would put your home State in your profile somewhere you would probably get more help from the good members here. For example, if you lived close to me and could pick it up, I would loan you an amplifier.

 

Good luck to you.

 

Keith

 

 

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Two amps = 2x distortion + 2x noise. Keep in mind that most modern amps, in particular solid state, actually have higher distortion at their lowest power output levels. And that's the power output region where high efficiency speakers (like Klipsch) will have the amplifier operating most of the time. Yes, there are situations where there are advantages to bi or tri amping but generally speaking it's worth the extra money and effort.

 

The recording itself, and the room (acoustics) (even listening position) have a much greater effect. So until those are all as good as it gets...........................:P

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I notice no difference at all using a stand alone amp over an avr while watching a movie.  My 7ii's are crossed at 80hz and my subs take the bass load.  It sounds great with either.

 

Where I do find the power benefits is when I am listening full range, no subs, in 2 channel music.  It is so clean and clear it begs you to keep turning the dial clockwise.

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